Thats Right, The Panthers Will Go All The WAY!

[rayzor]

this is erroneous. Collecting studs as if they're precious commodities isn't going to better our chances of winning, especially since we don't follow the "run to daylight" philosophy anymore

plus most of the consistently good teams don't seem to be worried about not having enough stud RBs. Take a look at their roster and while their RBs look weaker than ours they seem to be much more stout than we are at other positions that count more (pass rushers, CBs, etc).

stop being afraid of things that happened like 8 years ago. plus as long as you have a good line that can open holes you can run with anybody

i said keep, not acquire. tolbert just fell into our laps and is replacing goodson on the roster chart so we didn't really add any RBs. we just made a position we were solid at better.

also, this offense depends on having a great run game and having this stud stable is going to make that part of the game easier. we may not be a run first team anymore, but we're still a run heavy team and that goes along with the coryell offense. a power run game is just as important as the deep ball. RBs get hurt and if you go in with a small stable more than likely it will come back and bite you in the butt...esp. if the run game is key to the offense (again, not the focal point, but key). if you spread the carries around to several quality RBs/ball carriers like we do then not only do you limit the chance of injury but you are able to keep those RBs fresher so they do more damage late in the game and will keep defenses honest. that same aspect will also give you a better chance of lasting longer late in the season and into the playoffs.

i don't want us to go out and grab all the RBs. i just want us to keep who we have and build the other positions around them.

[iamhubby1]

i said keep, not acquire. tolbert just fell into our laps and is replacing goodson on the roster chart so we didn't really add any RBs. we just made a position we were solid at better.

also, this offense depends on having a great run game and having this stud stable is going to make that part of the game easier. we may not be a run first team anymore, but we're still a run heavy team and that goes along with the coryell offense. a power run game is just as important as the deep ball.

i don't want us to go out and grab all the RBs. i just want us to keep who we have and build the other positions around them.

I am truly gettin' irritated with how people take this passing league idea way too far. Wasn't there an article on here recently that showed that passing attempts have remained rather stagnant over the last 25 years. Yet, because a handfull of QBs are setting records, it has become a passing league?!

It is a passing league because there are more passers than ever. The amount of passes hasn't changed. But the number of QBs with higher completion % has risen dramatically. 25 years ago QBs completed 50%, now it is closer to 60%. Those extra completions mean lots of extra yards. Hence the perception of the passing league.

The league has not changed. Quality RBs are still a commodity most teams still covet. But trying to get people to see the forest from the trees is about as easy as getting the wife to do certain things...

It is our running game, and how effecient it is, that makes our passing game work. Why is that such a difficult concept for some people to grasp?

[frash.exe]

I am truly gettin' irritated with how people take this passing league idea way too far. Wasn't there an article on here recently that showed that passing attempts have remained rather stagnant over the last 25 years. Yet, because a handfull of QBs are setting records, it has become a passing league?!

ok ready number of teams with more than 500 passing attempts per year since 1987 lets go

1987 - 12

1988 - 15

1989 - 15

1990 - 10

1991 - 14

1992 - 8

1993 - 16

1994 - 20

1995 - 25

1996 - 20

1997 - 22

1998 - 18

1999 - 27

2000 - 21

2001 - 22

2002 - 23

2003 - 22

2004 - 21

2005 - 18

2006 - 20

2007 - 24

2008 - 20

2009 - 25

2010 - 22

2011 - 26

it most certainly has become a passing league since 1987

It is a passing league because there are more passers than ever. The amount of passes hasn't changed. But the number of QBs with higher completion % has risen dramatically. 25 years ago QBs completed 50%, now it is closer to 60%. Those extra completions mean lots of extra yards. Hence the perception of the passing league.

Drew Brees throws 600+ pass attempts and still completes around 70% of them. Completion percentage has only gone up because of the countless rule changes in favor of passing the past ten years. This also encourages teams to pass more since success rate with passing is easier to come by, and QBs are getting hurt less as well since defenses have been absolutely hamstrung when it comes to rushing the passer.

The league has not changed. Quality RBs are still a commodity most teams still covet. But trying to get people to see the forest from the trees is about as easy as getting the wife to do certain things...

only teams like Tennessee and Carolina which are still behind the 8 ball still covet running backs. The pure fact is that most offenses are no longer led by the "star" running back, they're led by their star QB, and the load of the running game is handled for the most part by 2-3 guys. RBs get hurt way too much and don't last long enough at all for teams to invest so much money and responsibility in them. When you've got a good QB and the running game is complementary, you can pay less for 3 guys to come in and spell each other and produce a solid running game, instead of paying franchise money to one guy, or, in our case, 3 guys to split carries. Then you can take the money you saved and invest it in more important positions. The Panthers' brass still hasn't gotten this yet even though the message is right in front of them every time they watch the playoffs in January.

It is our running game, and how effecient it is, that makes our passing game work. Why is that such a difficult concept for some people to grasp?

while the ability to keep defenses guessing will always be beneficial, the passing game doesn't work simply because the run is working. The passing game works mostly because we've got a good passer. Delhomme still had poo games in 2008 and 2009 while Williams and Stewart were running to daylight. The only reason you're so adamant about this "running the ball is the most important thing hurrr di deee durrr" garbage is because the team you are personally attached to thinks that way.

[Brooklyn Bully]

Smart words

I would like to subscribe to your newsletter, sir.

[iamhubby1]

OK, then it has been since 94, which is 18 years. Not quite 25, but still a significantly long time for the ball to be in the air. Right around 20-26 teams a year. Looks pretty consistent to me.

"Completion percentage has only gone up because of the countless rule changes in favor of passing the past ten years."

Brees is the only QB in history to have 2 seasons of 70% comp. But other than that, 60% is still the norm in todays game. Which is one of the reasons passing yards are up, not that comp. % does not help. Still the same amount of passes being thrown. Nice try.

"The pure fact is that most offenses are no longer led by the "star" running back, instead of paying franchise money to one guy, or, in our case, 3 guys to split carries."

Quite the reach here. But I like your imagination. First. Most teams love the RB by committee, I agree. Just because both our backs happen to be very good, we are supposed to feel bad for other teams? Ok big daddy. Second. We are only paying 1 RB franchise money. Not 2, not 3. Please stay in the real world to make your points.

One big reason every team does not have a franchise RB, is because there are not enough franchise RBs to go around. Geesh.

I realize that the passing game can work without a running game. But why would you want to limit yourself? Also, seems to me it would add more pressure to your QB to have to carry your O. Some can, some can't. Why put that on your QB if you don't have to? Having a good running game makes you balanced. Nothing wrong with that.

I see the passing numbers just like everyone else. I just happen to see the fact that passing has been around for a long time. The rules make it easier to pass. The difference is that QBs today complete more passes. That is why passing yards are up. Passing yards being up does not mean that you can abandon your running game.

Nice try. But you have not come close to disuading me from my stance. The amount of passes has stayed pretty much the same for close to 20 years. It has been a passing league for a long time. Sorry to burst your balloon.

[frash.exe]

ok most of what you said there was nonsensical, but, ...so in one response you went from bitching about people saying it's become a passing league to basically going "hey just so you're aware it's been a passing league this whole time brah"

[iamhubby1]

So we are down to you are in agreement in principle, but you are still nit picking over terms.

That's ok, you usually make up my side of the conversation anyway. So go ahead and finish this one as well. The only difference between the passing game from 18 years ago and today is that comp. % is up. So yards are up. Folks like you use that stat to call this a passing league.

Folks will always believe what they preceive. I know I should not be silly or anything, cuz you seem to get lost when I make a joke. So I will refrain from such nonsense for you

Being able to run the ball can only help your O. Why do folks want to discount this fact?

[frash.exe]

well your original point was 7 years longer and now you've resorted to thinking you're still winning the debate by adjusting your argument based on my fact-checking

"being able to run the ball" isn't something that's solely dependent on having 3 starting guys split carries at one position. And if you think stacking talent at RB makes you successful, all I really have to point out is that it's the one thing the panthers have put the most effort and investment in to improve the team and we've yet to win a playoff game since we drafted stewart, and well, we can also say we've yet to win a playoff game since we drafted Williams as well. And while I'm aware that simply re-signing Stewart doesn't necessarily "improve" our chances for reasons I wouldn't have to explain to someone smarter than you that actually has an inquisitive mind, you are a cretin who basically thinks that the whole is the sum of its parts, and just signing a talented player no matter how frivolous an endeavor it might be (to play a relatively limited role in case you are lost here) makes you a better team. That's not how the NFL works.

So just keep babbling on and on about this theorized "simple fact" and trying to discount the "preceiption" that it's turned into a passing league even though I've proven your original assumption wrong, while not offering any sort of research or proof to justify paying starting money to a guy who splits time with someone else at one position just because you're a mark for Stewart and running the ball.

[frash.exe]

For a more in-depth review of how the passing game has come into prominence recently, here is an article posted on NFL.com just about a week ago that iamhubby probably didn't read because he was too busy squeegeeing air pockets out of his jonathan stewart mini fathead poster

[frash.exe]

Greg Cosell on the diminished role of the RB in today's NFL

[frash.exe]

ESPN on the passing game (including chart showing gross pass yards and rating over the last 25 years)

Another Greg Cosell article on the passing game