Yasinkas: NFC South QB rankings

[ccase39]

Yeah, actually I would. I like Jake, he is a good guy and gives it his all. Not saying Bree's is not, I just like Jake and I'm proud to have him on my team. I believe Jake can win a Superbowl and also believe he gives us a better chance to win then anyone we could bring in right now. Yes, we lost in the playoffs but I'm just happy we got there, now lets hope we build on it.

Thats lame. If Brees was a Panther he would have won a super bowl by now and you know it. But as far as I am concerned Jake can stay in Carolina for years to come.

[Fireball77]

LOL @ Warner? The only way you LOL @ his picking Warner is if you think he is too old or not durable enough. The guy is legit as a very good QB. He helped put his team ahead in the SB and his defense blew it. That's the kind of thing Saints fans get mad about when people actually say that about Brees.

My hesitation with Rodgers would be he has had only one good year. I think he will be a better player than Brees but as of yet he hasn't proven that.

[Saint J]

Warner has about 1-2 years left. Brees has 6-8. They're nearly equal in the way they lead their teams anyway.

[Fireball77]

Thats lame. If Brees was a Panther he would have won a super bowl by now and you know it. But as far as I am concerned Jake can stay in Carolina for years to come.

I don't agree with that and it doesn't mean that Brees isn't good.

The 2003 Panthers lost the SB due to their defense failing.

The 2005 Panthers overachieved and while the D was good that year they didn't lose the NFCC just because of the QB play. Like the Saints this past year, they had a poor run game that year and would have had nothing left for the SB. And I don't think they would have beaten the Steelers in the SB anyway.

No QB on planet earth would have won the SB with the 2004, 2006 or 2007 Panthers. Too many holes.

2008 Panthers? I honestly believe that even if Jake hadn't had such a crappy game they still didn't have a great chance to win that game. Their defense stopped exactly nobody over the last half of the year. They gave up almost 30 PPG, and that was with the run game clicking and Jake doing a pretty good job most games. They pretty much had to score 30+ points every single game to make up for their defense. Does that sound familiar at all? It should. They were playing a very prolific pass offense much like the Saints and the Saints hung 30 pts on Carolina a mere 2 weeks prior. They gave up a TD right away to the Cards in an very easy drive before Jake had turned over the ball any time. They weren't going to stop the Cards. Or let me phrase it this way, I have absolutely no confidence whatsoever that they would have stopped the Cards whether they had Jake's crappy game or if he'd an efficient game. Heck the Steelers great D gave up far more points to them than their norm. And that brings me to the SB. Had the D actually stopped someone in AZ, and Brees had a great game and they had gone on to beat Philly (something that I doubted they could do as well due to the D and the fact that they just don't do well in any phase against Philly), I have no reason to believe that the Panthers with that D could have done any better than the Cards' D and I don't think Brees would have had better game than Warner who had a phenomenal day and still came up short.

[TheDeuce53]

I don't agree with that and it doesn't mean that Brees isn't good.

The 2003 Panthers lost the SB due to their defense failing.

The 2005 Panthers overachieved and while the D was good that year they didn't lose the NFCC just because of the QB play. Like the Saints this past year, they had a poor run game that year and would have had nothing left for the SB. And I don't think they would have beaten the Steelers in the SB anyway.

No QB on planet earth would have won the SB with the 2004, 2006 or 2007 Panthers. Too many holes.

2008 Panthers? I honestly believe that even if Jake hadn't had such a crappy game they still didn't have a great chance to win that game. Their defense stopped exactly nobody over the last half of the year. They gave up almost 30 PPG, and that was with the run game clicking and Jake doing a pretty good job most games. They pretty much had to score 30+ points every single game to make up for their defense. Does that sound familiar at all? It should. They were playing a very prolific pass offense much like the Saints and the Saints hung 30 pts on Carolina a mere 2 weeks prior. They gave up a TD right away to the Cards in an very easy drive before Jake had turned over the ball any time. They weren't going to stop the Cards. Or let me phrase it this way, I have absolutely no confidence whatsoever that they would have stopped the Cards whether they had Jake's crappy game or if he'd an efficient game. Heck the Steelers great D gave up far more points to them than their norm. And that brings me to the SB. Had the D actually stopped someone in AZ, and Brees had a great game and they had gone on to beat Philly (something that I doubted they could do as well due to the D and the fact that they just don't do well in any phase against Philly), I have no reason to believe that the Panthers with that D could have done any better than the Cards' D and I don't think Brees would have had better game than Warner who had a phenomenal day and still came up short.

If Jake doesn't turn the ball over 6 times the game could have been completely different.

The panthers lost by 3 TDs... take away even half of those turnovers and the outcome would have been completely different!! The Panthers defense didn't play especially well, but allowing 33 points when your QB turns the ball over 6 out of 13 possessions (plus a possession where 3 straight incomplete passes on 2nd and 5 led to a turnover on downs.

The Panthers' D only allowed 3 touchdowns and 4 FGs.. on SIX turnovers... I don't buy that the defense couldn't have competed with a better turnover ratio than 6-1.

[mantal]

Warner has about 1-2 years left. Brees has 6-8. They're nearly equal in the way they lead their teams anyway.

Yeah, you're absolutely right, but what does that have to do with how good a QB they are right now? The discussion, as I have understood it, is not about longevity, it's about current talent... Brees, not in the playoffs, Warner, in the Super Bowl, just sayin'...

And I'm not ripping Brees, he's a quality QB, no doubt about it...

[TheDeuce53]

LOL @ Warner and Rodgers. Your list might be considered legit until then.

Rodgers certainly does NOT deserve to be above Brees. That is a joke from someone reaching for QBs to put in front of Brees with no substantial reasoning. Warner probably doesn't either although he came the closest to matching Brees' fantastic 2008 output. Of course, Warner had the luxury of playing with Anquan Boldin and Larry Fitzgerald.. without a doubt the most talented WR corps in the league.

I wouldn't even say Roethlisburger is above Brees on the individual level... but Big Ben has come up big in the big games so I would let that slide.

In terms of productions over the past three years, Brees is top 3 easily... it's a shame he has had little to no defensive help since 2006 (when he led his team to the NFCCG and was competitive for 3 quarters).

Also I have my doubts that Rivers deserves to be above Brees... they did play on a neutral (and nasty, wet) field afterall and Brees came out on top.

[TheDeuce53]

Yeah, you're absolutely right, but what does that have to do with how good a QB they are right now? The discussion, as I have understood it, is not about longevity, it's about current talent... Brees, not in the playoffs, Warner, in the Super Bowl, just sayin'...

And I'm not ripping Brees, he's a quality QB, no doubt about it...

As I understand it, we aren't comparing teams.. we are comparing individual performances by a QB.

I mean, if we look at stats it is clear that Brees is the best QB in the league (top 3 at WORST). Of course no one here seems to care about the stats, instead they want to compare individual performances by comparing team performances (which doesn't make sense)

Everyone is putting Brady up there... but RIGHT NOW, Brady is coming off a season ending injury.. no one knows how he is going to do..

[mantal]

As I understand it, we aren't comparing teams.. we are comparing individual performances by a QB.

I mean, if we look at stats it is clear that Brees is the best QB in the league (top 3 at WORST). Of course no one here seems to care about the stats, instead they want to compare individual performances by comparing team performances (which doesn't make sense)

Everyone is putting Brady up there... but RIGHT NOW, Brady is coming off a season ending injury.. no one knows how he is going to do..

There's no doubt that when a QB throws over 5000 yards in a year he has to be included in the discussion, no doubt. But how many run yards did you guys have, i.e. how much of a pass happy offense was it? That's what I want to know... As I've said before, Brees is a quality player, I don't deny that for a second, wouldn't even try...

[Saint J]

Even when the team did have a good bit of balance in 2006, Brees still had a monster season.

[mantal]

Even when the team did have a good bit of balance in 2006, Brees still had a monster season.

Didn't really answer the question. If you want to bring the '06 season into it, that's fine, bring the stats for runs and passes and we'll talk. Of course this is the third time that I've said I like Brees as a QB, hope this will be the last I have to...

Ummm, wait a second, what happened in '07?

[Saint J]

Deuce and Reggie were hurt, and instead of turning to PT Payton decided to have a near 70/30 pass-run ratio.

[TheDeuce53]

There's no doubt that when a QB throws over 5000 yards in a year he has to be included in the discussion, no doubt. But how many run yards did you guys have, i.e. how much of a pass happy offense was it? That's what I want to know... As I've said before, Brees is a quality player, I don't deny that for a second, wouldn't even try...

Brees did throw the most passes... but he was also among the most accurate passers in the league and threw for the 2nd best yard-per-pass average in the league.

Also, you have to look at his intangibles. He was essentially playing with a rag-tag group of receivers (with Colston and Shockey out much of the season). Bush also missed 6-7 games. Another thing is that even though Brees dropped back more than any other QB in the league, he was sacked only 13 times (3rd best in the league).. a lot of that can be attributed to his quick release and good pocket presence.

Brees did play in a pass happy offense, but this isn't the first "pass happy" offense that the NFL has ever seen... but it IS only the 2nd time in history a player has put up over 5,000 yards in a season. Marino had 2 1000 yard receivers... Brees had none.

[Saint J]

Didn't really answer the question. If you want to bring the '06 season into it, that's fine, bring the stats for runs and passes and we'll talk. Of course this is the third time that I've said I like Brees as a QB, hope this will be the last I have to...

Ummm, wait a second, what happened in '07?

2006 Saints

1052 total plays

580 passes = 55%

472 rushes = 45%

2006 New Orleans Saints: Drew Brees- G/16 GS/16 Com/356 Att/554 PC/64.3 YDs/4,418 TD/26 INT/11