Officially Concerned about the Offense

[FootballMaestro]

Absolutely but what panther55 is nitpicking on are some horrible examples he is using. There are much better examples to critiique cam's throwing on. I'm not just gonna shut my mouth when I see a critique I feel is wrong.

Yeah, "bail out catches" are like the ones we see AJ Green and Marvin Jones make for Andrew Dalton's routinely bad passes all too often. We'll see those tomorrow/on Saturday. Some of us, should watch them!!

[FootballMaestro]

Precisely. Cam threw that ball where only his receiver could get it. The pass wasn't launched too far wide where Hixon had no shot at it. It was a beautiful clutch play on both Cam and Hixon.

 

I'm honestly worried about Shula's inability to keep Newton from trailing off. We all know our QB needs to get into a rhythm early and at times he's pulled some truly stupid calls on third and short but mostly it's the inconsistency that frightens me. He'll go from calling three straight run plays with the game winding down or two absurdly deep passes on first and second down and then run a shotgun draw. So, as a result, I have to call into question Shula's acumen. He doesn't know when to go conservative and when to open the playbook until the final minutes of the game.

 

Could agree with all this. But hopefully, Shula's been setting us up for the playoffs, and/or has had a change of heart/advisement, after looking at the film and brainstorming. 

 

We'll see?

[panthers55]

This has turned into a complete Clusterfook of nonsense. 

 

For the last time. And it's already been said to you numerous times here by different people: Niether Ginn or Hixon (as you're now claiming) "didn't bail out Cam Newton". That was the throw that was intended. Only the uninitiated thinks that was an errant pass by Newton that Hixon saved. Yeah, it was a nice catch. But that was the catch he was supposed to make (just like Ginn), and it was the intended throw by Newton. If Newton would have thrown that ball higher, it could have been knocked out of bounds, and the Panthers had precious little time or opportunities then. 

 

The point was (which still hasn't been effectively challenged): QB's miss receivers with errant passes all the time in the NFL, every game. If this is true; why do certain Panther fans expend so much time and energy to point out Cam's? The other point, which contributes to some of these misses: The Panther receivers are mediocre at best, and do very little to assist Newton on the field, which many Panthers fans seem not to realize and/or play ignorant to. 

 

You're examples of Hixon, Ginn and Olsen, although fine ones, are certainly nothing that contradicts our earlier statements, about the lack of receiver help from Carolina receivers, and only reinforces it. 

 

I find it odd, that you would characterize either the Hixon or Ginn catch, as "bailing Cam out", while professing the team spirit so much. They did their jobs. 'Bailing someone out', would have to be something much more spectacular in my book. 

 

So you either really don't like one Cameron Jerrell Newton (not saying; just raising the question): Or you're so used to poor receiver play from Panther receivers, you now characterize relatively standard (albeit well timed) catches as "bailing Cam Newton out". Which one is it?

 

And while you're at it, please state the record for us, that you acknowledge the Panthers have non play making, mediocre receivers at best in 2013. Can you say that?

Do you hear yourself. You are the reason this has turned into nonsense.  Why keep going on and on.  even when I say I like newton, wear his jersey to games and think he has done a great job, you take one sentence or phrase out of a wall of positive text and constantly make a mountain out of a molehill about an issue that is really ridiculous. Let me help you here since you are obviously obsessed to the point that you have lost all sense of proportion.  I won't say anymore because obviously :

 

 

http://youtu.be/9FnO3igOkOk

[FootballMaestro]

Do you hear yourself. You the reason this has turned into nonsense.  Why keep going on and on.  even when I say I like newton, wear  his jersey to games and think he has done a great job, you take one sentence or phrase out of a wall of positive text and constantly make a mountain out of a molehill about an issue that is really ridiculous. Let me help you here since you are obviously obsessed to the point that you have lost all sense of proportion.  I won't say anymore because obviously :

 

 

http://youtu.be/9FnO3igOkOk

Saying you like Newton; go to his games, and wear his Jersey etc.,, won't eliminate the silly eye brow raising contradictory statements and hyperbole you already professed here, any more than you're current lunacy, selective memory and juvenilism would. 

 

That's all I was dealing with. I couldn't careless about your personal life, apparent needs, and Cam Newton complexes. 

[Marguide]

Several comments:

The "heads up" play by Ginn to get out of bounds and stop the clock was just Ted Ginn being Ted Ginn. He has been known for years as a guy that avoids contact and nearly always heads for the sidelines once the ball is in his hands.

As far as the broader discussion, once I see the juvenile term "hugger" used, it is a clear signal the poster is anything but objective.

And finally, the throw to Hixon was a classic example of throwing the ball where only the receiver had a chance of catching it. Characterizing it as a marginal throw is frankly absurd.

[intangiblejohnny]

That throw to Hixon was ugly. Hixon balled on that play.

First: I don't post a whole lot so after I make my point please realize; I'm not a Cam hugger but I am and always will be a panther hugger.

When a team is driving toward the endzone down by 3 with less than a half minute on the clock the primary fear is turning the ball over.

I think we can all agree on that.

The throw to Hixon was placed exactly where it should have been. Away from the defender, near the sideline, and close to the ground.

These factors severly limit the chance of a turnover. This was nessecary because we were already in field goal range.

(See classic and for that matter current Aaron Rodgers. He uses this technique often even in early quarters.) (Low throw technique)

Hixon made a good clutch catch. It wasn't an easy one but it wasn't supposed to be.

Anyone who plays/played football can tell you this. It was a geat play all around by Tolbert/Cam/Oline and Hixon.

[intangiblejohnny]

If you don't trust my football acumen you should at least trust the several qbs that complimented the throw on national television.

[intangiblejohnny]

BTW, I'm not trying to insult ANYONE. I'm only trying to educate. I like Panthers55 and Squirrel is tolerable and just likes to get people riled up. He sure as hell holds up to his end of a bet (see Geno/Cam thread).

Most of all I wish we were all on the same team.

The pink team, lol.

[FootballMaestro]

First: I don't post a whole lot so after I make my point please realize; I'm not a Cam hugger but I am and always will be a panther hugger.

When a team is driving toward the endzone down by 3 with less than a half minute on the clock the primary fear is turning the ball over.

I think we can all agree on that.

The throw to Hixon was placed exactly where it should have been. Away from the defender, near the sideline, and close to the ground.

These factors severly limit the chance of a turnover. This was nessecary because we were already in field goal range.

(See classic and for that matter current Aaron Rodgers. He uses this technique often even in early quarters.) (Low throw technique)

Hixon made a good clutch catch. It wasn't an easy one but it wasn't supposed to be.

Anyone who plays/played football can tell you this. It was a geat play all around by Tolbert/Cam/Oline and Hixon.

 

Agreed. 

 

That pass and catch can be seen by various QB's and receivers all over the NFL in that situation. It happens.

 

Unfortunately, judging by their comments; I'm not sure how much football some chatty Huddler's actually watch outside of the Panthers. 

[panthers55]

I can appreciate all the positive sentiments for Cam he deserves them.  I think he is great and am excited that he is going to get playoff experience.  That will be the next step for the team given that it will be the first playoff experience for many of our players. Win or lose in the game we gain experience for the future.  The further we go, the better the experience and confidence.  Sure I want us  to go all the way but even if we don't it will still have been a seminal moment portending better results in coming years as our key players mature and continue to develop.

[FootballMaestro]

I can appreciate all the positive sentiments for Cam he deserves them.  I think he is great and am excited that he is going to get playoff experience.  That will be the next step for the team given that it will be the first playoff experience for many of our players. Win or lose in the game we gain experience for the future.  The further we go, the better the experience and confidence.  Sure I want us  to go all the way but even if we don't it will still have been a seminal moment portending better results in coming years as our key players mature and continue to develop.

Thank you for a positive contribution. 

 

However, it was never really [all] about Cam. It was more about the team around him, and us addressing the contention that the Panther receivers were or were not mediocre; did they ever or regularly "bail out" Newton (including the end of the New Orleans game), and do other QB's in the NFL throw high or off target as Newton?

 

Fair is Fair. 

[rayzor]

Several comments:

The "heads up" play by Ginn to get out of bounds and stop the clock was just Ted Ginn being Ted Ginn. He has been known for years as a guy that avoids contact and nearly always heads for the sidelines once the ball is in his hands.

As far as the broader discussion, once I see the juvenile term "hugger" used, it is a clear signal the poster is anything but objective.

And finally, the throw to Hixon was a classic example of throwing the ball where only the receiver had a chance of catching it. Characterizing it as a marginal throw is frankly absurd.

 

very true.

 

that's not saying that the biggest cam fans who can see no wrong are being objective, btw. it's just that as soon as that word is thrown around, objectivity has been thrown out and it becomes a pissing contest.

[Marguide]

One additional point...

 

As stated, the throw to Hixon was well placed. That said, it was a throw just about every NFL QB should make. It was a clear case of a QB and receiver both taking advantage of what the defense gave them. The throw to Ginn on the other hand, was one very few NFL QB's are capable of making. Getting slapped in the face, still standing in there and rocketing a perfect ball downfield to hit the receiver in stride, wow, that was a thing of beauty.

 

The only thing really exceptional about the Cam/Hixon throw and catch was that it was for a game winning TD.

[panthers55]

My last words on the Hixon catch.  It was nothing against Cam, he had already been forced to step up to elude the blitz and was under pressure and couldn't step up in the pocket.  He threw a pretty good pass under the circumstances.  But it wasn't a great pass  or only where it could have been.  Look at this video and watch Hixon out of the break and see how far behind the defender is and then how Hixon has to dive down to get the ball which is losing altitude quickly.  Now imagine a pass that hits Hixon in stride waist high and tell me which would be better. That defender was not going to get there before the ball did. And it didn't need to be thrown so short.  Look at the separation coming out of the break. Hixon has 2 steps on the defender as Cam is throwing the ball.

 

I didn't say that Hixon bailed out Cam to criticize Cam but to actually acknowledge how great that catch was given the pressure. And that pressure extends to Cam as well.  He had already made a good play eluding the rush and stepping up while still looking for a receiver instead of running.  And the throw to Hixon got there so that in itself qualifies as a great play.  I don't think Cam could get everything he wanted on that throw but given the circumstances I think he did outstanding and couldn't be expected to do more.  It worked.  But I still think it was Hixon who made that play and that pass look great.

 

 

 

Hixon has clearly beat his man who is reaching out while still looking in the backfield clearly a sign that he just went oh crap. 

 

 

My point was that this was a better catch than it was a throw but Cam did fantastic under the circumstances.   Why can't these points exist simultaneously and harmoniously.

 

So why go obsessive over a small point which is what I accused others of doing?  This whole issue is ridiculous.  I just want folks to know that my opinions are based on what I see and read and not led by some emotional agenda. Disagree if you wish, in fact I encourage it. Just stop with the hater BS.  It couldn't be further from the truth. I just have the objectivity to see things as they are which is a work in progress and comment about what I see while still feeling very proud and excited to be included in the journey.  I don't think that you have to be a hater or hugger, most all of us are in the middle somewhere.  Do I know who a hugger is?  Very well  actually, given I was the unofficial president of the BDJS for a few years on here.  BDJS-Blind Delhomme Jock Sniffers

 

I confess it was true.  So I get it when folks feel the same way about Cam.  I just don't get the angry emotional diatribes and calling out people.  That is usually reserved for the Smack Forum.