I Have Less Faith In Rivera After Today

[rayzor]

In terms of Rivera vs. Harbaugh, winners win and losers make excuses and look for stats.

this.

winning is all that matters. everything not pointing to this is grasping at straws.

thats a coaches job, to win. to turn his team into winners.

rivera isnt doing it. if he cant this next year then we find someone who can.

[fieryprophet]

this.

winning is all that matters. everything not pointing to this is grasping at straws.

thats a coaches job, to win. to turn his team into winners.

rivera isnt doing it. if he cant this next year then we find someone who can.

That's fine. I'm not arguing that we shouldn't be winning, and I definitely want to see improvement out of Rivera. But these comparisons against Harbaugh make me livid, because they're simply wrong. WRONG. I hate it when people uses wins to argue that Dalton is better than Cam when the FILM shows that it's not true, and I hate when the same is applied to coaches. People wouldn't know what a coach brings to the game if it hit them across the face, so they just assume the coach is responsible for every single result.

[rayzor]

coaches are held to a different standard. winning. thats all that matters. no other stat. no other metric. just winning.

[beastson]

That's fine. I'm not arguing that we shouldn't be winning, and I definitely want to see improvement out of Rivera. But these comparisons against Harbaugh make me livid, because they're simply wrong. WRONG. I hate it when people uses wins to argue that Dalton is better than Cam when the FILM shows that it's not true, and I hate when the same is applied to coaches. People wouldn't know what a coach brings to the game if it hit them across the face, so they just assume the coach is responsible for every single result.

That's 2 different things though. We all know Dalton isn't better than Cam. I can come up with 2 questionable TOUGH decisions the brothers made that has benefited their team. The firing of Cam, their OC and the switch from Smith to Colin

[Wine&Cheese]

for not being happy about having a HC that cant figure out how to win?

it's amazing to me how complacent people are about having a perenial losing team.

i can't wait until the "it is what it is" apathetic culture is gone.

I dont know, will the culture ever change? It seems like it has been this way since the beginning of time.

"Great, 7-9 but I see improvement and we had a lot of injuries but we have something to build on... Next year PLAYOFFS for sure!" (Insert 20XX season "RESET HOPE" button here)

Sigh...

[fieryprophet]

That's 2 different things though. We all know Dalton isn't better than Cam. I can come up with 2 questionable TOUGH decisions the brothers made that has benefited their team. The firing of Cam, their OC and the switch from Smith to Colin

Biscotti told John to fire Cameron or else. People forget that Kaep came in for an injured Smith, which made Jim's decision for him. He used the lame "hot hand" line of reasoning, hardly sounds like a coach willing to make a change without an excuse to prop it up. Once Kaep played well there was no pressure to do otherwise. But I'll tell you what that move DID do; it demonstrated that Harbaugh is perfectly willing to talk up a player, call him elite, then try to dump him for Peyton, then go back to him like nothing ever happened, then bench him when he's playing well just because of injury. And we're supposed to applaud that unwillingness to be a man and say the truth, that your QB isn't very good and you will look into alternatives?

There's a lot of things Rivera can be called, but a hypocrite or a liar is not one of them.

[TANTRIC-NINJA]

I dont know, will the culture ever change? It seems like it has been this way since the beginning of time.

"Great, 7-9 but I see improvement and we had a lot of injuries but we have something to build on... Next year PLAYOFFS for sure!" (Insert 20XX season "RESET HOPE" button here)

Sigh...

It gets old..to me i think why I dont understand the Rivera hate is that all the things that have happened last two seasons is just another day in Pantherland.. Weve seen this before.. But not an attacking defense since Capers. I see unique elements I like that i do not want to regress back to..

[ThunderKatt]

If we don't have a successful season this year I hope Jr has the balls to show Rivera the egress and end this misery us the fans have been going.

[Fan01]

Fans don't have a good conception of history or that you can't judge a player or coach based on one single variable.

Dan Marion doesn't suck as a QB because he didn't win a Superbowl.

George Seifret wasn't a great coach because he won a Superbowl (with Walsh's players and system)

Bill Belichick wasn't a horrible coach because he didn't win as the Brown's head coach.

Those are not excuses. You have to look at a player or coach over a lot period of time and critique them over numerous things they do or don't do. Sometimes the result is from a great decision and sometimes really bad things happen from a great decision. A coach calls the perfect play but the receiver runs the wrong route. The coach makes a horrible call but the receiver makes a great catch in triple coverage.

Stop making assumptions and blanket statements. Start looking at things in context and accounting for the variables that affect what you're trying to judge.

[beastson]

Biscotti told John to fire Cameron or else. People forget that Kaep came in for an injured Smith, which made Jim's decision for him. He used the lame "hot hand" line of reasoning, hardly sounds like a coach willing to make a change without an excuse to prop it up. Once Kaep played well there was no pressure to do otherwise. But I'll tell you what that move DID do; it demonstrated that Harbaugh is perfectly willing to talk up a player, call him elite, then try to dump him for Peyton, then go back to him like nothing ever happened, then bench him when he's playing well just because of injury. And we're supposed to applaud that unwillingness to be a man and say the truth, that your QB isn't very good and you will look into alternatives?

There's a lot of things Rivera can be called, but a hypocrite or a liar is not one of them.

They drafted Colin, it was eventually going to be the plan. Alex wasn't going to win a championship in their mind. Alex could have went back to being the starter, they opted otherwise. What if Colin didn't work out and they lost games, they would have said he should kept Alex in.

And John fired Cam. They had an argument. I am in Baltimore, everybody wanted him gone. The timing of it is what caused confusion

[LinvilleGorge]

Fans don't have a good conception of history or that you can't judge a player or coach based on one single variable.

Dan Marion doesn't suck as a QB because he didn't win a Superbowl.

George Seifret wasn't a great coach because he won a Superbowl (with Walsh's players and system)

Bill Belichick wasn't a horrible coach because he didn't win as the Brown's head coach.

Those are not excuses. You have to look at a player or coach over a lot period of time and critique them over numerous things they do or don't do. Sometimes the result is from a great decision and sometimes really bad things happen from a great decision. A coach calls the perfect play but the receiver runs the wrong route. The coach makes a horrible call but the receiver makes a great catch in triple coverage.

Stop making assumptions and blanket statements. Start looking at things in context and accounting for the variables that affect what you're trying to judge.

Okay, you want to look at things in context, how about 3 wins when still in playoff contention? That's right, 10 of Rivera's wins have come after we were already out of the playoff race. Lots of meaningless late season wins in the past two years. How about Rivera's abysmal record in games decided by one score or less? I'm too lazy to look it up right now and don't know it off the top of my head, but feel free to do so if you'd like.

[Gabeking]

Okay, you want to look at things in context, how about 3 wins when still in playoff contention? That's right, 10 of Rivera's wins have come after we were already out of the playoff race. Lots of meaningless late season wins in the past two years. How about Rivera's abysmal record in games decided by one score or less? I'm too lazy to look it up right now and don't know it off the top of my head, but feel free to do so if you'd like.

Here we go with the close record BS... Look at chuck noll and bill wash's first few seasons in the league and their records in close games, were they amazing? (Disclaimer: not saying Rivera will be a Walsh or a noll, just saying that sort of argument is mostly invalid)

[CPF4LIFE]

STOP fuging DEFENDING RIVERA!!

[KendrickPanther]

Losing and not making the playoffs gets old everywhere. In 2005 I watched the Panthers kick tail in the Georgia Dome and all the Atlanta Fans were emo as fug about losing for 40 years. Telling me how they wish they won as often as the Panthers. San Francisco has two winning seasons since 2003, we have 3. Funny how you can make the numbers say whatever the hell you want by picking the cutoff dates.

ATL is 7-11 in the playoffs all time. We are 6-4. ATL has a 6 winning seasons in the last 9 years and they still have an all time history of losing by a wide margin.