Yasinkas: NFC South QB rankings

[rayzor]

Brees is one of the most charitable guys in the NFL.

yeah, he's got a commercial and everything!

[Saint J]

I'd know considering I live around here.

[rayzor]

awesome. helps that you live near most of the guys in the NFL to compare.

[TheDeuce53]

Nobody that I can see is saying he isn't a good/very good QB right now. I don't think anyone is disputing his #1 ranking in the division. Saints fans are merely arguing he should be higher ranked NFL wise than some of us feel he should be. Just because we don't think he is the best in the NFL or elite doesn't mean we aren't giving him his due IMO.

To that end, it's also shortsighted not to look at the whole picture. Didn't he lead the league in pick sixes in 2007? I can't remember the last time Brady threw a pick six (or Jake for that matter, I think it was 2005 actually). He turns the ball over more (fumbles lost and INTs) than Brady or Manning do. He pretty much always has and still does. That's one reason I can't call him "elite".

Brees lost ONE fumble last year. He had 15 total turnovers... Jake had 6 in ONE game.

In 2007 (when Brady had his monster year) he had 12 total turnovers.. 8 INT and 4 lost fumbles... that is THREE less than Brees in 2008. Manning threw 12 picks last year and had 0 lost fumbles...

Brees drops back more than any other QB and still manages to have low turnovers.

Jake dropped back over 200 times LESS than Drew last season and still had the same number of turnovers as Drew (at 15).

Drew has 18 fumbles lost... Jake has 25 (Drew has played one more year than Jake has, BTW).

Brady has lost 29 fumbles in 7 years (Brees has lost 18 in 7 years).

Just about everything you have said is unsubstantiated and completely made up.

Here is a good one... Brady has 115 turnovers in 3,653 attempts. Drew Brees has 117 turnovers in 3,650 attempts. Of course, don't let actual facts construe your interpretation of Brees' "turnover problem".

Want to talk intangibles? How about the fact that Brees has about 65 less sacks than Tom Brady... or does that not count as an intangible (pocket presence/quick release/good footwork).

So if you want to talk about turnovers as being part of the "whole picture", you have to put Drew Brees up there with Tom Brady.. because they are almost identical.

In fact, let's see their numbers side by side!

Brees: -------- -------------------- Brady:

3,650 attempts -------- 3,653 attempts

63.9 pct completion ---------- 63.0 pct completion

26,258 yards ----------- 26,446 yards

7.2 avg ----------- 7.2 avg

168 TD ---------- 197 TD

99 INT ---------- 86 INT

139 sacks ---------- 203 sacks

89.4 rating ---------- 92.9 rating

47 fumbles (18 lost) ---------- 65 fumbles (29 lost)

:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:

Brees wins in sacks, Brady wins in TDs... outside of that their stats are almost identical.

Brees has over a 1000 more attempts than Jake Delohmme... and only 16 more turnovers...

What irks me is none of you are giving any actual reasons to rank Drew Brees outside of the top 5...

[TheDeuce53]

awesome. helps that you live near most of the guys in the NFL to compare.

"The prestigious Walter Payton NFL Man of the Year Award is unique among NFL honors. It is the only NFL award that recognizes a player for his community service activities as well as his excellence on the field."

Brees won that in 2006. That is kind of an indication that you are one of the most charitable players in the NFL..

[Fireball77]

Again, no one is disputing he is a very good/good QB.

Why is Jake in there? I never claimed he was great in that category (turnovers). You cannot dispute the late and close thing with Brees. There just is no way to justify that one.

They are closer than I thought in total turnovers, you are right. If you think Brees is better than Brady at avoiding sacks, well I can't say I agree with that.

The only edge Manning has ever had over Brady in my eyes playing wise is that he does turn the ball over a bit less than Brady so that doesn't surprise me that Manning is better.

Anyway...if you honestly can watch Tom Brady play and Drew Brees play and think they are the same QB ability wise, well I don't know what to tell you. I see the differences.

[TheDeuce53]

Again, no one is disputing he is a very good/good QB.

Why is Jake in there? I never claimed he was great in that category (turnovers).

The only edge Manning has ever had over Brady in my eyes playing wise is that he does turn the ball over a bit less than Brady so that doesn't surprise me. Anyway...if you honestly can watch Tom Brady play and Drew Brees play and think they are the same QB ability wise, well I don't know what to tell you. I see the differences.

I didn't say they were the same ability wise... but they sure do put up very, VERY similar production..

What you DID say, however, is that Brees turns the ball over more than Brady (even though their turnovers are essentially equal)

Of course, Drew Brees never had Randy Moss to throw to

I just put Jake in there for a reference

If you are going to say Brady is "elite" and Brees is "very good/good"... then what is a "great" quarterback?

[Saint J]

awesome. helps that you live near most of the guys in the NFL to compare.

He did win NFL Man of the Year like thedeuce posted, commercialz lol!

[Galvatron]

"The prestigious Walter Payton NFL Man of the Year Award is unique among NFL honors. It is the only NFL award that recognizes a player for his community service activities as well as his excellence on the field."

Brees won that in 2006. That is kind of an indication that you are one of the most charitable players in the NFL..

That was in 2006; Now Kurt Warner reigns supreme!!

[TheDeuce53]

That was in 2006; Now Kurt Warner reigns supreme!!

true

[top dawg]

I hear you, Deuce. I love Brees. Considering that he has had B/C grade receivers for most of his career, and has played on management-challenged teams, I believe that there is an argument to be made that he and Brady would have had the same outcome, but in reverse, for the last few years. Brady has the coach and the organization that are arguably second to none, while Brees has basically had an average team around him, save for Colston one year (and possibly Reggie Bush). To me, it's impressive (and should speak volumes).

[Fireball77]

If Brady was on the Lions would he have had the same career? No way. Neither would Manning or Brees. Coaching/FO certainly plays a role, no doubt.

However Brady has been more consistent year to year production wise than Brees and I don't think that with the exception of 2007 he has had far and away better players around him skill wise than Brees has. Brees has had some very good offensive minds tutoring him over his career too, so you can't say he is completely lacking there. As far as management challenged do you mean Marty? He was a pretty good HC IMO. He had pretty decent success coaching three different teams (record wise..he was 8-8 in Wash so that's just avg.). If you are referring to their FO, certainly their drafts have been pretty good under the Butler/Smith regime.

Also a point I was trying to edit into my prior response about turnovers but my computer acted up: all turnovers aren't created equal. If a QB throws 5 pick sixes and about the same # of INTs as another QB, his were more costly. Brady seldom throws INTS on his side of the field and I honestly can't remember the last pick 6 he threw.

[mantal]

Of course, it's Jake Delhomme!... Of course, once Drew Brees gets traded to Carolina, then he will be the best QB that's ever played the game. Homers are homers and realists are realists and never the twain shall meet... Get over it, where are you at?...

[guyinchesapeake]

I thought this thread was about NFC South QBs only?