Redskin fan logic

[NC_Skins]

A word of advice: If you're going to post here; post like  you actually know your own player, as well as the other teams; otherwise you only come off like an intrusive troll (no disrespect meant). What you said is laughable. 

 

RG3 has not demonstrated so far that he's an INTELLIGENT POCKET QB. No sir-ee.

 

Ironically, RG3 is not even a more intelligent runner than Cam. So this whole "intelligence" thing is a Made Up Media Meme. How intelligent was RG3 to pout, insist he play and to knock his back up ("I give the team the best chance to win), when he knew he was playing on one bad knee his last playoff game? That was both selfish and stupid! Plus RG3 runs like a Sprinter, Wildman. Cam on the contrary, is a very intelligent runner (despite his enormous size, shiftyness/elusiveness and speed), who knows when to get down. 

 

First off, I live in NC so I"m forced to watch Cam play. Even so, I root for the Panthers when they aren't playing the Skins so this notion I don't know our or your player is ridiculous. Just because my opinion doesn't suit yours, doesn't mean I don't know what I'm talking about. If Cam had came out the same year as RGIII and Luck, you know as well as I do that he would have been the 3rd guy chose.

 

I don't even know how to respond to ludicrious statements such as this:

 

Let's be real here: RG3 has not come close to having the responsibility as a QB that Cam (or even Luck and Tannehill) had to carry into their rookie and second season

 

You also know, the Redskins ran more than they threw in 2012? So you can make the argument that the Redskins had a RUN FIRST offense, which they relied on first, that RG3 and defenses reacted to. What does that say about RG3's pocket prowness??

 

 

Our run game thrived in part to the threat of RGIII. Had Rex Grossman been at the helm, I assure you that we probably wouldn't have led the league in rushing. This is Kyle's system, not Mikes. The run sets up our passing attack, but why pass if you can net 4.8 yds per rush from your RB and 6.8 from your QB?  Also, doesn't the Panthers have two incredibly high priced RBs in their backfield, and yet you talk about our running game?

 

 

 

At this stage, he plays in a gimmick, trick laden, quick throw, short route, motion, run intensive offense, where he rarely has to sit back in the pocket and make multiple reads, like Cam does. I've seen several Redskins fans, complain and worry about this (RG3's development; especially before he  blew up with the media, and during, after training camp when fellow rookie Cousins reportedly outplayed him). This is why the staple of the Redskins offense, is to trick and fool people (when RG3 is not making his one/zone read). He's not a good pocket, downfield QB at this stage. It's why RG3's receivers are usually so wide open when he actually throws down field. It's all the trickery, motion and mis-direction The Redskins run. Hey, Credit the Shanahan's, Morris and RG3! I'm not hating. Good for him!

 

 

You have no clue about our offense and it's apparent from this tripe. Our offense is Kyle's version of his dad's offense from Denver, and one he used in Houston under Kubiak. The read-option was mixed in with our offense to help RGIII settle into the base offense and to throw off teams defense. It worked, and then some. Our offense isn't  meant for quick throws one bit, it's meant to open up the downfield passing by establishing the run.The zone stretch run we use opens up the defense for the bootlegs, which are the bread and butter of this offense. As the year went along, the read option was being used less and less, but you would know this had you actually watched the Skins play. Another reason we've used to read-option is because we still have OL issues when it comes to pass protecting. The system did a hell of a job covering this up. It'll be another year before we can get guys in to replace some of the weak links on that line.

 

If RG3 played on the Panthers, I'm not sure if they would have won 3 games. I say this, because RG3 would have been asked to do too much. And based off of what I've seen from him in DC (he's not a pocket, multiple read QB or a smart, durable runner), I'm not sure he could handle that, or stay on the field/upright even.   

 

If RGIII played on the Panthers, your GM would still be there and the Panthers would have faired much better. We did win our division and 10 games last year with one of the shittiest defenses in the NFL.

 

 

Mr. "One-read, check-down prince" RG3. That might be the nicest comment you will find here.

 

 

 

Check down? That was Jason Cambell, not RGIII.

 

Cam Newton's yards/TDs from TE/RB spot:

TE- 951 yds and 6 TDs

RB - 612 yds and 4 TDs

Total:  1563 yds and 10 TDs

 

RGIII yards/TDs from TE/RB spot:

TEs- 793 yds and 2 TDs

RB-  340 yds and 2 TDs

Total: 1133 yds and 4 TDs

 

 

If RGIII is the "check down prince", I guess that makes Cam the "check down king".

[NC_Skins]

Once again, I'm not trying to be rude or disrespectful. However, you appear to be such an idiot, troll Noob, that you don't even realize your video is actually supporting our point/s. SMH

 

Guys, I'm not trying to be rude or disrespectful, but let me be rude and disrespectful. I find it funny that you are the bigger troll, and not the visiting fan. Either way, I'm done replying to you personally. If other Panther fans want to discuss, by all means. No hate here. I enjoy when the Panthers do good.

 

 

ps. If you can't see him going through the reads in the videos, than you don't know what you are watching.

[The NFL Shield At Midfield]

unless you can quote me saying that griffin never has to go through a progression then 4 gifs from sbnation don't mean poo

 

here's more of an effortpost from last year about the giants vikings game that i did.  no gifs though, just the exact time on the playclock when i made the observations:

 

 

i'm watching griffin against the vikings right now and it's the same deal as the giants game. i've seen him pull out of a called deep pass and check it down once so far - 11:47 on the play clock in the second quarter when he dumped it off to brandon banks after initially looking deep. there's also the near pick he threw in the first quarter at 5:47-he had a back open in the flat but went deep into double coverage without looking his way. on the next play at 5:41 his one read was clearly josh morgan on a called bootleg and he threw an ill advised pick right into antoine winfield's mitts. this is in contrast to a second year guy in ponder who you can clearly see scanning the field as he drops back.

again, a lot of the passes are quick hitters off three step drops working the grass between the sticks. they seem to like to work some 15-20 yard in routes as a change up and on occasion attempt actual vertical pass plays.

you can bullshit all day about cam's "showboating" or whatever you want but from a purely Xs and Os standpoint it's hard to compare griffin and newton. newton is clearly running a different (and much shittier) offense than griffin. the redskins' playcalling is near-perfect right now and the actual execution is fantastic. washington is much more balanced and as such you don't really see the kind of feast or famine stuff that's plaguing our offense from them. play design is worlds better and they actually feed their backs the ball.

 

 

[The NFL Shield At Midfield]

If RGIII played on the Panthers, your GM would still be there and the Panthers would have faired much better. We did win our division and 10 games last year with one of the shittiest defenses in the NFL.

 

griffin would be horrible in a coryell

[NC_Skins]

unless you can quote me saying that griffin never has to go through a progression then 4 gifs from sbnation don't mean poo

 

here's more of an effortpost from last year about the giants vikings game that i did.  no gifs though, just the exact time on the playclock when i made the observations:

 

 

 

Yes, RGIII has missed some downfield opportunities, and you won't find a knowledgeable Skins fan that will deny it. I don't think anybody is saying RGIII is elite status yet because I certainly don't think he is. He was a rookie, and it takes time for rookies to learn the game and adjust to the speed. RGIII may never hit elite status, and we really won't know until a few years down the road. I posted the gifs to show that he's not just throwing to his first option. You can see his head swiveling and then setting and thowing. Does it happen every pass play? Of course not, but his pass protection isn't the best in the world either.

 

edit: if he doesn't learn to slide, this is going to be all moot anyways. He'll never survive at the pace he's going trying to prove how tough he is.

[FootballMaestro]

Yes, RGIII has missed some downfield opportunities, and you won't find a knowledgeable Skins fan that will deny it. I don't think anybody is saying RGIII is elite status yet because I certainly don't think he is. He was a rookie, and it takes time for rookies to learn the game and adjust to the speed. RGIII may never hit elite status, and we really won't know until a few years down the road. I posted the gifs to show that he's not just throwing to his first option. You can see his head swiveling and then setting and thowing. Does it happen every pass play? Of course not, but his pass protection isn't the best in the world either.

 

edit: if he doesn't learn to slide, this is going to be all moot anyways. He'll never survive at the pace he's going trying to prove how tough he is.

 

Those were designed misdirections (the "swiveling of his head", following play action at that) you Noob.

 

Are you really that daft, dense?

 

I get it. So you're a Redskin fan trapped in North Carolina (though there is something called NFL Redzone and League Pass, you can watch), who mysteriously CAN'T properly evaluate either teams Quarterback. OK bud.  

 

Please stop. 

[The NFL Shield At Midfield]

the walsh west coast variant that the redskins run is all about working short and intermediate routes and fast releases off three step drops.  the read option stuff out of the pistol and shotgun was, of course, a noticeable wrinkle.  SF was bootleg city when steve young was the starting QB and it clearly rubbed off on the shanahans.  how good or bad griffins' offensive line is is secondary to that.

 

the "more intelligent and accurate than newton" crap is what i have a problem with.  first, cam learned how to run an NFL offense in six weeks, okay?  he's not stupid.

 

second, their offenses couldn't be more different, not only from a WCO vs. coryell standpoint, but also a playcalling and scheme one.  the redskins actually fed their backs the ball and ran well designed play action fakes.  the panthers did not, and there is a wealth of material on this board about the read option fiasco our egomaniac former offensive coordinator (now the browns' problem) put us through for 8 or 9 weeks straight.  he was forcing cam to run slow developing play actions out of the shotgun in mike martz-esque minimal pass protection schemes and wasn't working greg olsen in to the gameplan seemingly at all.  when we finally switched to more pro formations with two tights with cam under center or in more traditional shotgun formations he ripped off 14 TDs to 4 INTs over the final 9 weeks of the season.

[The NFL Shield At Midfield]

here's an example of what i'm talking about.  it's a play against denver when cam got sacked for a safety.  i grabbed some screens from gamerewind coaches film:

 

 

here are three caps basically from the snap to the point right before the safety:

 

 

there are no checkdown options anywhere.  three deep routes, the shortest of which was a drag route across the middle.  if you watch it at game speed brandon lafell (#11) hadn't even made his cut when newton was getting hit.

[FootballMaestro]

the walsh west coast variant that the redskins run is all about working short and intermediate routes and fast releases off three step drops.  the read option stuff out of the pistol and shotgun was, of course, a noticeable wrinkle.  SF was bootleg city when steve young was the starting QB and it clearly rubbed off on the shanahans.  how good or bad griffins' offensive line is is secondary to that.

 

the "more intelligent and accurate than newton" crap is what i have a problem with.  first, cam learned how to run an NFL offense in six weeks, okay?  he's not stupid.

 

second, their offenses couldn't be more different, not only from a WCO vs. coryell standpoint, but also a playcalling and scheme one.  the redskins actually fed their backs the ball and ran well designed play action fakes.  the panthers did not, and there is a wealth of material on this board about the read option fiasco our egomaniac former offensive coordinator (now the browns' problem) put us through for 8 or 9 weeks straight.  he was forcing cam to run slow developing play actions out of the shotgun in mike martz-esque minimal pass protection schemes and wasn't working greg olsen in to the gameplan seemingly at all.  when we finally switched to more pro sets with two tights with cam under center or in more traditional shotgun formations he ripped off 14 TDs to 4 INTs over the final 9 weeks of the season.

 

Good post. 

 

And I would like to add (the bolded portion) that this is exactly the NFL offense that Cam ran to success during his rookie season. 

 

It was Chud (and Rivera to a lesser degree), that decided to focus more on the Read Option, less pro sets before the 2012 season even started during the summer of 2012, to disastrous results (as you indicated) the first half of the 2012 season. 

 

As we all know: Once the Panthers went back to a more conventional NFL offense (as during Cam's Rookie season), with less of, quicker developing Read Option, added with a few more drop offs, check downs, Cam was right where he left off in 2011. 

 

PS: You were so correct. Cam walked right into the league, and was throwing deep downfield (while waiting for receivers to get open, the play to develop) in a NFL offense against top teams with great results. 

[Jakob]

I like how NC_Skins had to prove everyone right with his GIF's

 

[FootballMaestro]

I like how NC_Skins had to prove everyone right with his GIF's

 

 

Funny/Lol. 

 

He obviously lost the battle to begin with. Cause it's clear he has no idea the type of offense RG3 runs and his limitations as a QB (talking about the offensive line for RG3's quick throws for one example). 

 

Nonetheless, he's on here trying to argue with us, and prove his case with silly GIF's he doesn't even understand. He's obviously out of his depth. 

 

Sad/SMH

[Jakob]

Funny/Lol. 

 

He obviously lost the battle to begin with. Cause it's clear he has no idea the type of offense RG3 runs and his limitations as a QB. 

 

But he's on here trying to argue with us, and prove his case. 

 

Said. SMH

He probably isn't even a Redskins fan, probably one of us who made another account, the reason I say that is he has no idea what he is talking about, probably never watched RG3 play. I'm pretty sure some 8 year old Redskins fans could defend him better.

[NC_Skins]

the "more intelligent and accurate than newton" crap is what i have a problem with.  first, cam learned how to run an NFL offense in six weeks, okay?  he's not stupid.

 

 

You can be offended by me claiming RGIII is more intelligent than Cam Newton, but I think we can look back to college to see that claim is a no brainer. Ever think that Chud used that read-option stuff with Cam to help him along with the offense while learning the over all offense? I mean, didn't it net Cam ROTY and broke the rookie record for passing yards? If you want to give Chud all the blame, you have to give him the credit as well.

 

 

second, their offenses couldn't be more different, not only from a WCO vs. coryell standpoint, but also a playcalling and scheme one.  the redskins actually fed their backs the ball and ran well designed play action fakes.  the panthers did not, and there is a wealth of material on this board about the read option fiasco our egomaniac former offensive coordinator (now the browns' problem) put us through for 8 or 9 weeks straight.  he was forcing cam to run slow developing play actions out of the shotgun in mike martz-esque minimal pass protection schemes and wasn't working greg olsen in to the gameplan seemingly at all.  when we finally switched to more pro formations with two tights with cam under center or in more traditional shotgun formations he ripped off 14 TDs to 4 INTs over the final 9 weeks of the season.

 

I'm not claiming they offense are alike so not sure where that came from. yes, we fed our RBs the balls because their offense dictates the run opens it up for the passing game. It was that way in Denver, in Houston, and now in Washington. So here is a question, why are you paying all that money to two backs you aren't utilizing?

 

I think time will tell about both quarterbacks. It's too soon to be annointing any of these guys anything.

[Jakob]

Nobody except a panther fan calls him Chud, the cover has been blown nc_skins