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Delhomme to 40??

scpanther22

By scpanther22,
in Carolina Panthers

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frash.exe Apprentice

frash.exe

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I've got an assignment for you...name all the teams who drafted a 1st round QB bust, but were still in contention to get to the Super Bowl within 5 years after that draft.

It works both ways. If you miss on a 1st round QB, you're screwed for years to come...just ask all of those coaches who ended up analyzing games for ESPN, instead of keeping their HCing jobs.

And yeah, I know that the Titans were still contenders after Vince Young flamed out, but that's only because they already had one of the best defenses in the league, and were lucky enough to have Kerry Collins as a back up plan. They are obviously the exception to the rule.

Here's my logic.

Most teams that draft QBs in the first round get them in the top 5. ...and they're pretty awful to begin with. Oakland, Detroit, these aren't the best environments with the highest talent levels to be able to let a QB thrive and build a contender on. ...and some guys just aren't that good (Matt Leinart. ...oh btw, they are another team that drafted a bust QB and they ended up in the SB). Yea, I get it, but at the same time, Jason Peters busted, Adam Carriker hasn't done anything in the league, I could front a whole list of top draft DEs that amounted to absolutely nothing. ...but we'll gladly toss a pick to DE. Lets not act like QB is the only position that can bust in a draft.

The Panthers HAVE enough talent level to give a QB as good a chance to pan out as a linebacker, and though we haven't picked in the top 10 since 2003, we've still had our shots. (Aaron Rodgers, Brady Quinn, Joe Flacco)

I get the whole running game/defense strategy. I buy into it. It's better than West Coast offenses and poo. Pittsburgh shares the same philosophy, but it didn't stop them from drafting a QB, and they've done pretty damn well for themselves with Big Ben, better than they ever did with Kordell Stewart and Mike Tomczak, where they had the same penny pinching strategy at QB than we do now. They haven't been <.500 with him in a season yet.

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frash.exe Apprentice

frash.exe

Posted
Posted

I've got an assignment for you...name all the teams who drafted a 1st round QB bust, but were still in contention to get to the Super Bowl within 5 years after that draft.

I'm gonna field this one because it is a pretty damn good question. Based on Dave's list from earlier on without doing too much research...

Arizona (Matt Leinart)

Tennessee (Vince Young)

Jacksonville (Byron Leftwich)

Chicago (Rex Grossman)

Baltimore (Kyle Boller)

Denver (Tommy Maddox)

San Francisco (Jim Druckenmiller)

Chicago (Cade Mcnown)

...i'm sure there's more. I didn't include Washington/Jason Campbell because he isn't a bust.

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frash.exe Apprentice

frash.exe

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well firstly those aren't his stats, but secondly do you know what position he plays?

Tackles are off, fuging wikipedia. They only counted his first year stats...

But his career sacks were correct.

even if he's played defensive tackle, not DE, his stats have been pedestrian for a first round draft pick.

And Smootsdaddy, St Louis used a base 4-3 in 2008 and 2007 so I don't know what you're talking about.

anybody wanna look at the rams run defense and still say this kid isn't a bust?

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frash.exe Apprentice

frash.exe

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...but they don't run a base 3-4. They run a base 4-3. They line up with 4 guys on most downs putting their hands in the dirt.

Carriker isn't lining up with only one guy on either side of him directly over the center every down like Vince Wilfork.

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Fiz Newbie

Fiz

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raging bull can you tell me the difference, without looking it up, between different kind of technique dts and what they're expected to do?

everything you know about him and the rams you're getting off of wikipedia as you go. just admit you were wrong about him, don't know what you're talking about, and shut up.

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frash.exe Apprentice

frash.exe

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raging bull can you tell me the difference, without looking it up, between different kind of technique dts and what they're expected to do?

everything you know about him and the rams you're getting off of wikipedia as you go. just admit you were wrong about him, don't know what you're talking about, and shut up.

:Yawn:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/teams/depth?team=stl&formationId=16

again, St louis rams run defense ranked 20th and 29th the past two years. the defensive line's job is obviously to set the tone of the running play and most of the time they're running right in the middle, where Carriker is. ...So naturally this kid's job is to stuff the run, and when they're giving up 4.9 yards a rushing play and 154 a game, he isn't doing a very good job.

Fiz go back to the tinderbox and keep making tongue-in-cheek threads about killing fat people.

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Fiz Newbie

Fiz

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raging bull can you tell me the difference, without looking it up, between different kind of technique dts and what they're expected to do?

again, St louis rams run defense ranked 20th and 29th the past two years.

this was entirely adam carriker's fault

the defensive line's job is obviously to set the tone of the running play and most of the time they're running right in the middle, where Carriker is.

wow you watched every snap? just a few posts ago you were learning everything you knew from his wikipedia article! that was fast!

...So naturally this kid's job is to stuff the run, and when they're giving up 4.9 yards a rushing play and 154 a game, he isn't doing a very good job.

yeah adam is really holding back that defense of 10 future HOFers

Fiz go back to the tinderbox and keep making tongue-in-cheek threads about killing fat people.

how about i just stay here and make serious suggestions for you to kill yourself?

remember this was all started by you saying he hadn't done anything, which is patently absurd, and due to your backpedaling has now devolved to me trying to get you to admit you don't understand the differences between technique DTs or the intricacies of a 3 down lineman hybrid defensive front with a tweener OLB/DE, which if you're curious (I can't imagine why you would be though given the rest of this conversation) is what St Louis runs.

It'll certainly change now that spags is their coach

I could be wrong but I BELIEVE regardless of what defense St Louis was running, they used Carriker like a 3-4 NT. We actually kind of do the same thing with Kemo (who btw only had 36 tackles and NO sacks in the 4-3 OMG BUST!!!1)

yes you are basically right.

im sure though that raging bull has another hastily pulled up link from espn though that fits into his convenient "3-4 or 4-3 NOTHING ELSE" mindset that hasn't been relevant for thirty years

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frash.exe Apprentice

frash.exe

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this was entirely adam carriker's fault

wow you watched every snap? just a few posts ago you were learning everything you knew from his wikipedia article! that was fast!

yeah adam is really holding back that defense of 10 future HOFers

remember this was all started by you saying he hadn't done anything, which is patently absurd, and due to your backpedaling has now devolved to me trying to get you to admit you don't understand the differences between technique DTs or the intricacies of a 3 down lineman hybrid defensive front with a tweener OLB/DE, which if you're curious (I can't imagine why you would be though given the rest of this conversation) is what St Louis runs.

It'll certainly change now that spags is their coach

yes you are basically right.

im sure though that raging bull has another hastily pulled up link from espn though that fits into his convenient "3-4 or 4-3 NOTHING ELSE" mindset that hasn't been relevant for thirty years

Oh so all of a sudden you're a regular St. Louis analyst. From what i've read is St louis runs a UT/NT system (which is STILL a fuging 4 man front, there's a difference between 3-4 nose tackles and 4-3 nose tackles). Hard to tell me that I don't know what I'm talking about when Carriker moved to the 3 technique DT from NT in October, which freed him up a bit compared to NT. Cliff Ryan moved to NT and they said he did a better job there. But it doesn't matter much because yours and smoot's whole argument was predicated on the fact that you saw "NT" next to Carriker's name on nfl.com and got all giddy.

oh, btw, you suck at interpreting.

how about i just stay here and make serious suggestions for you to kill yourself?

I wouldn't be surprised if you did because this wouldn't be the first time you acted like a little C U N T, because you've always acted like a little juvenile C U N T here lately whenever somebody challenges your opinion that you hold in such elite regard above everybody else because you are clearly a conceited brat.

I could be wrong but I BELIEVE regardless of what defense St Louis was running, they used Carriker like a 3-4 NT. We actually kind of do the same thing with Kemo (who btw only had 36 tackles and NO sacks in the 4-3 OMG BUST!!!1)

So NFL.com listed Carriker as a NT. They ALSO listed Cliff Ryan, the other DT, as a NT. Not a UT, not a DT.

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