There are 15 winning head coaches with jobs in this league (tenured)

[panthers55]

Shanahan "failed" in Oakland because Al Davis is psychotic and was firing assistants without his consent

and there's something to be said about past success that buys you a little bit more patience

You said 2 years was enough to show if a guy had head coaching ability. Should I continue my list of guys who took longer to win but ultimately won big in the league?? Or lets go down the list of successful proven head coaches who went somewhere new and didn't have a winning record in their first 2 years.

We can use Shanahan in Washington, Schottenheimer in San Diego off the top of my head.

Might have more to do with where they went instead of how good they were........

[Proudiddy]

The problem is, Rivera wins when it doesn't matter anymore... Which is how John Fox racked up an overall winning record prior to 2010 IIRC.

Had it not been for all of the meaningless wins Foxy racked up once the season was already lost, his record would've been much worse.

That's been our problem year in and year out here... Coaches that don't prepare or get their team ready for the big games every season... Even the worst coaches can eek out wins when other teams have lost most, if not all, of their motivation as the season winds down.

Rivera has proven to be no different. He loses when it counts and wins when it doesn't. DO NOT WANT.

[frash.exe]

You said 2 years was enough to show if a guy had head coaching ability. Should I continue my list of guys who took longer to win but ultimately won big in the league?? Or lets go down the list of successful proven head coaches who went somewhere new and didn't have a winning record in their first 2 years.

We can use Shanahan in Washington, Schottenheimer in San Diego off the top of my head.

Might have more to do with where they went instead of how good they were........

I mean if you want to keep bringing up guys from the 80s to justify giving Ron another year in the 2010s NFL we might as well start discussing whether or not stickum would improve completion percentage to our wide receivers.

[rayzor]

I've always said every coach deserves at least 3 seasons to get a team on track.

i've said that as well, but really after a couple years you can see plenty to decide what their future's gonna look like and if it's worth further exploration.

i just haven't seen it with rivera. i mean he could be a gary kubiak type but what are the chances of that? and why would we want to wait that long to see it happen? i think this year is as good as they get.

[panthers55]

Can the Rivera defenders make a legitimate case for keeping him in regards to how he has handled this team, record aside for a sec?

As in, besides having a bad record in his first two years as a head coach, in what way is his head coaching style similar to Belicheat and Jimmy Johnson?

Jimmy followed the most winningest coach in Cowboy history, Tom Landry, while Fox was the Panthers most successful coach. They both drafted a college quarterback with the number 1 pick in the draft, Troy Aikman and Cam Newton. They both struggled early and had defensive backgrounds.

[frash.exe]

They both have 12 rounds to pick draft prospects err wait

[rayzor]

They both have 12 rounds to pick draft prospects err wait

don't forget the salary cap they both had to deal with.

[panthers55]

I mean if you want to keep bringing up guys from the 80s to justify giving Ron another year in the 2010s NFL we might as well start discussing whether or not stickum would improve completion percentage to our wide receivers.

I was wondering how long it would take for you to take the conversation completely out of context with an off the wall example as if it was relevant. Typical Ragin Bull tactic. Didn't work then, didn't work now.........

[frash.exe]

THEIR OWNERS ARE BOTH NAMED JERRY

[panthers55]

They both have 12 rounds to pick draft prospects err wait

Instead now we have undrafted free agents where we fill up our rosters. Your point if you have one??

[SZ James (banned)]

O_O they both have double initials

e: All of Kubiak's kids have them also

[panthers55]

i've said that as well, but really after a couple years you can see plenty to decide what their future's gonna look like and if it's worth further exploration.

i just haven't seen it with rivera. i mean he could be a gary kubiak type but what are the chances of that? and why would we want to wait that long to see it happen? i think this year is as good as they get.

Did Kubiak win in year 3 which is all people are giving Rivera?? So how is that relevant?

[frash.exe]

Instead now we have undrafted free agents where we fill up our rosters. Your point if you have one??

UDFA = invented to replace the void left after eventually chopping 5 rounds off the ugly end of the draft according to p55

[panthers55]

UDFA = invented to replace the void left after eventually chopping 5 rounds off the ugly end of the draft according to p55

Wrong as usual. About me and the draft. How many rounds were there in 1960? 20 rounds..... Number of guys chosen in the draft 240. So there were 12 teams. It went to 17 rounds in 1967 because the addition of more teams even the fewer rounds resulted in 445 picks.

In 1975 the draft contracted to 12 rounds and the number of players constricted to 335. In 1993 it went to 8 rounds and the players taken constricted to 224. In 1994 it went to 7 rounds and has stayed there since.

As for why they went to 7 rounds, think salary cap which began with the 1993 Collective Bargaining agreement. UDFAs were added to fill rosters and were part of the concessions for free agency.