would you sacrifice...

[csx]

That would put the Panthers as the second leading scoring team by a far margin over the 3rd team. That isn't a simple trade off.

[Semaj]

25% of our current defensive production to increase our offensive production by 50% next year? this is a legit question in terms of letting some key players walk and bringing in some as well. it is very realistic we could lose 2-3 of our defensive vets but if this makes us capable of coming back offensively, extending plays, producing the fullness of our run game game, I say  before the draft. 

Yes I believe I would.  Whatever gives us the best chance to win the Super Bowl and not just finish as one of the top 2 defenses inthe league.  I mean top 2 sounds good, but where did that get us?  Just to the divisional round and then we were promptly eliminated.  I think that with more balance we could still have a really good defense and also have an offense that can take over games from time to time and potentially win the Super Bowl.  

[frash.exe]

Right. It's a nobrainer. People need to realize too that our offense actually scoring enough points to allow our defensive line to pin their ears back and pass rush will probably help our defense more than any one player on D will. Our oline held the Niners Dline in check pretty well until they got 2 scores up on us, then it got real ugly, real quick. Our Defense got to do that when we were putting 30 on the board. Being unable to score even 21 pts a game consistently will get us bounced out early every year.

Not to mention at the offensive scoring rate we'd be producing that difference would probably amount to garbage time production by the other team

In other words, who cares if the other team drives down to the end zone with four minutes left if you're already up by 28 points? If the game was closer they wouldn't have a chance to go anywhere.

[Historynerd67]

Man this is going to be a gut wrenching off-season. Myth or not, it is painful to mess with this defense. It is a passing league, no doubt but our ability to pressure quarterbacks from all directions and put them under duress (in most games) from all angles made our defensive backs look probably better than they were and took the passing game away from the other team. Case in point, 1st quarter and most of the 2nd of the San Fran game, our pass rush was effective and Kapernick was throwing the ball all over the place. I hate to mess with that. Is the o-line really so bad that we need help there that desperately this off-season?  With injured players getting healthy and a couple of linemen as late round picks, could we improve or maintain the stays quo. on the o-line and take a receiver 1st round and make this work? Perhaps by maintaining this pass rush (lets face it, keeping the Kraken) we might not have to do much with the d backfield either. Reading the "keep Hardy" or "not keep Hardy" and all of the salary cap posts has me more confused than ever. I guess at the end of the day, you have to ask what percentage of effectiveness we lose on defense by letting him walk. A dominant defense certainly gave us a HUGE edge this year. 

[Mr. Scot]

I thought this thread would be about a live chicken.

 

 

 

[cbully]

I expect most of the young guys back.  They are cheap and they are cheap.  Norman will be cut because we don't really need him and I don't think Rivera is very high on him.  We can probably find his replacement in an undrafted free agent (white and lester are decent examples).  Really it's up to the scouting dept to find the best talent/fit for this team.  The young guys will have a year under their belt, so hopefully they will only get better.  You can't forget at one time we had what, 6 rookies starting/playing large roles?  

yes... norman and thomas can be dismissed... captain can be upgraded

[CatMan72]

Interesting question, but I'm not sure we have to give up one to get the other. 

 

People are concerned about our cap situation, but keep in mind we started 16 mil over the cap last year and ended up 12 mil under while keeping everyone we wanted to keep and bring in a few key FA's. 

 

Not sure I would give up 25% of our defense because at the end of the day defense still wins championships. 

[frash.exe]

Listen I don't want to go all schrute facts on some of you guys but winning games is a lot more complicated than your basic "defense wins titles" or any of your other synchronized football commandment philosophies that were passed down to you and millions of others by a bill parcells press conference

[Navy_football]

Given the scenario you offer - I don't think so. 25% decline in this defense for a 50% increase in this offense would depend on the team they're playing. We still would have lost against SF last week if you're looking at the final score only. But, if you look at it by stats, and the cascading effects, then yes without a doubt.

 

But, let's take it a step further. Let's look at this by position, rather than by total units. I'd take a 25% drop in DE/DT play, for a 50% increase in OT/OG play on this team.

 

The loss to the defense would likely equate to an extra TD/FG per game, 3 or 4 fewer QB pressures/sacks/hits per game, 25 additional rushing yards against per game, and a loss of 2-3 minutes in TOP (more first downs against) - from a defensive point of view only. The difference would be noticeable but not mind blowing.

 

A 50% increase in run blocking and pass blocking would make this offense elite. With the current skilled players only, they'd score a lot more TDs in their RZ visits and control 35-40 minutes of the clock a game. Imagine this offense with a dominant OL? Actually scary. Tolbert, Cam, DWill running the ball with open lanes - getting to the second or third level of the defense clean. Or Smitty and Ginn consistently having 4 -5 seconds to get open while Cam is firing lasers all over the field.

 

In other words, I'd let a Hardy (though I love his passion and ability) and a Dwan walk if it means the OL would be upgraded with 2 young, proven vets at LT/RG. Then, focus on upgrading other holes like WR and CB with the draft.

 

edit: meant LT/RG.

[Argus Plexus]

Why not have...both?

[cbully]

Listen I don't want to go all schrute facts on some of you guys but winning games is a lot more complicated than your basic "defense wins titles" or any of your other synchronized football commandment philosophies that were passed down to you and millions of others by a bill parcells press conference

haha..... I love defense but offense points make the team actually advance... in every loss we had this year our offense was stopped dead in its tracks. Certainly we pulled crap that made one drive matter but increasing the points on those drives would keep a above average defense fresh. thus points win championships! defense hold the offense in position to score points. look at the scores of every game we actually score 28+ points in reference to our record. the tricky part is who or where would the offense production come from? the oline which could help the run game, give cam more time? the wrs who could catch and make more yac? either way those simple issues hurts us in the long run this season. we leaned on the defense and in most cases was successful but our offense should have been more productive. 

[cbully]

Why not have...both?

can't because lack of this....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[cbully]

Given the scenario you offer - I don't think so. 25% decline in this defense for a 50% increase in this offense would depend on the team they're playing. We still would have lost against SF last week if you're looking at the final score only. But, if you look at it by stats, and the cascading effects, then yes without a doubt.

 

But, let's take it a step further. Let's look at this by position, rather than by total units. I'd take a 25% drop in DE/DT play, for a 50% increase in OT/OG play on this team.

 

The loss to the defense would likely equate to an extra TD/FG per game, 3 or 4 fewer QB pressures/sacks/hits per game, 25 additional rushing yards against per game, and a loss of 2-3 minutes in TOP (more first downs against) - from a defensive point of view only. The difference would be noticeable but not mind blowing.

 

A 50% increase in run blocking and pass blocking would make this offense elite. With the current skilled players only, they'd score a lot more TDs in their RZ visits and control 35-40 minutes of the clock a game. Imagine this offense with a dominant OL? Actually scary. Tolbert, Cam, DWill running the ball with open lanes - getting to the second or third level of the defense clean. Or Smitty and Ginn consistently having 4 -5 seconds to get open while Cam is firing lasers all over the field.

 

In other words, I'd let a Hardy (though I love his passion and ability) and a Dwan walk if it means the OL would be upgraded with 2 young, proven vets at LT/RG. Then, focus on upgrading other holes like WR and CB with the draft.

 

edit: meant LT/RG.

nice!

[Semaj]

What has won more championships ? Teams with dominant defenses ala the bucs and Ravens titles or dominant offenses like the old school niners, old school Cowboys and the Patriots. Ponder that for a minute . Because we are trying to figure out how to win the super bowl and not just set a bunch of defensive records. By the way I am not saying to forget about defense. I am proud of our defense and I believe it's part of the recipe to winning the super bowl. Balance is key here to have the best chance. Balance.

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