Brandon LaFell a #2 WR? (LaFell vs Moose)

[Keep Steve]

This thread is an insult to Muhammad.

[Fiz]

funny how none of you seem to remember that with the exception of 08 and arguably 03, Moose was always considered the number 1. even when it was clear the Panthers had something in Steve Smith, Moose was consistently Jake's first read for that season. This was before teams knew what to do with Steve Smith. Moose had the best year of his career in the Super Bowl run from a ypc perspective.

 

All of you are missing the point with Lafell. The Panthers don't need to lock up a number 2 receiver. They need to find a number 1. Lafell isn't it.

 

If the Panthers go into next season having locked up Lafell hoping Steve Smith can keep it going they're fuging stupid. 

[wine-o and cheese-doodle]

Lafell plays very good in our scheme. I don't think their are many teams willing to out bid us or pay unreasonable prices for him.

 

He'll most likely be here at G-Man's price. But he does deserve more money.

[*FreeFua*]

funny how none of you seem to remember that with the exception of 08 and arguably 03, Moose was always considered the number 1. even when it was clear the Panthers had something in Steve Smith, Moose was consistently Jake's first read for that season. This was before teams knew what to do with Steve Smith. Moose had the best year of his career in the Super Bowl run from a ypc perspective.

All of you are missing the point with Lafell. The Panthers don't need to lock up a number 2 receiver. They need to find a number 1. Lafell isn't it.

If the Panthers go into next season having locked up Lafell hoping Steve Smith can keep it going they're fuging stupid.

Moose played along side Smitty for 5 seasons. 2001, 2002, 2003, 2008, 2009.

I'm not going to count 2001 because Smitty was primarily used as a returner and only had 10 catches.

During the other 4 season's that Moose played along side Smitty he averaged 58 catches, 791 yards, and 3 TD's. Those numbers are very similar to what LaFell is on pace to put up this year.

I agree we need to find a number 1 WR for the future. I would love to spend either our 1st or 2n round pick on one next year. The question wasn't is LaFell a number 1 WR, the question was is LaFell a solid number 2 and I think the answer is, yes.

The Panthers are still going to need a number 2 guy going forward. LaFell has build some chemistry with Cam and that important. I don't know how I'd feel with two rookie WR's out there next year.

This all boils down to money, and for the right price I believe LaFell is worth keeping.

[Fiz]

This is Lafell's ceiling. He's a shitty Roddy White. He's a slow guy that blocks well and has inconsistent hands. 

 

he's a dime a dozen. 

 

Moose had one of the best years in the history of the league. Just comparing their numbers without context or thinking "hey things were a lot different in the NFL in 1997" is fuging stupid. 

[iamhubby1]

I do have the all 22 and while I havent zoned in on lafell I have noticed that a lot of the time cam gets pressured is because all our wrs are running deep routes and have their back to cam lafell needs to be utilized underneath and in space then use his deceptive speed to go deep

It does seem like we try and count on our RB being the main outlet on those deeper routes. If they don't get open, and/or the line breaks down, those routes can be covered. Ok, maybe, it's easier to cover longer throws.

Point being, if you throw the ball deep, you had better protect. We are iffy at best in that department. Dump offs, and check downs have become common place. The YPA is down, so is yardage. But...we can score, and we can pretty much limit the scores, together, that is a nasty combination.

Where was I?

 

 

The problem is that we were spoiled. Moose wasn't a number two WR. He was a number 1B to Smith being a 1A. 17th in career receptions and 24th in career yards. Remarkably similar to Anquan Boldin and Larry Fitzgerald in Arizona. Moose is one of the best 100 WR to ever play the game and was as consistent as a timepiece. People get mad at Lafell because he's not like Moose.... well there ain't a lot like Moose.

 

Lafell is good for 600-700 yards a year as a secondary option to Smith and we have an offense that works a TE into the equation that catches about the same number of yardage. That's good enough for me. Just as good as having one guy that can catch 800-900 as a more reliable second option, but if you look around the league there aren't a lot of guys that can go for those kind of yards that aren't number one's on teams that are so deep they have more than one.

Well put good Sir. Earlier this year someone posted a list that had him 53rd. To me that is a little low, but even so, he still grades out to a lower #2 rating. He is better than the disbelieverz will lead you to believe. He is a solid #2 option.

Now the question becomes. How close are G-man and Donald on fair market value? Without looking it up. I'd say, 3-4 mil a year. 3 seems low, and 4 seems a little high. But hey. Look where I'm sitting.

 

 

This is my guess too.

Concur wholeheartedly.

 

Well...I do think it is a tad high. But then again...I still like Steely Dan.

 

they did, and both had previously been considered some what #1 guy or played the role of one before their teams bought Wallace and Jackson in. that type of contract is something ideal if the guaranteed money is around $7 or $8 million. i feel like his role as a #2 in this offense is large, but if he went some where else, he would be a #3rd or #4th guy.

If you have 2 #1s maybe he is a 3. But he has proven to be a quality level WR. A solid #2. On a lot of teams. Hellz, the Lions could use him, I tell ya what.

 

 

Moose caught balls with his hands

LaFell catches balls with his forearms in a basket like action

Moose > LaFell

LaFell can stay for a realistic price tho

You just stop. Right now.

Moose may be better than Donald. But the Donald has really nice hands. You take that back.

Yes Donald can stay at fair market value. And he still has great hands. And I would be willing to bet he doesn't drop another ball all year. And I only have 2 rules. It must be catchable. And it must be under a 100mph.

[iamhubby1]

This is Lafell's ceiling. He's a shitty Roddy White. He's a slow guy that blocks well and has inconsistent hands. 

 

he's a dime a dozen. 

 

Moose had one of the best years in the history of the league. Just comparing their numbers without context or thinking "hey things were a lot different in the NFL in 1997" is fuging stupid.

Dude. If you are going to rag on someone, don't make things up. It kinda messes with the whole making a point thingy. The only "Fact" you got right about Donald, is he is a good blocker.

Moose had some really good years for us, and I have played B-ball with him. But...best years in the history of the league?

How's that saying go? Pot, meet Joe Black. Something like that.

[Chimera]

It does seem like we try and count on our RB being the main outlet on those deeper routes. If they don't get open, and/or the line breaks down, those routes can be covered. Ok, maybe, it's easier to cover longer throws.

Point being, if you throw the ball deep, you had better protect. We are iffy at best in that department. Dump offs, and check downs have become common place. The YPA is down, so is yardage. But...we can score, and we can pretty much limit the scores, together, that is a nasty combination.

Where was I?

Well put good Sir. Earlier this year someone posted a list that had him 53rd. To me that is a little low, but even so, he still grades out to a lower #2 rating. He is better than the disbelieverz will lead you to believe. He is a solid #2 option.

Now the question becomes. How close are G-man and Donald on fair market value? Without looking it up. I'd say, 3-4 mil a year. 3 seems low, and 4 seems a little high. But hey. Look where I'm sitting.

Concur wholeheartedly.

Well...I do think it is a tad high. But then again...I still like Steely Dan.

If you have 2 #1s maybe he is a 3. But he has proven to be a quality level WR. A solid #2. On a lot of teams. Hellz, the Lions could use him, I tell ya what.

You just stop. Right now.

Moose may be better than Donald. But the Donald has really nice hands. You take that back.

Yes Donald can stay at fair market value. And he still has great hands. And I would be willing to bet he doesn't drop another ball all year. And I only have 2 rules. It must be catchable. And it must be under a 100mph.

seems like I remember moose always being among the leaders in dropped passes every year. maybe I'm thinking of someone else?

[Ken]

He's a good #2. Good bit great. He has trouble getting open at times, not great at yac and doesn't make many tough cathes on tight coverage (adjusting to the ball and contorting the body) and isn't an option in jump balls mostly.

He has gotten better as a route runner, still room for improvement but he's above average there. Most of his drops seems to be a lack of concentration, so that can be corrected. Like him running slant, corner and out routes.

All in all he's a good #2 behind a clear #1 but I highly doubt he can step up consistently if the #1 WR goes down. We should offer him a decent size contract and let him test the market. If some team offer him crazy money, let him walk.

[Fiz]

Moose had some really good years for us, and I have played B-ball with him. But...best years in the history of the league?

 

Yes, 2004 is statistically one of the best years in the history of the league for a wide receiver. He led the league in Yards, Touchdowns, and was sixth in Touchdowns. He was 13 catches away from the triple crown. He did this with Keary Colbert on the other side of the field.

 

By DVOA, it was like the 16th best season ever for a wide receiver back when I looked it up last. I don't have premium anymore. 

 

This is not a controversial statement. 

[*FreeFua*]

seems like I remember moose always being among the leaders in dropped passes every year. maybe I'm thinking of someone else?

He had 8 dropped passes in 2008 which was tied for 7th highest in the league.

Dropped passes is also why Muhammad was released by the bears.

[saX man]

The bottom line imo is even if you think LaFell is a formidable option, we NEED more big play offensive threats.  We have a mid-30s Smith and...

 

I'm talking playmakers.  We shouldn't pull a Falcons-circa-Jones but need to make a decent investment in the WR/TE department through the draft.  

[CPF4LIFE]

Some of the guys that are projected to go in the second round next year could replace Lafell. The 2 receivers at LSU now would be good replacements with higher ceilings.

[iamhubby1]

seems like I remember moose always being among the leaders in dropped passes every year. maybe I'm thinking of someone else?

Unfortunately, probably not. It was a problem that he never could totally eradicate. He'd have some nice stretches, then fall back down. Other than that. He was the Msn.

 

 

Yes, 2004 is statistically one of the best years in the history of the league for a wide receiver. He led the league in Yards, Touchdowns, and was sixth in Touchdowns. He was 13 catches away from the triple crown. He did this with Keary Colbert on the other side of the field.

 

By DVOA, it was like the 16th best season ever for a wide receiver back when I looked it up last. I don't have premium anymore. 

 

This is not a controversial statement.

Hey I love the guy. And he did have a great year. And some really good ones as well. Just not the history making variety.

Keep the love going though.