Luck, Griffin, Wilson, Kaepernick, Ponder, Dalton, Fox. All in playoffs.

[CPF4LIFE]

Here is our 2012 talent.

Cam, Smith, Luke, CJ, Hardy. That isn't a loaded roster with talent that somehow missed the playoffs. No one else stands out or is a key cog in what we did.

guys on IR or play small roles don't carry the weight some imply when the "talent" conversation come up. You need talent to be at the positons that actually matter and play every down.

Those guys have also been playing from day 1, who knows what we would have seen from DJ Campbell, Josh Thomas, and Dockery if they got the call earlier, but that also goes back to Rivera for not making changes sooner.

[charlotte49er]

I know one thing; that Colts team is really bad. They have a bad defense, bad offensive line, and Luck wins despite his turnovers. I don't really care anymore, the Panthers just piss me off so much doing the season it don't make since. We go 3-7 in till the month of December and some how we go 4-0 and all of sudden Rivera is safe. I don't understand that but whatever. Everybody already know that JR is cheap and going to bring back Rivera.

I'm not sure how you can say your owner is cheap. The Panthers are in Cap Space Hell next season. (Blame Hurney??) They are going to shed Salaries of veterans if they want to stay under the cap and even afford the draft pics.

The porblem with that is, the Panthers will have to shed some good players and replace them with rookies in order to keep under the cap. That won't help a 7-9 team. Also I'm not sure what person will want to step in as GM and have to do that. You are talking a rebuilding process that will take several years! (Or a BIG jump in the cap!)

[CRA]

Steve is the ultimate playmaker and leader obviously. But we can win games with Olsen and Lafell. Cam targets those guys a lot and he targets Murphy too much, IMO.

Cam doesn't target Murphy too much....his recieving targets aren't good enough. Past 2 seasons show that. He didn't target Legatron too much either.....Legatron just sucked. Cam can't just target Smith like Jake Delhomme did all those years and sprinkle some to LaFell.

Take a WR like Smith out. Coverages change. Routes harder for LaFell. Cam is a big play QB. The fact Steve Smith isn't Steve Smith actually IS going to be an issue. Steve can't take the top off a D anymore. They are asking scrubs to pretend to do it.

Smith should be our #2.....issue he is our #1. Smith realized it needed to change years ago. Yet people will respond that Smith can be our #1 for years and years to come.

[footballisasport]

Turnover differential:

Carolina: +1

Washington: +17

Indianapolis: -12 (True playoff team right here)

Seattle: +13

San Francisco: +9

Cincinnati: +4

Denver: -1 (fumbles were a big problem for them)

For the rookies outside of Luck, look at these offensive rankings:

Seattle: rushing (3rd), Passing (27th)

Washington: 1st, 20th

San Francisco: 4th, 23rd

Obviously all those teams are helped out by their QB being so mobile. But do I need to point to the runningback's stats on all those teams? Gore - 12K, Morris - 16K, Lynch - 15k

Cam was the leading rusher with 40 less attempts...

Stopping the run is how you stuff these QBs. We did it marginally well against Morris and RG3 wasn't the same because play action wasn't as effective.

You're right. Watching the Skins game last night, even thou I love RG, I simply wasn't impress with his game play. Morris carried that team last night. RG has 3 free INTS handed to him and he only was able comvert one into some points.

I can't help but wonder where this team would have been had they been able to have the som of the players RG had around him.

[Delhommey]

Due to two games where the ref calls were so bad and Chud calling a rollout from the goalline when he has a 6' 5" 250 lbs QB, Seattle is 10-6.

Take those gifts away and they're 7-9.

It's a little bit play calling, a little bit luck. No matter what, I think we'll return to the mean next year (and the playoffs).

[CRA]

Those guys have also been playing from day 1, who knows what we would have seen from DJ Campbell, Josh Thomas, and Dockery if they got the call earlier, but that also goes back to Rivera for not making changes sooner.

that is Rivera making lemonade out of lemons. Every NFL roster has those caliber players.

[thennek]

The Panthers are on record of saying they want to build through the draft (similar to the Steelers way). In theory, this method is effective, however, the Panthers have really missed badly on some key draft picks and made some very questionable 'trading up' on draft day that set this team back. We are assuming Hurney made all of these decisions, and I sure hope that is the case. For every miss or trade up, it set this team back. Other teams miss too, but they seem to have recovered faster/better than the Panthers.

Just to name a few:

Clausen - 2nd round

Edwards - trading a 2nd round which turned out to be the 1st pick of the 2nd round

Otah -

Stewart - trading up to get a great RB, but we already had Williams.

Everette Brown - trading a 1st rounder

[footballisasport]

Griffin/Ponder have been helped by a really great run game. I doubt they would have made the playoffs without Morris/Peterson.

Wilson has been helped by his team greatly overachieving and having a gritty defense.

Kaepernick was dropped into a DREAM situation for a rookie QB.

John Fox made the playoffs with The Golden Calf of Bristol....it was a given that he was going this year with Peyton.

Andy Dalton's success really surprises me because on the surface the Bengals don't look that good. I'm going to chalk it up to some great coaching.

What Andrew luck has done just defies all logic. He was put into an awful situation and has somehow made the Colts playoff contenders again. Maybe he really is the next Manning?

What really annoys me is that I think the Panthers are more talented than all of those teams. Cam really seems like the only person on the team who cares at times. I don't know if it's to blame on the coaches or if it's just pansy players.

In all honesty, if the Colts wanted to invest time helping their back-up QB succeed in 2011 and forgo gettng Luck they could have. I'm not buying the whole Luck came in and save the day stuff. Especially when this team was a Play-off contending team a season before with Peyton and could have been had they kept Peyton instead of trading him for Luck. This seems like another made for TV hype like the one with The Golden Calf of Bristol.

The guy had more Ints than Cam. Supposedly did what Cam did last year in passing stats and his team gets to the play off comfortably his first season and Cam didn't with all that he did his rookie in both passing and rush TDs that season. Yeah right. The Colts, as a team, was not as bad as projected by the media.

[CRA]

In all honesty, if the Colts wanted to invest time helping their back-up QB succeed in 2011 and forgo gettng Luck they could have. I'm not buying the whole Luck came in and save the day stuff. Especially when this team was a Play-off contending team a season before with Peyton and could have been had they kept Peyton instead of trading him for Luck. This seems like another made for TV hype like the one with The Golden Calf of Bristol.

The guy had more Ints than Cam. Supposedly did what Cam did last year in passing stats and his team gets to the play off comfortably his first season and Cam didn't with all that he did his rookie in both passing and rush TDs that season. Yeah right.

Luck accounted for less overall yards, less overall TDs than Newton. Luck had more turnovers.

Team sport. QB play is important.....but they don't actually win and lose on their own.

[nosuchthingasapanther]

Stewart - trading up to get a great RB, but we already had Williams.

carolina didn't trade up to get stewart.

[footballisasport]

Luck accounted for less overall yards, less overall TDs than Newton. Luck had more turnovers.

Team sport. QB play is important.....but they don't actually win and lose on their own.

You're right.

I sometimes believe, for whatever reason, some on here put way to much emphasis on the role of the QB.

If a QB has fire in his belly to win. Those around him have to have twice the amount of fire in their bellies in order to win.

[mav1234]

luck's stats weren't as impressive as Cam's last year but tbh his game winning drivers were VERY big this year. not saying he is as good as Cam or anything like that, but you can't just look at his stats.

that being said I'd probably still vote for RG3 (or fug, alfred morris holy crap) for OROY.

[thennek]

That's right. The Panthers traded up to get Otah, not Stewart.

[Fox007]

Wilson should be OROY IMO

RG3 had like what 100 yards passing last night?

RG3 may not even be the best rookie on his own team.