Defense: Scheme vs Stacking Talent

[pstall]

This is what I'm sayin! That whole "strong defense, run the ball" junk Fox talks about is just a sham. When has that so called "system" ever won games for anyone?

Exactly! You should just forget value and pick the players that you like and fit your system, like the Raiders do. Last I checked they have super bowl trophies and we don't.

I hope some serious changes are made! I sure as hell don't want another mediocre 12-4 season and bring back the same mediocre players that got us there. Wake up FO, we need some changes!

For some reason my sarcasm filter is down.

The last one escpecially.

[R0CKnR0LLA]

Sarcasm? What ever do you mean? :confused5:

[Mr. Scot]

I have pretty much out-foxed any opposition to my evidence, so the last resort I guess is to talk about how you will support someone as long as he's on the team we all love.

...can't help but to think if we actually were that daring how quick you people would defend Fox against the people who would trash a first round draft selection.

You seriously did all of that research just to start another "Jake must go" thread? Dude, are you obsessed or something? :nonod:

Seriously. Had you just left the topic on defense, you'd have had a pretty worthy discussion. But turning all that detail on defense and scheme into yet another QB thread? Extremely lame

Jake is the QB that John Fox wants, and 50 more threads on a message board won't change that. I know from prior threads that you think you can start some kind of "fan revolution" but I can tell you it's not happening. Most folks just don't take it anywhere near as seriously as you seem to. In short, the people are not going to "rise up" :sosp:

Jeez, chill out man. Heck, I was pretty interested in discussing Meeks and the defense. As it is now, I have zero interest in participating in this thread any further. There are tons of other things to discuss and you could have had a good topic here, but you ruined it for the sake of an agenda that's going to accomplish nothing (except maybe raising your BP).

Shame, honestly :nonod:

[R0CKnR0LLA]

A good topic here? Sounds crazy, but it just might work.

I'd like to discuss something other than why we should replace our HC/FO/QB after a 12-4 season, or why we're going to go 7-9 next year. But, hey that's just me.

[frash.exe]

You seriously did all of that research just to start another "Jake must go" thread? Dude, are you obsessed or something? :nonod:

Seriously. Had you just left the topic on defense, you'd have had a pretty worthy discussion. But turning all that detail on defense and scheme into yet another QB thread? Extremely lame

Jake is the QB that John Fox wants, and 50 more threads on a message board won't change that. I know from prior threads that you think you can start some kind of "fan revolution" but I can tell you it's not happening. Most folks just don't take it anywhere near as seriously as you seem to. In short, the people are not going to "rise up" :sosp:

Jeez, chill out man. Heck, I was pretty interested in discussing Meeks and the defense. As it is now, I have zero interest in participating in this thread any further. There are tons of other things to discuss and you could have had a good topic here, but you ruined it for the sake of an agenda that's going to accomplish nothing (except maybe raising your BP).

Shame, honestly :nonod:

well, I kind of made it an underlying point but it was actually a chain of events.

I was trying to put up the best defenses and let everybody know it's not all about talent, but rather how well you play as a unit....

...which goes back to peoples' habits on here about wanting to stack defense in the draft every single year "oh no not TE we need CB, DT, DE, Backup LB, etc, etc" before we draft it....

...these teams mostly draft offense in the first round, I.E. (WR: Philly's done it with their first pick a few times over, so has Pitt, Indy, NY)(TE: Shockey, Heath Miller, Todd Heap, Dallas Clark)

...The premise of it was to show you how well Meeks should do, considering the talent level he had to work with on the Colts wasn't that good. That's why I put the Panther's 2008 defense first and the Colts defense last. People are always on here bitching about replenishing defensive talent every year and acting like Fox has got no talent however compared with most other teams in the league, especially the best defenses, we actually have better raw talent...

...For years people have been so damn closed minded about drafting certain positions (QB, WR, TE prevalent), and I hate closed mindedness when looking at options. I certainly hope that the myth isn't true that Fox and Hurney are adamant about NEVER drafting a QB high, because if they are leaving a few stones unturned, they're not doing their job right, and you can even relate to that...

Now of course people put the "big bad wolf" label on me and took a shortcut all the way back to Jake Delhomme. Mintal thought I was talking about Trgovac.

Of course nobody is going to take what I said just now because they're just waiting for the subject of QB to pop up so they can batter me with the "hater" nightsticks but this is the huddle and people believe whatever the fug they want and whatever I have to say just makes their opinion stronger.

For a week in January, everybody would've agreed with me, even you. It doesn't change the fact that there's nothing Jake has that he hasn't shown us, and people will talk about "yea we should probably do something NEXT YEAR" but they've been saying that every year and by the time next year rolls around people are gushing all over DEs, DBs, and DTs. People here asked me for stats to back my opinion up and I gladly offered them. That's what these two threads were about this week...and it's still not good enough.

People put their reasoning that all these guys panned out (Beason, Davis, Gamble, Kemo, Brayton, etc) based on individual performance and not as a unit. And as a unit, the defense absolutely sucked last year, and the year before. ...and we didn't get hit with many injuries on that side of the ball either besides DT, but that was for like 2 games. The premise was to show that what people thought about what was a smart investment in defense rather than the "flashy" TE or whatever was actually not true. That our investment, actually was failing in the long run, and yet people are so afraid of a concept foreign to them like making an investment in a very unstable position (QB)

This is my last post about any of this crap. It's my last post in the Panthers forum until training camp commences. Maybe longer. The Yankees are struggling but the Lakers are in the playoffs and that's what I'm keeping my eye on right now. As far as I'm concerned I'm finished trying to open closed minds and I'm finished with this one game crap, and I'm sick of trying to pry open this impenetrable wall of faith and love for Jake you people have built for yourselves. John Fox is totally satisfied with what he's got there and there's an old saying that if you're not getting better you're getting worse, and he makes it that much harder for himself the way he's bungled the QB position his entire career.This is the same thing J-Vic went through with you guys, KT went through, and now, me.

[Ashor]

It's the name on the front of the jersey that counts, not the back.

[mantal]

I just don't understand why everybody who doesn't think the way you do, and not talking about anyone in particular but it is a theme here, has a closed mind while yours is open? The minds are closed on both sides of the major arguments around here...

[panthers55]

So Ragin Bull isn't going to post anymore of his bull crap until training camp. Only thing he has posted in weeks that I can really get behind and agree with.

:party:

[R0CKnR0LLA]

Ohh, he's going to wait ALL the way till training camp? I've got a crazy idea. Let's give Moore a legitimate shot before we start whining about bringing someone else in. Some of these people saying we need a high round QB look like they are hoping Moore fails just so they can be right.