Wilt Chamberlain's resume

[CarolinaNCSU]

Good post KT. I'll still take Russell if I'm starting a team (smart or not), almost like I'd take Jeter in his prime (despite him not being an MVP guy most of his career). Can't go wrong with either though.

[Falcons1stPanthers2nd]

I'd take Jordan over any of em.

[ZB1224]

I'd take Jordan over any of em.

Well yeah, he's the undisputed GOAT lol.

[nickzz]

that house is pretty fuging awesome

[Herbert The Love Bug]

IMO Adam Morrison is the greatest college basketball player of all time

[Kevin Greene]

IMO Adam Morrison is the greatest college basketball player of all time

He's also reached the pinnacle of success in the NBA, a World Championship.

[King Taharqa]

Well yeah, he's the undisputed GOAT lol.

Not according to Wiltie or Bill Russell.

[ZB1224]

Not according to Wiltie or Bill Russell.

Oh really? I tried to look it up to see for myself, but couldn't find anything in a quick search. Not that I don't believe you, but I'd like to see the quote. Although, I suppose that it still wouldn't change my mind.

[Kevin Greene]

Don't know if anyone ever watches Feherty but he had Bobby Knight on and Knight said Bill Russell was the greatest basketball mind ever to play the game.

Apparently Feherty's Bill Russell interview was supposed to be stellar as well but I haven't caught it yet.

http://www.golfchannel.com/tv/feherty/

[RelaxImaPro]

Not according to Wiltie or Bill Russell.

[King Taharqa]

Big Wiltie says:

from Who's Running The Asylum?

"I would never say that Michael Jordan thinks of himself as a god, but in his followers' eyes he has become the Exalted One. Commercials that focus on his ability to fly and walk on water have done nothing to dispel this perception, and the media have played right along. In an interview, MJ was asked to whom he was going to bequeath his mantle when he retired. He calmly replied, 'Anfernee Hardaway seems to be the most worthy prospect.'

It is taken for granted that MJ has an exclusive patent on greatness. No one questions the assumption that the mantle of superiority belongs to him alone-to keep or to pass on as he sees fit.

Team sports, by definition, involve teamwork. Players do different things, but each makes their special contribution to their team. All are working towards one common goal. How anyone decides to value a player's importance to the team is a subjective matter.

Can we agree that Jordan plays a position in a team game? He wouldn't qualify as the greatest center, nor is he the greatest ball handler, or the greatest at many of the other things he does on the court. Going one-on-one against other top players, I don't see him consistently coming out on top.

Jordan is obviously forgetting that he is a guard, and if he had to guard some of the guys who play the center position, he could be in trouble. Think back to what happened to Dr. J, for example. He wore the 'greatest' laurels in his time just as MJ does today, yet Kareem completely annihilated him in a one-on-one match. (So what does that make Kareem?) It's my belief that the same thing would happen if MJ were to go one-on-one against certain of today's quality players. He could be destroyed.

Every contemporary game is recorded and stored on a master tape in some television studio, and probably on video tape in thousands of homes, as well. Unfortunately, we earlier players were not recorded in this way, and consequently we are not able to show today's young whippersnappers what we were capable of doing.

We have never really had a chance to let people see just how great some of us were during our prime. It could be that the 'ooh's' and 'aah's' given to Michael each time he makes one of his electrifying plays would pale in comparison if today's fans could see the great Elgin Baylor do his thing, or watch Connie Hawkins in one of his miracle drives (and I could go on, of course).

It's all relative, in any case, and 'great' is only a relative term. A player can look different when he is playing with (or against) different teams. Michael, for example, looked far from the greatest when he played on the 1992 Olympic team. At that juncture, everyone thought Charles Barkley was by far the best. Playing with today's Chicago team, MJ may be the greatest, but he might not appear to be so great if he were playing with the Sacramento Kings. And wha tif he had been drafted by Boston, and had to play in the shadow of the already-established Larry Bird? Under those circumstances, would he still have become the great MJ we know and love?

Anyone who follows sports is aware of the advantage of having a superstar on your team. Those benefits become increasingly crucial in the later moments of a game when everything is so very important. It's the nature of the game that if the ball is given to your superstar, any calls that are made are apt to go his way. Everybody wants to go to heaven-even the referees (who are well aware of where their interests lie). So, if your superstar is looked upon as the Divine One-almost as a second coming-you have a superstar player who is even more intimidating, and harder yet to make a call against.

I recently watched Jordan get away with flagrantly dressing down another official, an offense which every one-even the chicken-poo announcers-agreed should have resulted in a technical. But this technical would have put him out of the game: so, of course, it was not called. This man is the the man!

My object in talking about Michael's becoming so god-like is not to bring him down. I just want to point out that when someone has that type of power and produces that kind of effect during a game, the result can turn out to be a minus for basketball instead of a plus. Michael's ability to get the better end of every call diminishes teams sports in general. This is not Michael's fault; he is doing his thing, and is not responsible for the actions of others-or is he? Has he, or has he not, earned the right to those respectful calls?

We have heard many times that Wayne Gretzky was protected by WhA teams: he was not thrown up against the boards as much, nor did he receive the kind of treatment that Gordie Howe and other big stars had to endure during their careers. Is there a parallel between the way Gretzky's treated and the Michael Jordan Treatment Syndrome?

I don't believe that it is good for any sport if one player is placed above the rest, not in what he is able to do, but in the treatment he receives. Michael has proved that is able to do almost anything he sets his mind to. Adding gifts of fire to his already burning flame is not only unnecessary, it's a rotten shame.

Respect for Michael's awe inspiring talent (which is hyped by unbelievable media attention) has placed him in an exalted position that produces a kind of fear response in his opponents. You see, even basketball players know that it's improper (even blasphemous) to take the Lord's name in vain; so you, as a player, damn sure don't want to be the one knock Him on his Royal Ass. And just in case you are not buying what I am preaching, tell me when you last saw anyone take MJ down when he drove the lane?

So, how would you play the great MJ, Wiltie? I'd play him like Moses did with our real God: I'd meet him at the summit.

You have to meet Michael at the summit. When he comes gliding and sliding through the basket for one of his famous dunks, you have to put somebody on him. Even my favorite, Sir Charles, who has almost more heart than the real God Himself, let's Michael slide through. As for other players, I can't account for their reluctance. They surely can't be afraid that they are going to get hurt physically, since Michael weighs far less than most players who guard him in the paint.

The influence of fear factor might be understandable if it were Shaq they were meeting head-on, time after time. Shaq weighs about 330 pounds, but six-foot-seven Jordan weighs only about 197. He is actually rather skinny compared with soe of the big boys who are supposed to be covering the middle. So, why don't they hit him-perhaps even risking a flagrant foul? An occasional confrontation would cause Michael to think before driving to the basket next time.

I remember Magic Johnson's second game after coming back from his self-imposed retirement. He was playing against the Bulls in the Los Angeles Forum, and in his first drive down the middle, Rodman clothes-lined him, almost taking his head off.

That kind of thing never seems to happen to MJ. There almost seems to be unwritten hands-off rule for him. We all know, of course, that Rodman is a little bit crazy, but you can't be timid out there on the court! And no could deny that Rodman plays the game with the right kind of verve.

A defensive player actually has an advantage when guarding Michael, for two reasons: (1) the basket doesn't move, so you know where Michael is going; and (2) you know for certain that the last thing (the very last thing) that Michael wants to do is pass the ball. You know he's going to shoot it. With those two bits of data tucked away in your memory bank, the advantage is all yours-or least it should be.

In the good old days, I had to carry two and three guys to the basket with me. (They were always looking for a free ride.) But, all kidding aside, my opponents were not going to let me go in there unopposed. Even Shaq, big as he is, gets hammered pretty hard as he goes to the basket. That's the price that all the stars have to pay for doing their thing against the opposition.

You can't just let the superstars do it their own way, standing there smiling and waving at them as they go by. MJ gets enough respect and cheers as it is-and from both directions. The way the fans on both sides cheer for him makes every game a home game for Michael, no matter what arena he is in.

For the opposing team to hear more cheers for MJ than they get does not help to bring out their best. It is one thing to show respect for athletes you admire, but when they are on the opposing team, and you cheer for them, more than you cheer for your own side, that is really hard on the home team, and ego-deflating to say the least.

After the Bulls' seventy first win of the season, reporters who were surrounding Michael Jordan asked him not to be bashful, but to tell him who he thought was the best basketball player of all time. Quite seriously, he replied, "I think it's me." Now, all of us have a right to at least one vote, and, understandably, he chose to use that vote for himself. But on the other hand, he might have said, "I can speak only about the players I have actually played against, of course, and, of those players, I think I'm the best." That would have been a fairer statement, since there were a number of legendary players he never faced on the court. (And who knows what the outcome would have been in a one-on-one contest between MJ and a non-guard.)

An athlete's stature has always been established by the caliber of opponents he or she has faced. I learned the truth of his statement as I watched the great boxers who have fought during my lifetime. It holds true in basketball as well as boxing (or in any other sport, for that matter).

I would give a lot to have seen MJ play against Walt Frazier or KC Jones of the Celtics, two of the greatest defensive players of my time-or against Jerry West, a guy who could do it at both ends. And how would MJ have handled Oscar Robertson, the Big O? No one I know could have done it! If we were considering only three players of this era, Michael would fall behind two or three: Magic Johnson, or course, and my favorites, Larry Bird and Charles Barkley. When you keep in mind that basketball is a team game, we'd have to conclude that those three guys have made a larger contribution."

[King Taharqa]

Kareem's take:

"I have nothing but respect for you my friend as an athlete and knowledgeable basketball mind. But you are way off in your assessment of who is the greatest player of all time and the greatest scorer of all time," Abdul-Jabbar wrote on kareemabduljabbar.com. "Your comments are off because of your limited perspective."

Abdul-Jabbar had plenty to disagree with in his open letter on his website called "How Soon They Forget: An Open Letter to Scottie Pippen."

He challenged the notion of Jordan as the greatest scorer by saying that crown belongs to Wilt Chamberlain, citing Chamberlain's 1961-62 season when he averaged 50.4 points and 25.7 rebounds. Abdul-Jabbar, who is the league's all-time points leader, also wrote about Chamberlain's 100-point game and the smaller league size, which he said meant there was better talent in the league then compared to when Jordan played from the 1980s to the 2000s.

"So MJ has to be appraised in perspective," Abdul-Jabbar wrote. "His incredible athletic ability, charisma and leadership on the court helped to make basketball popular around the world -- no question about that. But in terms of greatness MJ has to take a backseat to The Stilt."

The former Lakers and Bucks center didn't stop there, though, as he also compared Jordan to Bill Russell and his eight straight titles, as well as Russell's profound career rebounding average. He only mentioned James once in the letter.

"Bill played on a total of 11 Championship teams and as you very well know, Scottie, the ring is the thing, and everything else is just statistics. So I would advise you to do a little homework before crowning Michael or LeBron with the title of best ever," Abdul-Jabbar wrote.

http://sports.espn.go.com/new-york/nba/news/story?id=6613625

Kareem could've propped himself up as the GOAT. He's got 6 MVPs, 6 rings, all time scoring record, and a signature move that has never been duplicated since. But he even says his mentor Wilt is the GOAT.

[ZB1224]

Very interesting reads and I do fully believe that you can make a strong case for Wilt being the most talented individual to ever play basketball. Although, I am going to have to respectfully disagree with those guys, because I fully believe that MJ is the greatest basketball player of all time. Some other players that you could make an argument for are Kareem and Magic.

[RelaxImaPro]

Wow, I've got respect for Wilt and what he did. He's definitely one of the all-time greats and the most physically dominant force the league has ever seen... but wow, he sounds like one bitter ass old man in that story you posted. Seriously...

"Well youngins back in my day we walked 20 miles uphill in the snow both ways..."

He said he didn't see MJ consistently come out on top when he went one-on-one? LOL, wtf was he watching? I guess Michael consistently averaged at least 30 ppg a season from being a scrub who couldn't beat his defender... then you got him winning DPOY on the other side of the ball and consistently placed to the All-Defensive Team while leading the league in steals a few times as well. Yeah, sounds to me like MJ was overwhelmed by his matchup on a consistent basis. And these were during the days before he even won a championship and gained that 'exalted' legendary superstar status that Wilt seems to think he came out the womb with. MJ has received favorable calls throughout his career, sure, but it wasn't as extreme as Wilt is making it out... and it probably wasn't until the 2nd 3-peat that Jordan became basketball 'God' or whatever crazy poo Wilt is talking.

He said the defense just tucked their heads between their ass and cowered in fear as Jordan glided to the basket? Well, I guess he didn't watch much of the 80s and early 90s of Jordan's career then... funny how he conspicuously left out the Bad Boy Pistons and the 'Jordan Rules'. Wilt ever heard of Bill Laimbeer? Jordan routinely took some of the hardest fouls you'll ever see when he played the Bad Boys. Rodman also got his damn fair share of 'clotheslines' on Jordan before he joined up with the Bulls. Even if defenders were that intimidated by Jordan like he said, then what does that say about MJ? Intimidation, mind games, etc. are part of the game... and it was a part of the game MJ was notoriously good at it. That's something that is less hyped by the media because they don't want to ruin MJ's perfect commercial image... contrary to popular belief Mike was quite the asshole on and off the court and was completely ruthless when it came to gaining a competitive edge. And he was psychotically competitive. One hell of a combination when combined with his already exceptional talents.

He wondered what Mike would look like playing against some big men? Well... what fuging NBA was he watching during that era? It was without a doubt the best time for big men in league history. Mount Mutombo, Patrick Ewing, Shaq, David Robinson, Hakeem Olajuwon, Charles Barkley (not really much of a big man, but meh), Karl Malone, etc, etc. all in their prime. That was what made MJ unique, he was a guard that dominated a big man's league. Of course they tried to stop him... they just couldn't stop him (not consistently anyways... I think Jordan was held to less than double digit figures in points like only once or twice in his career or something like that. It happened during his rookie season). How many times have you seen Jordan in his athletic driving days go up to the basket to met by pretty much the entire team and then he pulls off one of his amazingly athletic layups that just completely penetrates the defense? A defender can't consistently stop someone who can pull moves off like that routinely without fouling out. MJ had amazing vertical, hangtime, and body control which led to his 'wtf how did he make that' moments.

Sorry Wilt, your 50 ppg 25 rpg season and 100 point game came in a weak ass era where your stats are inflated beyond belief. Not to mention you were notoriously a stat chaser... why else would a fugin Center lead the league in assists one season? Yeah, okay... that's a nice accolade until you actually sit down and think about it. Not to mention it was a direct result of the criticism he received for being a ball hog.

You wanna' see some retarded stats? Put Shaq from the year 2000 in the 50's and 60's era of basketball. He dominated his competition on a regular basis when it was made up of more than 6 foot questionably unathletic players. Hence Hack-a-Shaq.

MJ came into the league on a bad team as pretty much the only viable scoring option during the days of Magic's Lakers and Bird's Celtics and Isiah's Pistons. I wouldn't necessarily say he was overshadowed by those players as much as he was overshadowed by those teams... all three of those are some of the best teams in league history. The Bulls at that time was pretty much just Michael Jordan. Everyone knew he was gonna shoot but he still got his, even without being 7 foot tall. In his 2nd season returning from injury didn't he drop 63 points in the playoffs (a playoff record that remains to this day) on Bird's Celtics that was stacked with HOFers? Yet they still lost even after a remarkable shooting display such as that. We should be familiar with team situations like that with us being Panthers fans and all...

There's a nice story out there somewhere about the '92 Dream Team (not sure where) that's a nice insight into the competitive psyche of Michael Jordan. It was during their practices. Here he was playing with the very best in the world and they still acknowledged him as a pro's pro. It was also at this time that Magic officially passed the torch onto MJ after they butted heads in practice. It was around that time that Magic (who is the 2nd or 3rd best of all-time imo), as good as he was, realized that Jordan was just a completely different beast. Now every time you ever hear of Magic talking about MJ he unquestionably names him the GOAT. He's also called him the ultimate 1-on-1 player (sorry Wilt, I'll take Magic's word over yours, since... you know, he actually played against and practiced with him).