Bringing Barner and Stewart into the mix

[Cpt slay a ho]

all this dwill hate is getting pretty old...................

[panthers55]

It's not even up for debate. If anyone is going bye-bye first, it's Williams simply because he's older and not the type of RB Gettleman prefers.

Forget that Stewart costs 6 million as well next year and even though he is younger he can't make it on the field. The only reason he stays is that he costs almost 19,000,000 in dead cap space to cut and no one would trade for him. Williams still would cost 9.6 million in dead cap space to cut in 2014. 

 

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/carolina-panthers/cap-hit/2014/

[Marguide]

It's not even up for debate. If anyone is going bye-bye first, it's Williams simply because he's older and not the type of RB Gettleman prefers.

 

We spend too much on RB's. No question. I love both Stew and DWill but know that we don't need both of them long-term. And I also look forward to watching Barner.

 

Okay, now that that's out of the way...how do we know what type of RB Gettleman prefers? I don't remember him addressing that specifically.

 

Can you fill me in?

[General_Purr]

Im not sure if Dwill can keep carrying it the whole season with the entire load. So I would like to see him get 15-20 runs. Stew get 7 or 8 and give barner 3 or 4 chances. Along with passes and drop offs. And get Stew to block in the backfield with passes. And give tolbert the ball more. Diversity is a gewd thing

[panthers55]

Williams won't cost that much in dead weight as a June 1st cut.

 

Precisely why Stewart isn't leaving Carolina anytime soon. His contract makes him untouchable until 2015. Williams isn't that fortunate.

It would still cost 5 million as a June 1st cut in 2014 with 5 million more in 2015.  The assumption is that Stewart will come back 100% and we won't  need Williams.  That might be a big assumption.  Lets wait until Stewart actually comes back before we decide if he is the answer going forward. 

[Snake]

Getting Stewart back is a good thing. We need a inside runner that is more quick than tolbert.

[Marguide]

Specifically, a power-back. That's been The Giants' philosophy for as long as we can remember -- getting the tough 3-4 yards inbetween the tackles. Let's face it, D-Will has never been that type of back. He waits for a hole to open and then proceeds to hit it. I love D-Will but I honestly believe he's gone along with Beason, Gross and Godfrey next season.

 

Barner was possibly a compromise between G-Man and Rivera (a scatback that Ron has been begging for).

 

I think J-Stew is safe for the next two years. After 2015, he could be gone unless he goes on a tear (back-to-back 1k yard seasons).

 

While I am drawing a mental blank on their names (it was Bradshaw and another guy), there was a time a couple of years ago when the Giants employed a tandem of backs much like we did. One was more of a power runner, the other more in the mold of DWill. I could Google it but frankly I'm feeling lazy tonight.

 

While Gettleman was the pro personnel guy, he wasn't the GM, so we really don't know what his input into the equation was. I think he likes play makers (along with the hog mollies) and TD scorers, so we really don't know who he prefers between DWill and Stew.

 

I thought last year that the "demotion" of DWill was all about finding out how we would do if we let him go in the offseason. They gave Stew the ball to see how he would produce and how he would hold up to the pounding. When he went down, DWill had an opportunity to show he could still be productive, and then when Stew needed offseason surgery on both ankles, the team decided they better try to keep DWill around.

 

It is going to be very hard to move on from Stew because of his contract, but I'm not sure he is still viewed as the future feature back.

[NavyPF4L]

Tiki barber..

[poorboysrev]

While I am drawing a mental blank on their names (it was Bradshaw and another guy), there was a time a couple of years ago when the Giants employed a tandem of backs much like we did. One was more of a power runner, the other more in the mold of DWill. I could Google it but frankly I'm feeling lazy tonight.

 

While Gettleman was the pro personnel guy, he wasn't the GM, so we really don't know what his input into the equation was. I think he likes play makers (along with the hog mollies) and TD scorers, so we really don't know who he prefers between DWill and Stew.

 

I thought last year that the "demotion" of DWill was all about finding out how we would do if we let him go in the offseason. They gave Stew the ball to see how he would produce and how he would hold up to the pounding. When he went down, DWill had an opportunity to show he could still be productive, and then when Stew needed offseason surgery on both ankles, the team decided they better try to keep DWill around.

 

It is going to be very hard to move on from Stew because of his contract, but I'm not sure he is still viewed as the future feature back.

It was Derrick Ward who is almost identical to Williams in size. So really it means out of their 3 backs that season they had 2 slashers and  1 power back in Jacobs...like we do now in Tolbert.  Maybe he was talking about the good ole days and Rodney Hampton lol. Wasn't Gettleman a scout for Marv Levy? So that means he was there for Thurman Thomas, obviously a power back :) All kidding aside I think you are correct, we have no idea on gettleman's preference for running backs.

[CRA]

Funny that Williams is a problem because he has fumbled a few times this year after being very fumble resistant for years. Barner had 2 fumbles in the preseason (not counting returns) which is the only time he has played and he is supposedly fumble resistant and we should play him with no concerns. Amazing how some folks here are so negative about Williams they ignore reality to paint a very biased picture yet hug on other guys nuts who have done nothing at all yet this year.

Williams' fumbles were only brought up when someone tried to paint Barner as a fumbler. He had one preseason fumble as a runner. The other was a QB exchange. If you want to make a big deal out of those.....you simply have to also recognize Williams is dropping it.

Barner wasn't a fumbler at Oregon. Kick returns is a different conversation

[Qu1million]

Full pistol smith and Ginn...wowzers

[CRA]

Ahh CRA...you can spin better than this. You know better than to suggest that those 2 fumbles cost us those games they were in good position to.

You can't knock a player for fumbling and ignore what Williams had done this year in that department. That is bias.

Whatever happened to the whole "it's a team sport" thing? Or does that philosophy only apply when talking about the players you happen to like?

You can tell us a 1000 times that you have nothing against DWill, that you just don't like spending so much on the position, and that Stew fits our offense better, but guess what? Nobody is buying that. It is obvious from the way you emphasize every negative that you are in no way being an objective observer.

And that's fine. We all do it. Just don't keep trying to pass it off as unbiased observation.

Sure it is a team sport.....his fumbles in both Seattle games simply made it tough on his team.

And no, I don't dislike Williams in a vacuum. If he was a cheap roleplayer.....he would be awesome.

He is running good thus far....but when people want to kick up the homerism card and make him more than what he is....I call it bc that is how I view it. Like the post where he is now a top tier RB again. That isn't something I do uniquely to Williams. Steve Smith, Beason, etc...not sure why it is so tough to let guys just be good players.

I am a firm believe in you move on from players....that ultimately is why people get ticked with me. Some want every fan favorite to retire here and I view that as unrealistic and will hurt us ultimately.

[rodeo]

Deangelo is one of the greatest RBs of all time. Numbers don't lie. Statistically in league with Jim Brown and Barry Sanders, and will be remembered on the same terms. Best player to ever put on a Panthers uniform.

[Marguide]

Sure it is a team sport.....his fumbles in both Seattle games simply made it tough on his team.

And no, I don't dislike Williams in a vacuum. If he was a cheap roleplayer.....he would be awesome.

He is running good thus far....but when people want to kick up the homerism card and make him more than what he is....I call it bc that is how I view it. Like the post where he is now a top tier RB again. That isn't something I do uniquely to Williams. Steve Smith, Beason, etc...not sure why it is so tough to let guys just be good players.

I am a firm believe in you move on from players....that ultimately is why people get ticked with me. Some want every fan favorite to retire here and I view that as unrealistic and will hurt us ultimately.

 

I agree that the emotional attachment to players has cost us, both financially and on the field. I don't care who retires here. I want to win. 

 

My comment before has nothing to do with homerism. I like DWill and Stew and want to see Barner get his chance. There is no doubt we went full retard with the RB contracts. I just don't understand why you look for every opportunity to hammer DWill when you could easily make the argument that he has been the more productive member of double trouble.

 

If we let Cam be Cam, and by that I mean utilizing his abilities as a runner as well as passer, just about any decent RB should look good. What Cam does as a double threat is what opens up our whole offense. 

 

I just don't understand why you have to consistently hammer DWill. It's not his fault Hurney paid him like AP. And frankly, Stew's contract is worse than DWill's. Both of those guys have gotten paid, both are good but underutilized. We can't do anything about that, it's a done deal. So maybe we should just appreciate the production we are getting right now in the run game, and forget about jersey numbers and names.