Number One Receiver vs Two Tight End Sets

[carpanfan96]

I think Troy Niklas is a perfect fit here in carolina. He's one of the bigger TE's,a good blocker and is better then asj with the ball in his hands. I have him as the second best TE in the draft and he's tr most traditional TE in the draft as well. Playing mostly inline.

[carpanfan96]

Niklas doesn't stand out to me.

Idk how, he's clearly a better blocker and his stats are better then pretty much everyone but Ebron. His Yac is higher then Asj, higher catch average, ran deeper routes... I could go on... At 6-7 270, he's basically a tackle playing TE.

Oh I forgot to mention he has Hall of Fame bloodlines and is related to Bruce Matthews.

He has to stand out if you think ASJ and Amaro stand out. Either that or it's a one man TE draft with Ebron.

[panthers55]

With Olsen being our best TE/WR, I don't think the expectation will be for a WR to come in and be the number 1.  With 2 TE sets I think that we won't need a guy to get 1000 yards particularly if both guys can catch the ball.  After all how many catches will there be for everyone.  Last year we had 29 pass attempts a game.  If we target the TEs 12 times and the running backs 6 or 7 it really gives us 10 attempts a game for the wide receivers.  Now if we don't go to a 2 TE set and use 1 TE and 1 RB with 3 wides or even no back and 4 wides it puts more pressure on the wides to make plays.  It would seem easier to excel as a rookie TE than it would be a rookie WR.    

[Gabeking]

Lyerla is a massive idiot but we had Shockey before (for one season). Regardless, wherever he lands, he has potential to be Graham 2.0. I just hope if we don't get him that he doesn't end up getting drafted into our division.

Shockey was an asshole but he wasn't a literal crackhead (and he saved Ben Hartsock's life FWIW)

[carpanfan96]

More yardage doesn't equal better. That's like saying Te'o is a great LB just because he got more interceptions than Luke. Niklas plays for Notre Dame. All of their prospects appear impressive until they square off against the bigger competition.

You say look at his stats, okay. I watched him play good defenses in Michigan State and Stanford and he was nowhere to be seen. I didn't watch much of him after that. Thus why he's not being viewed as a Top 3 TE in all circles. Stats and size are nice but... again... he played for Notre Dame. Like they warn for soccer jerseys, careful while measuring because you're gonna end up with a medium instead of a large.

You wouldn't have seen him make many catches against most teams, ND used him mostly has an inline blocker. He didn't have a ton of opportunities to catch the ball. He was asked to dominate the LOS for ND. He can catch though and is extremely aggressive. He caught 2-3, passes in most games.

He's basically a LT who plays TE, but has the speed to stretch the defense an attack the seem. Helps the team run 2 TE sets and helps the tackles on the team with blocking. It's a win-win-win situation.

[carpanfan96]

Shockey was an asshole AND an idiot. Ask any Giant fan.

By the time he got here, he wasn't as stupid and quite tamer attitude wise compared to his Giants days.

[iamhubby1]

Don't get me wrong, I LOVE double TE sets...  I just think that unless Ebron falls, which ain't happening, we're gonna go into the season with what we have at TE, and could sincerely see us waiting a while to address WR...  Not saying I agree with it (really would just have to wait and see how the pieces fall on draft weekend), but drafting where we do, it's plausible to see us waiting to hit the WR position in the early-middle rounds...

With where we draft, 28. It is almost like not having a 1st rounder. Go straight to the head of round 2 line.

Not sure looking at it that way helps? But, to me it makes taking that 2nd round LT at 28, instead of him going, say 40ish, more palpable. The price we pay to keep the fugging fans happy? Picking the left overs at the end of each round.

I don't ask for much. All I want is a LT that can take the position. Maybe one of those flashy WR I keep hearing, and hearing about would be nice. If 3 of the 3-4 top rookie contributors are on the offensive side of the ball? I can live with that.

 

 

I think signing Ed Dickson was a fantastic move by Gettleman, provided we use him properly. If he can give us 50 catces or so, that takes a big load off our receivers.

Now, I still think we need to draft a receiver or sign a #2 guy. I don't think Cotchery or Avant can be our one-two punch - we need another guy ahead of them.

I agree totally. If Dickson is getting nearly 50 catches, our Offense is working. IMO, Olsen is the main TE target. If Dickson is getting targets, its in the secondary looks. Play action 3rd option, Pass Protections breaks down and he slips out, use him and find out what he does well. Then maybe, your know, run some plays that he loves. Keep the kid happy. If this kid is happy, we all happy. The better he do, the better the team do.

I am a firm believer that we should be competitive again this year. As is. Now get some talent in the draft. That could be the reason we over achieve this year.

And one last thought. It is not just running the 2TE sets. It is using it properly. Or, at least successfully. It is THE ONLY formation that can scare a Defense. 4 Rec., and a RB is difficult enough. Throw in the 2TEs and you have matchup problems. You don't have to be great. You have to be efficient. If the D knows you can execute, they have to plan to beat you.

If you want balance? Nothing screams "I gots this" like the 2 TE set. I can help in the run, oh, and I can help in the passing game. Versatility. That's me. Your fugging TE. Put me in coach, I think I can help.

Want to throw 8, maybe 9 towards the box? We have the personnel to adapt. (Although a disclaimer is warranted, I will refrain from going there.) Our Oline is 7 deep. Where are you going? You can't bring 9, cuz you know, what if?, Zod forbid, one of our WR beats his man? So you can only bring 8. Under a 4-5 WR set, that could cause some havoc. Under a 2TE set? Not so much.

Want to sit back, play a 2 deep zone, make us be methodical, then hope they all work. We have 7 blockers on any given play. The possibility of a run should seem eminent. If we can run, to set up everything else. We win. If you stop the run, and make us adapt. We have been winning so we must be doing something right. Even if I can't see it.

Tops down. Errands to run. So I guess I will too.

[Mojo]

It doesn't have to be one or the other.  Hopefully with the draft it'll give us the versatility to utilize both when necessary.  Dickson is going to help, but the more guys the defense has to account for the better.

 

Good thing for us is we'll see zone alot because of Cam.  Veteran receivers like Cotchery and Avant are great at quickly finding the holes in the zones.

 

If we can draft a stud I'm excited, but this is all contingent on the Oline being improved.

 

Just my 2

[rayzor]

more protection and more weapons for cam.

 

i don't care if the weapons include WR or TE as long as it gives cam a good and reliable target whow can do some serious damage to the opposing D.

[TANTRIC-NINJA]

Don't be shocked when (if) the Panthers draft looks like 1-CB, 2-OT, 3-WR, 4-LB, 5-OL, 6-WR, 7-DB

If that third rd WR is a Latimer id be good with it especially if the CB is Dennard...less so if it is Verrett, who is probally the best cb skill wise but the 5'9 frame just is not a good matchup in the NFC South. But we do need a good Nickel who can play the outside so.....

Id think unless a Cyrus K is there in the second we would go WR and OL in the third.

[beastson]

New England was running it successfully until Hernandez scandal and Gronk's injury. 

 

Right, but also Gronk is sufficient enough. What they're saying in NE now is get Tom some receivers. 1 800+ TE and 1 1,000 receiver > 2 TE. This is the model of success for the NFL

[Woodie]

What we need to remember, particularly as a fanbase, is that RARELY does a rookie come in (regardless of where they are selected or how high their expectation) and step in as a #1 receiver...  The absolute worst thing we as a fanbase can do is to set unrealistic expectations on a kid coming in, and pressure him to be Smith's replacement...  It's unlikely to happen in the first year, and if we collectively add unneeded pressure, the results on that kid's psyche could very well be more than he's able to overcome in the long run...  We have to remember to keep our expectations grounded, and give the kid time to grow into the NFL...  Let the kid drop a pass here and there...  Let the kid go 2 or 3 games with no catches while he adjusts...  Just let the kid be a rookie...  And, IMHO, THAT is why we brought in mentors and released Smith (who we know from experience is not a great mentor)...

 

I think a lot of fans and media are too hung up with the notion of having a true #1 right out of the gate.  However, the thing is that we don't need a receiver to come in and be our #1.  We just need someone that is legit enough as a receiving threat to force defenses to pay attention and spread the field.  That, along with improved run blocking, will do wonders to improve our offensive efficiency.   

[Woodie]

Don't be shocked when (if) the Panthers draft looks like 1-CB, 2-OT, 3-WR, 4-LB, 5-OL, 6-WR, 7-DB

 

I think the only way we go CB before either WR or OL is if all viable options for 28 at those positions are gone, and I just don't see that as a possibility.  Especially with Kouandjio's knee problems apparently proving to be a false alarm and Moses, and possibly Bitonio, being a legitimate 1st round option.  Not to mention Robinson and Latimer putting their names in the hat for the 1st round according to many.  I just don't see any way 7 OT's and 7-8 WR's will be taken before our pick. 

 

And Rivera and McDermott have proven their defense works with mediocre CB's behind our front seven.  More than likely, I think we will look for a CB in the 3rd or 4th round, then look to next year to focus on CB.  So my guess is we go 1st - OT, 2nd - WR, 3rd - WR/OT, 4th - CB, 5th - 7th BPA between DE, WR/OT, S, OLB, and possibly QB.  

 

[Woodie]

Also, I don't see any way TE is an option this year.  Now that we signed Dixon and McNeil, it's just not a need.  But we do need at least depth in many other spots.