Jerry Angelo (former Bears GM) ranks the league's QBs, Cam comes in at #4

[heel31ok]

You are using a great defense this season as a knock against cam. It's your choice but just realize that it makes you sound like a troll because I'm sure you wouldn't use the same argument as a knock against russell wilson and kaepernick. Both of them are qb's that got carried by their team's defense. Russel Wilson's last 7-8 games offensively have been very underwhelming compared to his number 1 defense but I'm sure fans of the seattle fanbase aren't using the defense as a knock against their qb which you seem to be doing against cam. He got the job done when needed in the regular season and so did cam. Get Cam more weapons and as he continues to improve he will do even better. There is no reason to point out the defense as some sort of derision of what cam did in a thread about other gm's being high on what cam has done and what he can do in the future.  

not at all, I am using a great defense this season as praise for a great defense this season.Again if someone thinks that is trolling then they have a problem with another person having a different  or opposing opinion. rW and CK have nothing to do with what I posted and were not factors in the posts.The fact the D was the major reason for our success is not derisive towards Cam. I think denying it is derisive against the D.We can all play that game.

 I am sure Can will improve as he is surrounded with more weapons but that doesn't change what the D did and I am sure Cam would be one of the first to give the D their props for what they did. Pointing out the D was just doing the same as Cam would do. Just becaus some here are sensitive about Cam doesn't change the facts about the D. i said nothing derisive about what Cam could do in the future I merely aknowledged what the D did in the present. Credit where credit is due.

[micnificent28]

you're kidding yourself into thinking I said that. physically gifted sure but that isn't what carried this team. He was physically gifted last year and the year before but we had no D. What has changed? it was a team effort in general but there is no way you cannot give the credit to the D as the major contributor to the improvement this year. They carried this team above anyone else.

Yes i agree the defense has a big part into us going 12-4. Your right in your thinking of that. But that doesn't change the way he has developed into making less mistakes and throwing less ints while also still remaining effective as a the biggest threat we have on offense. You can't just take cam out of the equation like your doing,NO other QB is asked to do as much for his team as Cam Newton. Thats what makes him one of a kind. Take payton manning away from the broncos still a good team. take russell from the seahawks still a good team and so on. Take cam from our offense the rushing goes down the 3rd down conversions go down. The total touchdowns period would drop off greatly. As Gettleman and so many others have said as Cam Newton goes so goes the panthers. This kid was in MVP conversations at the midway point up until the end of the season. You can't just say he has nothing to do with it. 

[heel31ok]

Cam is a part of why the team got better not just the d but the team as a whole starting from the new GM to Rivera growing some balls, Cam's yardage drop could have happen for alot of reasons......a new OC, Guys like Ginn and lafell dropping balls, steve smith and olsen not being the only guys getting open,ect. The D was as good as it was because the Offense had big time consuming drives in which cam converted alot of 3rd downs to keep the drive going.

 

in all the d did not carry the team,nor the offense they mesh with each other throughout the season.

 

but to say the d carried the team is very very absent mind

The D was as good as it was because of the Players on D.I mean you can cite some indirect factors from the Offense but the overwhelming factor was the D itself not the offense.The O was as good as it was because the D shut people down and gave the O more opportunities.

 since 2011 the O and D have basically changed places in their ranking and in looking at those trends it is obvious the D is the major factor and the side of the ball carrying this team. the points allowed gives us the best view as we went from a -23 pt differential in 2011 to a 125 diff in 2013.  I know it gets tedious with the facts but  trhey are there and they tell the story of a dominant D that carried this team.

[Jangler]

not at all, I am using a great defense this season as praise for a great defense this season.Again if someone thinks that is trolling then they have a problem with another person having a different  or opposing opinion. rW and CK have nothing to do with what I posted and were not factors in the posts.The fact the D was the major reason for our success is not derisive towards Cam. I think denying it is derisive against the D.We can all play that game.

 I am sure Can will improve as he is surrounded with more weapons but that doesn't change what the D did and I am sure Cam would be one of the first to give the D their props for what they did. Pointing out the D was just doing the same as Cam would do. Just becaus some here are sensitive about Cam doesn't change the facts about the D. i said nothing derisive about what Cam could do in the future I merely aknowledged what the D did in the present. Credit where credit is due.

 

It's not about being sensitive about Cam. But you have to ask as it was pointed out, if Clausen was still the QB, no way we win 12 games even with  the second rated defense. So then the question becomes about the poster and his feelings towards Cam. 

[332nd]

the fact he needs help also speaks to the "irreplaceable" question.

... Watch any Patriot games this year?

[Cpt slay a ho]

The D was as good as it was because of the Players on D.I mean you can cite some indirect factors from the Offense but the overwhelming factor was the D itself not the offense.The O was as good as it was because the D shut people down and gave the O more opportunities.

 since 2011 the O and D have basically changed places in their ranking and in looking at those trends it is obvious the D is the major factor and the side of the ball carrying this team. the points allowed gives us the best view as we went from a -23 pt differential in 2011 to a 125 diff in 2013.  I know it gets tedious with the facts but  trhey are there and they tell the story of a dominant D that carried this team.

 

And the D was as good as they were because of the offense, and the reason the ranking changed because of a new OC.......the d was ranked 10th i believe and we still went 7-9...............it's not just the d it's the team that got us to 12-4, stats can prove alot but that's a stat you can't deny

 

the d did not carry this team to 12-4............

 

[heel31ok]

Yes i agree the defense has a big part into us going 12-4. Your right in your thinking of that. But that doesn't change the way he has developed into making less mistakes and throwing less ints while also still remaining effective as a the biggest threat we have on offense. You can't just take cam out of the equation like your doing,NO other QB is asked to do as much for his team as Cam Newton. Thats what makes him one of a kind. Take payton manning away from the broncos still a good team. take russell from the seahawks still a good team and so on. Take cam from our offense the rushing goes down the 3rd down conversions go down. The total touchdowns period would drop off greatly. As Gettleman and so many others have said as Cam Newton goes so goes the panthers. This kid was in MVP conversations at the midway point up until the end of the season. You can't just say he has nothing to do with it. 

 I never said anything about Cams mistakes or taking him out of the equation. They are all in the equation but the biggest part of the equation for our success is this season is the D. It doesn't matter how much he is asked to do. The D was still miles ahead this season.It is a strawman argument to to say " you can't say he has nothing to do with it." if you want to respond to what I said that would be fine. I am glad he was in MVP conversations that doesn't change what the D did. Gettlemans confidence in Cam is great but still doesn't change what the D did.

 taking Cam out of the offense is speculation . what the D did is fact. cam did a great job and is improving but the fact remains the D was the backbone and carried the team this season. No shame in that for anyone on the team.

[ajax4132]

 I never said anything about Cams mistakes or taking him out of the equation. They are all in the equation but the biggest part of the equation for our success is this season is the D. It doesn't matter how much he is asked to do. The D was still miles ahead this season.It is a strawman argument to to say " you can't say he has nothing to do with it." if you want to respond to what I said that would be fine. I am glad he was in MVP conversations that doesn't change what the D did. Gettlemans confidence in Cam is great but still doesn't change what the D did.

 taking Cam out of the offense is speculation . what the D did is fact. cam did a great job and is improving but the fact remains the D was the backbone and carried the team this season. No shame in that for anyone on the team.

You put any qb besides rodgers on this team we don't even make the playoffs...

 

1. No consistency in our run game

2. Wr corps non existent besides #89

[heel31ok]

And the D was as good as they were because of the offense, and the reason the ranking changed because of a new OC.......the d was ranked 10th i believe and we still went 7-9...............it's not just the d it's the team that got us to 12-4, stats can prove alot but that's a stat you can't deny

 

the d did not carry this team to 12-4............

The stats point directly to the D.so why would I want to deny the facts? -The d went to 4 overall while the O did not improve so which changed and which stayed the same.if the D did not improve we may have gone 7-9 again.Now your point would be made if we had a better record before the D improved.Stat wise the O has gone backwards and the D has gone forward. So yes you cannot deny the stats.

[IGSaint]

not at all, I am using a great defense this season as praise for a great defense this season.Again if someone thinks that is trolling then they have a problem with another person having a different  or opposing opinion. rW and CK have nothing to do with what I posted and were not factors in the posts.The fact the D was the major reason for our success is not derisive towards Cam. I think denying it is derisive against the D.We can all play that game.

 I am sure Can will improve as he is surrounded with more weapons but that doesn't change what the D did and I am sure Cam would be one of the first to give the D their props for what they did. Pointing out the D was just doing the same as Cam would do. Just becaus some here are sensitive about Cam doesn't change the facts about the D. i said nothing derisive about what Cam could do in the future I merely aknowledged what the D did in the present. Credit where credit is due.

 

Yeah ok all of us panther fans know how much the defense was the reason we were able to get the post season. But this thread is not about the defense. It's about a gm opinion of the best qb's in the league. If someone goes brings up the defense in a thread about the qb it's meant to take away from what that qb accomplished. Next time just stick to what cam did this season without bringing up the defense if it's a thread about just cam. 

[ajax4132]

The stas point directly to the D.so why would I want to deny the facts? -The d went to 4 overall while the O did not improve so which changed and which stayed the same.if the D did not improve we may have gone 7-9 again.Now your point would be made if we had a better record before the D improved.Stat wise the O has gone backwards and the D has gone forward. So yes you cannot deny the stats.

Cam was the offense

 

When teams gameplan our offense its game planning how to stop Cam Newton

[MedellinHeel]

I love Cam, but lets be real. He is not better than Brees or Rivers. Then you could also argue Wilson and Luck. 

 

Hell Froles had a 64% completion and threw 27 Tds with only 2 ints. That is great numbers. 

 

 

[heel31ok]

You put any qb besides rodgers on this team we don't even make the playoffs...

 

1. No consistency in our run game

2. Wr corps non existent besides #89

speculation doesn't chage what the D did. Go back to 2012 and we don't make the playoffs with that D. what has changed? the D and the record.as the D goes so go the Panthers.

[heel31ok]

Yeah ok all of us panther fans know how much the defense was the reason we were able to get the post season. But this thread is not about the defense. It's about a gm opinion of the best qb's in the league. If someone goes brings up the defense in a thread about the qb it's meant to take away from what that qb accomplished. Next time just stick to what cam did this season without bringing up the defense if it's a thread about just cam. 

 No in fact the poster is the only one who determines what the comment is meant to be . It doesn't take away one thing cam accomplished.The comment was a response to a comment by the former GM. That is in the context of the thread.