Breaking down Jonathan Stewart's deal

[panther4life]

We have more talent that the following teams..here you go...

1.Seahawks

2.Browns

3.Colts

4.Bucs

5.Vikings

6.Rams

7.Colts

8.Dolphins

9.Cardinals

10.Jaguars

11.Raiders

12.Bills

13.Chiefs

14.Titans

15.Redskins

16.Jets

17.Chargers

Theres more than half the league. Which teams do you think require further explanation?

[MaineManPanther]

I asked what other teams are pass heavy...as in 60/40. Maybe 65/35...I'd be interested to see percentages of plays from teams

Per this:

http://www.fftoday.com/articles/marcoccio/12_offensive_focus.html

Detroit is the highest with 66.35 pass %

Denver is the lowest with 46.31pass%

Carolina is right in the middle (16th) with a 57.98 pass %

There are nine teams with a pass percentage of at least 60 percent. Additionally there are another four in the range of 59.52 -59.88. I'm not sure where the arbitrary line should be drawn.

For people who are concerned that ours is to low, I wouldn't worry. As you know we had a rookie Qb, and new offence in a shortened offseason. Two factors that obviously don't apply now. I think you'll see our numbers jump over several teams in 2012.

[Rubi]

is 60/40 the consensus boundary between "pass heavy" and "ground and pound"?

60%+ is pass heavy and not relying on a run game

Below is 60% probably relies on some type of run support.

I notice you didn't comment when I said not every team can operate without a run game. Some teams have the personnel to just air it out (qb, WRs, and OLine). Other teams need a run game. The panthers don't have the supporting cast to pass on every play. So the next best thing to help Cam and this team is to have good RBs.

And yes this all just my opinion for discussion. I'm not one of the professional stat rats on this forum. If you or someone else wants to make a project of it in order to prove me otherwise so you can feel like a big man, knock yourself out haha

[frash.exe]

are the colts so untalented that they count twice lol

[Rubi]

Per this:

http://www.fftoday.com/articles/marcoccio/12_offensive_focus.html

Detroit is the highest with 66.35 pass %

Denver is the lowest with 46.31pass%

Carolina is right in the middle (16th) with a 57.98 pass %

There are nine teams with a pass percentage of at least 60 percent. Additionally there are another four in the range of 59.52 -59.88. I'm not sure where the arbitrary line should be drawn.

For people who are concerned that ours is to low, I wouldn't worry. As you know we had a rookie Qb, and new offence in a shortened offseason. Two factors that obviously don't apply now. I think you'll see our numbers jump over several teams in 2012.

Thanks for looking into it. You're more patient than I am

And Denver won a playoff game.

Basically I'm saying teams do rely on a run game and it should not be thrown out the window like some on here believe.

Over and out. Up up and awayyyyy

[liljah8303]

ARE YOU MAD BRO?

[panther4life]

are the colts so untalented that they count twice lol

Cowboys can take their place instead.

[frash.exe]

in what twisted process of psychoanalysis did you equate not wanting to spend an egregious amount of cap on runningbacks to passing the ball every play?

[panther4life]

in what twisted process of psychoanalysis did you equate not wanting to spend an egregious amount of cap on runningbacks to passing the ball every play?

As others have stated, Hurney has never given us a reason to worry about the cap space. I'd rather have them both and roll with a dynamic offense like we had last year. They both played a role in our offenses success ever since being on the team. I love the options we have on offense with them on the roster, because they can keep each other fresh, and no matter who's in Defenses have to keep an eye on them and Cam, which opens up our ability to attack deep.Also nice insurance in the event one goes down with injury as well too.

One of my favorite things about Hurney is his ability to manipulate the cap and retain our core players. He can also add key players(not necessarily star players) in free agency and via trades.

I wish we had a better D-line,I also would prefer an upgrade to our secondary, and would love a # 2 receiver thats as productive as Moose was in his prime.

This season should give us a good indication, if some of those things are already on the roster.

I do not believe Hurney is perfect, he's made some boneheaded moves like trading up for Armanti. With that being said I believe Hurney has done more good than harm for this team, and as you can tell in the parity filled NFL,thats a very good accomplishment.

Another thing that helps me is I know how to look at things with some objectivity.

For instance, 2010 was J.R'S decision to sacrifice one season for the next several.

Hurney got Fox the pieces he needed to take a 1-15 team to the superbowl 2 seasons later. We retained almost all of the talent Fox had on that team, until players got past their prime,retired, or flat out refused to stay no matter what like Peppers. Along the way we have always added key players to our team via the draft and free agency(with the exception of the 07, season where I believe we were tight against the cap).

Then in 09 we mistakingly wasted money on keeping Delhomme and trying to restore his confidence and dropped a poo ton on franchising peppers, which did not allow for any free agent additions. Re-sgning Delhomme was questionable but it was do that or Start Matt Moore as we did not have a first to draft a new qb with,thanks to getting Otah to help Fox's ground and pound game. Plus Fox didn't trust rookies anyway with kind of responsibility. So the next big mistake was drafting Clausen, who actually appeared to be a steal with 48th pick at the time, so our next head coach could have something to work with, well as many gms experience it was a bad pick.

[panthers55]

I think when talking passing rushing percentages you have to discuss teams by scheme. For example New Orleans Philly, and Green Bay are WCOs who short pass as their running game. Their 2 and 3 yard dumpoffs are simply extended handoffs which are more like a pitch or run than a true pass. So they tend to inflate the ratios. but even with that said, the Saints* passed 59% of the time. And that appears to be the upper end for teams. So while it is true that most teams pass more than they run, it isn't as if teams can simply pass without developing a good running game unless they want to be susceptible to being one dimensional which is one of the reasons the Patriots have not won the Superbowl despite being in it two times recently. They are susceptible to teams with good pass rushes.

And for those saying that defense wins Super bowls not offense, two of the last 3 winners had much better offenses than defenses. But I digress.

The Panthers are going to run a spread scheme this year focusing on the run option. They are rather unique in that no other team runs this scheme as much as we do so honestly I don't know why we want to emulate a WCO offense or focus on the passing game to the exclusion of the running game which is our bread and butter. And for those who say we are killing our pass defense by spending too much on the running game, we will be spending around 11,000,000 which is less than 10% of our cap on double trouble in 2013. This is less than the 13,000,000 cap hit for Charles Johnson alone in 2013 which is as it should be given that DEs get the big bucks.

How do we compare running versus passing? Last year we passed 52% of the time. So the difference between a passing team like New Orleans and a big time running team like the Panthers is roughly 8% or 6-8 more passes a game. That isn't that different really. Maybe 1 more pass per drive or conversely 1 more run. Nor is the money committed to the running game between the two. New Orleans has committed around 9 million to the running game in 2012 which is about 2 million less than we have committed. Hard to see what all the fuss it about.

[Panthersfan704]

[frash.exe]

Cowboys can take their place instead.

lol

like you're so not talking out of your ass right now

[panther4life]

lol

like you're so not talking out of your ass right now

They have pitiful o-line, soo bad that they wanted mack bernadeau to start(and would have if not injured). Would you take Romo over cam? Demarco Murray and Felix Jones over Stewart and Williams?

Receving cores are about a wash, Dez, Austin, Ogletree, and Witten vs Smith, Lafell,Murphy and Olsen. plus we have a versatile FB in Tolbert.

Gamble would be the best player in their secondary right now, but things are looking up for them with Clairbone and Brandon Carr who just joined. Safeties about a wash at worst. They have Barry church and Gerlad Sensenbaugh.

Demacarus ware is a beast, but aside from him the have connor, sean lee and anthony spencer starting.

Beason,Kuechly, and Anderson are better across the board as a group.

then their d-line is Jason Hatcher(who?)Ratliff, and Spears.

Not very intimidating to me and thankfully we play them this year, so that should be an easy way of deciding who's better.

What about their roster lends you to believe they are better than us? So please tell me how I am wrong with your intelligent claims here.

And just for good measure guess which team has more cap space right now?

http://profootballta...-as-of-july-15/

[CRA]

Thanks for looking into it. You're more patient than I am

And Denver won a playoff game.

Basically I'm saying teams do rely on a run game and it should not be thrown out the window like some on here believe.

Over and out. Up up and awayyyyy

Denver picked up a old and washed up McGahee for pennies.....and ran with their QB.

No one has ever said running isn't part of football today. Teams are investing as heavily as they use to for production.

Featured RBs are a dying creature. Not worth the investment vs other spots. We are paying 2 and there isn't a single team out there you can say that about not named Carolina.

Over investing in the RB spot isn't a singular end all be all problem. But that plus other strategies limit what we can do elsewhere. It also isn't as simplistic as naming a FA we could pick today or yesterday instead of paying a RB or that we shoudn't pay player x on the high end of the pay scale bc we technically have a couple dollars in cap space to spare