Cam haters please check in here!

[mav1234]

  That sample size cost us 3 games--no qb with a 17.6 fourth quarter QB rating is exempt from blame.  That is when the stud qbs shine.  Make excuses if it helps you sleep.

 

 

I don't need to make excuses, I know Cam and the team as a whole must improve in close games.  However, I also know that the stat line you picked is a really, really poor one.  Not only does it really only display the action in a very limited number of games, the stats themselves are deceptive.

 

so to illustrate this point, let's choose another QB.  Quick, you tell me, who is this QB: 2 td, 2 int, 52.8% completion percentage, with a rating of 69.1 when within 7 in the 4th quarter. 

 

hint: you already brought him up...

[MadHatter]

So basically you're saying that it's Cam's fault Deangelo fumbled late in the 4th against Seattle, and that Ron Rivera decided not to go for it on fourth and 1 in Buffalo with like 2 minutes to go only up six points when a touchdown was clearly needed to win or force OT?

As for my comment about ignorance. That was less an insult and more pointing out the obvious. The fact that the only quarterback that you could think of to compare him with just happened to be black, and a known bust, speaks volumes to me about your mindset.

We would not have needed a 4th and 1 or a last second defensive stop if cam could gave taken either of the 30 yard fields that the D fave him and scored a TD.

None if the acts within themselves were the reason we lost. All if them were equally to blame.

The offense, defense, and coaches had opportunities to make the plays that would have won the fans...they ALL came up short.

[teeray]

Of course Cam should have played better. That is my point. The statistics are not my doing, but they explain a lot to an objective, knowledgeable football fan. The same OL and WRs in the first, second, and third quarters suddenly cause the QB rating in the fourth quarter to drop from over 90 to 50? And when you need that franchise QB to put you on his shoulders and carry you--like Brady did yesterday with his group or WRs---his rating is below 20. That is eye-opening, and I have nothing to do with the statistics. They are what they are--you dang right he should have played better.

We have 2 wins against teams with a combined 1-11 record. The other games were close, and our QB disappeared in the 4th quarter--these stats show that.

Just to shed some light on this, in 3 of the 5 games we had at least a 6 point after our last offensive possession.

1 of the other games (Seattle) we only had one possession in the 4th quarter and drove right down the field but fumbled.

So really the Arizona game was the only game where he has had a bad 4th quarter, and of course that one game is dragging his rating a bunch.

[TheRed]

We would not have needed a 4th and 1 or a last second defensive stop if cam could gave taken either of the 30 yard fields that the D fave him and scored a TD.

None if the acts within themselves were the reason we lost. All if them were equally to blame.

The offense, defense, and coaches had opportunities to make the plays that would have won the fans...they ALL came up short.

 

Cam isn't our entire offense, we do have other players you know. It's a team effort.

 

No matter how you want to cut it, that decision to go for 3 instead of 7 ultimately lost us the game. Moments like that are what defines a winning team versus a losing team. If you asked Rivera today if he could do it over again, do you think he would still take the field goal?

 

Seems to me that after that moment Rivera has been awfully eager to go for it on 4th and 1 in the opponents territory.

[Jangler]

If we want to talk about excuses, maybe we should talk about all the weapons Cam doesn't have. How could he beat anyone without any weapons.

 

[top dawg]

I love how when Cam has 1 good game these threads pop up. 

 

The jury is still out, dude. Cam has too much talent and untapped potential to throw him out with the bathwater as has been suggested by those who lack a certain amount of vision.

 

Let's put him into an optimal situation and see what he does before calling him Josh Freeman.

[MHS831]

So basically you're saying that it's Cam's fault Deangelo fumbled late in the 4th against Seattle, and that Ron Rivera decided not to go for it on fourth and 1 in Buffalo with like 2 minutes to go only up six points when a touchdown was clearly needed to win or force OT?

 

As for my comment about ignorance. That was less an insult and more pointing out the obvious. The fact that the only quarterback that you could think of to compare him with just happened to be black, and a known bust, speaks volumes to me about your mindset.

 

VInce Young was 26-22 during his first 3 years at Tennessee.  He was not considered a bust during the first three years.  He was considered a project, and if you go on the Titan boards, they were saying exactly what you are saying about Cam--nearly word for word.  Don't try to make this about intelligence or race--just present some data that suggests we have a franchise QB.

 

And yes, other players make mistakes,but DeAngelo's fumble had nothing to do with Cam's QB rating dropping 50 points.  Try again.  What has he done ON A CONSISTENT BASIS that makes you think he is so wonderful....

 

There is no answer to that.  He has flashed and been a hell of a front runner.

 

Want a larger sample size, since a 51 QB rating in five 4th quarters in 2013 is not enough-- 2 Wins and 14 losses when we had the lead in thee fourth quarter.  The lead that we got with the OL and WRs. 

 

You really don't know football if you can make excuses for this.  I don't like the fact that Cam is not getting it done either, but I don't ignore the obvious---THE WINNING.  What do you think Cam and Gettlemen were talking about this summer--ONE WORD---WIN.  You are not qualified to tell anyone about the obvious. 

 

[beastson]

Vince Young was 26-22 

 

What is this new team called Vince Young? never heard of it

[TheRed]

VInce Young was 26-22 during his first 3 years at Tennessee. He was not considered a bust during the first three years. He was considered a project, and if you go on the Titan boards, they were saying exactly what you are saying about Cam--nearly word for word. Don't try to make this about intelligence or race--just present some data that suggests we have a franchise QB.

And yes, other players make mistakes, but not Cam Newton. He has done so much to earn a stellar reputation beyond any criticism. What has he done ON A CONSISTENT BASIS that makes you think he is so wonderful....CONSISTENT BASIS.

There is no answer to that. He has flashed and been a hell of a front runner.

Want a larger sample size, since a 51 QB rating in five 4th quarters in 2013 is not enough-- 2 Wins and 14 losses when we had the lead in thee fourth quarter. The lead that we got with the OL and WRs.

You really don't know football if you can make excuses for this. I don't like the fact that Cam is not getting it done either, but I don't ignore the obvious---THE WINNING. What do you think Cam and Gettlemen were talking about this summer--ONE WORD---WIN. You are not qualified to tell anyone about the obvious.

With every post you are slowly becoming more and more unhinged about the subject of him.

Are you trying to convince yourself of all this, or us?

[mav1234]

so since MHS didn't want to look it up, Tom Brady is the QB I referred to that has a terrible "4th quarter when within 7" rating, yet look at the record of that team.  Now, Tom and Cam are not anywhere near the same league at all - I'm not saying they are - I'm just illustrating that even AMAZING QBs can have weird stats with small sample sizes, so why be surprised when a young QB does?  I mean last year he had a good set in that area, so why think he's regressed based on 10 attempts?

 

 

VInce Young was 26-22 during his first 3 years at Tennessee.  He was not considered a bust during the first three years.  He was considered a project, and if you go on the Titan boards, they were saying exactly what you are saying about Cam--nearly word for word.  Don't try to make this about intelligence or race--just present some data that suggests we have a franchise QB.

 

 

So please explain to me what makes these two similar.

 

Because Vince Young has as many passing yards in his career so far as Cam has in his first three years.  Cam has more passing touchdowns, more rushing touchdowns, etc, in his first three years.  Cam has broken passing records.  Vince Young was never a good passer - Cam very clearly is.  Other than labeling them both "a project", what exactly makes Cam like Vince Young?

 

 

 

Want a larger sample size, since a 51 QB rating in five 4th quarters in 2013 is not enough-- 2 Wins and 14 losses when we had the lead in thee fourth quarter.  The lead that we got with the OL and WRs. 

 

LOL blown fourth quarter leads have to do with the defense, ffs.  Listen to yourself, man.  When the defense gives up a basically game ending score, sure you can blame Cam for not doing whatever, or you could blame coaching or the defense.  You should also probably look at the entire body of work throughout the game, rather than beign so reactionary.  I was initially pissed at cam's game vs Seattle, but I actually went back and looked at how he played and he took what the defense gave him, he didn't force it, and he played smart.  That is all you can ask for.  I don't think we were aggressive enough overall but that is not necessarily his fault - and based on how we "adjusted" the next week I would say it was a playcalling "issue."

 

 

And yes, other players make mistakes,but DeAngelo's fumble had nothing to do with Cam's QB rating dropping 50 points.  Try again.  What has he done ON A CONSISTENT BASIS that makes you think he is so wonderful....

 

Do you realize Cam had only 3 attempts that 4th quarter and only one was an incompletion?  He also ran the ball 2 times for 15 yards.  Cam's QB rating, if it did drop "50 points," it only did so because of the extreme small sample size.  If we look at his body of work, particularly last season in the 4th quarter, it is clear that it is our defense giving up leads, and that we rarely get a chance to see Cam make plays at the end of games for reasons outside of his play.

 

[MadHatter]

Cam isn't our entire offense, we do have other players you know. It's a team effort.

No matter how you want to cut it, that decision to go for 3 instead of 7 ultimately lost us the game. Moments like that are what defines a winning team versus a losing team. If you asked Rivera today if he could do it over again, do you think he would still take the field goal?

Seems to me that after that moment Rivera has been awfully eager to go for it on 4th and 1 in the opponents territory.

Try and keep up thus time.....

We are a team is exactly my point. They all get blame when they play poorly as a team and they all get praise when the play well as a team.

You are the one that thinks Cam is exempt from criticism. Team plays poorly and it is everyone's fault BUT Cam.

All aspects played poorly against Buffalo and all played well against Minn.

[TheRed]

Try and keep up thus time.....

We are a team is exactly my point. They all get blame when they play poorly as a team and they all get praise when the play well as a team.

You are the one that thinks Cam is exempt from criticism. Team plays poorly and it is everyone's fault BUT Cam.

All aspects played poorly against Buffalo and all played well against Minn.

There you go MadHatter, you lose the argument before it even begins. I've never once said Cam is exempt from criticism.

Care to try again?

[mav1234]

poor Cam haters, so persecuted.  I mean it''s not just Cam they think is just like Vince Young, they also think we should trade Kuechly or get rid of CJ.  They just hate all of our big name players equally, they just forget to create threads calling the others out.

 

very very few of us think Cam is exempt from criticism.  what I think is that a lot of the criticism he receives is ridiculous or narrow in focus such that it ignores the realities of this team and places an inordinate amount of responsibility on his shoulders.

[MadHatter]

There you go MadHatter, you lose the argument before it even begins. I've never once said Cam is exempt from criticism.

Care to try again?

Your entire existence is nothing more than to make excuses for Cam.

Go back in your meds....the voices in your head are not your friends.