Jonathon Martin

[Huell]

The mods should lock this, as it has become pathetic.

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[Mr. Scot]

Yeah this is the thing. These are football teams but they are also businesses with executives and shareholders. If I recall, the Dolphins are partially owned by the likes of Jimmy Buffet and such. Or whoever but there are many interested parties. Ross in the majority owner.

The owner is the owner but he is going to have to make an example. Any company I have worked for would do the same.

Good for Ross for stepping up and handling things. He is a businessman as are all the owners and you take care of the crap when it hits the media. You will notice that right or wrong, Philbin has done the coach speak and managed the situation which is exactly what the people who have a monetary stake in the company want.

Philbin has also managed to refrain from asking potential draftees if their mothers worked in 'human fulfillment' :blink:

[RevMark]

Just joining this forum, moving from S Florida to Asheville in Jan. Been a Dolphins fan with over 17,000 posts on a Dolphins forum www.thePhins.com for many years. Always liked the Panthers and having moved a lot of times I have always rooted for the local football team. So will be cheering for the Panthers in the future.

That being said, I know quite a bit about the Jonathan Martin, Incognito controversy. First don't believe everything you're reading about this, the coaches instructed Incognito to toughen up Martin and they were actually apparently pretty good friends. Incognito left some stupid, racist voicemails in April, but Martin was playing the worst one in the locker room to other players as a joke to be laughed about. It wasn't until the Dolphins traded for Bryant Mckinney and put him at LT, essentially demoting Martin to RT, just three weeks ago, that Martin suddenly became "depressed" about the VM's left back in April.

What seems to be coming to light is Martin:

1. Was avoided by many GM's in the draft because his HS coach let it be known Martin was not mentally tough and didn't think he would make it in the NFL.

2. Martin has been bad at LT, just as bad at RT, (Miami has allowed record numbers of sacks so far, on track to allow over 70 this season.

3. Incognito is a jerk, but since coming to Miami has been a model citizen, made the Pro Bowl and has the support of every player on the team that knows him.

4. None of the Dolphin players are supporting Martin.

5. The OL as a unit went to Vegas, the rookies were paying a bigger share of the cost, but Martin had planned to go but backed out last minute, he was required to pay what he had promised to pay.

6. There is a bad atmosphere and poor team control of players in the Dolphins locker room, but Martin really showed no guts or team pride in leaving and letting down his team mid season, right after being demoted deservedly.

7. Now it appears there could be more to this as Martin's parents, both lawyers, one a HR lawyer, may have had a hand in this, as Martin now has a lawyer going after the rest of this year's pay that Martin gave up essentially when he walked out on the team.

8. There are "friends" of Martin that are saying he is gay and others saying he has mental health issues (he did check into a hospital for depression right after leaving the Dolphins.

I highly recommend the Panthers stay far away from Martin, the last thing they need is a guy like this. Even if Martin wasn't a strong candidate to cause dissection in the locker room, or among fellow players, from watching him play 23 games on the OL, I can say the guy either is not OL material in the NFL, or he is at best a long term project. Honestly I think he's played his last game in professional football.

Hope this perspective is of some value. Looking forward to spending time here as I transition to a full on Panthers fan.

[gorillamilitia13]

I just hope we kick the poo out of those bullies in a couple weeks.

 

This.

[csx]

Incognito was far from a model citizen with the Phins. Did you not see or hear the news this week?

But really im done with this story. There is only so much I can care about millionairs bullying each other when there are thousands of people dying in typhoons amongst thousands of other pressing issues to care more about.

[footballisasport]

Just joining this forum, moving from S Florida to Asheville in Jan. Been a Dolphins fan with over 17,000 posts on a Dolphins forum www.thePhins.com for many years. Always liked the Panthers and having moved a lot of times I have always rooted for the local football team. So will be cheering for the Panthers in the future.

That being said, I know quite a bit about the Jonathan Martin, Incognito controversy. First don't believe everything you're reading about this, the coaches instructed Incognito to toughen up Martin and they were actually apparently pretty good friends. Incognito left some stupid, racist voicemails in April, but Martin was playing the worst one in the locker room to other players as a joke to be laughed about. It wasn't until the Dolphins traded for Bryant Mckinney and put him at LT, essentially demoting Martin to RT, just three weeks ago, that Martin suddenly became "depressed" about the VM's left back in April.

What seems to be coming to light is Martin:

1. Was avoided by many GM's in the draft because his HS coach let it be known Martin was not mentally tough and didn't think he would make it in the NFL.

2. Martin has been bad at LT, just as bad at RT, (Miami has allowed record numbers of sacks so far, on track to allow over 70 this season.

3. Incognito is a jerk, but since coming to Miami has been a model citizen, made the Pro Bowl and has the support of every player on the team that knows him.

4. None of the Dolphin players are supporting Martin.

5. The OL as a unit went to Vegas, the rookies were paying a bigger share of the cost, but Martin had planned to go but backed out last minute, he was required to pay what he had promised to pay.

6. There is a bad atmosphere and poor team control of players in the Dolphins locker room, but Martin really showed no guts or team pride in leaving and letting down his team mid season, right after being demoted deservedly.

7. Now it appears there could be more to this as Martin's parents, both lawyers, one a HR lawyer, may have had a hand in this, as Martin now has a lawyer going after the rest of this year's pay that Martin gave up essentially when he walked out on the team.

8. There are "friends" of Martin that are saying he is gay and others saying he has mental health issues (he did check into a hospital for depression right after leaving the Dolphins.

I highly recommend the Panthers stay far away from Martin, the last thing they need is a guy like this. Even if Martin wasn't a strong candidate to cause dissection in the locker room, or among fellow players, from watching him play 23 games on the OL, I can say the guy either is not OL material in the NFL, or he is at best a long term project. Honestly I think he's played his last game in professional football.

Hope this perspective is of some value. Looking forward to spending time here as I transition to a full on Panthers fan.

 

You lost me after that statement. I did decide to read some your post, and I should have followed my mind and stopped after I read that ignorant statement.

 

FYI, nothing of what you're said gives me any proof that Incognitio actions was warranted. So what if Martin was soft. If he's to soft to do his job well on the field, then get rid of him. I love how folks are defending the behavior of this bully by dismissing his crazy behavior and claiming Martin, not acting like a "thug," is him being "soft."  If Incognitio treats his friends like he did Martin, I wonder how he treats his enemies.

 

And, I'm beginning to believe there is something in the water in Florida. Way to much ignorance for me.

[Huell]

Oh this thread is still going?

Cool.

[Growl]

Interesting to see less and less of the stuff that was reported against Incognito come out as bad reports and false info. Moreso amusing after all the sensationalists ran to their high horses to find any excuse to rally behind something ate up everything they were fed.

 

 

Incognito is a chump. People who get so sucked up in "causes" that they don't let the facts get in the way of a good story are chumps as well.

[Growl]

never trust the media.

[hitman80]

5. The OL as a unit went to Vegas, the rookies were paying a bigger share of the cost, but Martin had planned to go but backed out last minute, he was required to pay what he had promised to pay.

 

 

Am I the only one that doesn't get this part?  I know every team probably does it but why in the world do the rookies, the ones (in most cases) with the least amount of money required to pay the most?  I don't see how some of the vets with millions in the bank can sit back and make rookies, who are just trying to make it, pay their bills.

 

I could understand a food tab at a restaurant or something as "initiation" but this stuff seems like it's just too much.

[Mr. Scot]

3. Incognito is a jerk, but since coming to Miami has been a model citizen, made the Pro Bowl and has the support of every player on the team that knows him.

 

Out of curiosity, does your definition of 'model citizen' include this?

 

Incident Report: Aventura Police Department

 

 

4. None of the Dolphin players are supporting Martin.

 

Dimitri Patterson has already said he would "definitely" welcome Martin back.

 

But more to the point, team owner Stephen Ross said the following:

 

“I want to make sure the type of racial slurs, harassment, bullying doesn’t occur on our team, in our locker room. “There’s no room for that in our workplace.”

 

He also called Incognito's use of racial slurs "appalling" and stated there was "no excuse" for it.  He further stated  that he was forming an advisory committee which would include Tony Dungy and Don Shula, both of whom have made negative statements about Incognito (link)

 

There was also this...

 

Ross stressed that he wants Martin to know that the team cares about him and believes all of its players deserve respectful treatment at their workplace. Ross said he will have a face-to-face meeting with Martin on Wednesday.

 

“The most important thing is, we care about Jonathan Martin,” Ross said. “I have reached out to Jonathan Martin, I have texted him, we have communicated via text, and I plan to meet with him in person very shortly.”

 

Ross said he asked NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell to appoint an investigator, rather than the Dolphins to investigate the matter themselves, because he wants everyone to know the investigation is independent.

 

(link)

 

Now in light of all that, don't be surprised if in the next few days you see a whole lot more players come out in support of Martin and start dishing on Incognito and problems they've had with him.

 

If Incognito is still a Dolphin by December 2nd, I'll be surprised.

[RevMark]

Out of curiosity, does your definition of 'model citizen' include this?

Incident Report: Aventura Police Department

Dimitri Patterson has already said he would "definitely" welcome Martin back.

But more to the point, team owner Stephen Ross said the following:

He also called Incognito's use of racial slurs "appalling" and stated there was "no excuse" for it. He further stated that he was forming an advisory committee which would include Tony Dungy and Don Shula, both of whom have made negative statements about Incognito (link)

There was also this...

(link)

Now in light of all that, don't be surprised if in the next few days you see a whole lot more players come out in support of Martin and start dishing on Incognito and problems they've had with him.

If Incognito is still a Dolphin by December 2nd, I'll be surprised.

By model citizen I meant he has been a good player, was elected to the leadership council, made the Pro Bowl, and had almost no penalties, vs. previously being considered one of the dirtiest players in the NFL that 2 teams let go.

Pattersons comment is one of 53 players, though I'm sure others would likely welcome him back, my point is do you really want someone on the Panthers OL who can't take locker room banter and is ready to drop out on his team just because he wants to when the team. Needs him most?

That's really all I am saying, is the point of this thread was do you want Matin on the Panthers? My post is I don't recommend it.

[Mr. Scot]

By model citizen I meant he has been a good player, was elected to the leadership council, made the Pro Bowl, and had almost no penalties, vs. previously being considered one of the dirtiest players in the NFL that 2 teams let go.

Pattersons comment is one of 53 players, though I'm sure others would likely welcome him back, my point is do you really want someone on the Panthers OL who can't take locker room banter and is ready to drop out on his team just because he wants to when the team. Needs him most?

That's really all I am saying, is the point of this thread was do you want Matin on the Panthers? My post is I don't recommend it.

I'll put it this way: I'd take Martin before I'd take Incognito.

(frankly, I wouldn't take Incognito regardless)

I've spent plenty of time in a locker room, and the racist stuff isn't simple 'locker room banter' any more than the stunt he pulled on that woman is just his being 'flirty'.

And for the record, Incognito is still considered one of the dirtiest players in the league by everybody except the Dolphins. The fact that they put a guy like him in a leadership role speaks to just how poorly that team is being run.

"Model citizen" indeed.

[csx]

Where have we come to that texting is the proper way to reach out to someone. Maybe if the owner had called then Martin would have thought he gave a crap. Not so much a comment about the owner as it is on society.