Josh Norris Not A Fan Of Luke Kuechly

[beastson]

I like Keuchy. But for our organization it doesn't make sense to take him at #9.

Lets just say for the sake of argument he is the BPA at #9. IMO it is no different for our team than if Trent Richardson was sitting there at #9. Would we take him? No...because we are stacked at RB. Two years ago we went into the year with possibly the best or at least top 3-4 LB corps in the NFL. Last year we sufferred injuries but we are still returning all three of those linebackers. I think Beason is going to come back and make a full recovery. He looks great and from everything I've read is on his way back. James Anderson is the most underrated OLB in the league. He was leading the league in tackles for a while last year. Who knows about Thomas Davis...If he's back then he's one of the best in the game at his position.

So let's say TD gets hurt. Would it be nice to have Luke Keuchly sitting on the sideline waiting for PT? Sure...he's a great linebacker. But wouldn't it be better to have Fletcher Cox already making an impact and relying on actual backups (like Jordan Senn) to play a backup role rather than using our top 10 draft pick to take that position?

So IMO...no we wouldn't look stupid if we passed on Keuchly as a BPA because right now we don't need him. This brings me back to Marty Hurney though. Most good organizations can find positions like LB in the 2nd, 3rd, 4th round who can make an impact. Do teams have a first round pick on their depth chart at LB? Yeah. But we are talking like we need three out of three of our linebackers to be first round picks for us to have a great linebacking corp and its not the case. James Anderson is a very very good OLB for us. We can find depth at LB later in the draft...you don't have to take Luke Keuchly to shore up the position. It makes no sense to do that.

My thing is counting on T.D makes no sense. 3 tears, one knee. Even counting on Beast to return to perfect form makes no sense. Its one huge gamble, TD being the biggest of all. Its a very weak area on our D that needs addressing. I'm the exact opposite of others feelings on the DT position. I lost count of how many DT's we have. I just dont think its as important as the LB scenario or CB position because Hogan is an unknown

[unicar15]

My thing is counting on T.D makes no sense. 3 tears, one knee. Even counting on Beast to return to perfect form makes no sense. Its one huge gamble, TD being the biggest of all. Its a very weak area on our D that needs addressing. I'm the exact opposite of others feelings on the DT position. I lost count of how many DT's we have. I just dont think its as important as the LB scenario or CB position because Hogan is an unknown

I halfway agree with you...but Hurney apparently doesn't because he's willing to give TD another chance. He has put himself in the situation of not being able to draft Keuchly. If TD goes down then we rely on the backup...the end. But we can't spend our first round pick on a guy that might not even see the field this year because of the players in front of him.

My ideal/somewhat realistic scenario is that we trade down, pick up an additional 2nd round pick, and take Quinton Coples. I think he gives us another impact pass rusher that we need (the pass rush covers up alot of mistakes at other positions). Then in the 2nd round we take a DT (Devon Still) and the best LB or Corner available.

[mmmbeans]

Cox is strangely like Sedrick Ellis except Ellis came back for his senior year. Can't miss top 10 pick who won tons of awards. In fact Ellis had better numbers than Cox. So how did that work out so far?????

Busts at DT in the first round are twice as likely than at linebacker.

Hows that comparison later in the draft? I doubt it gets better. Or do you suggest we never draft dt because its too risky?

[Snake]

it isn't like saying "if richardson is there, take him" because LB is actually a need. as I said, there are a number of positions which I think one could legitimately claim as needs. LB is one of those positions. It is possible Kuechley is the BPA that fills a need at #9.

LB is about as much of a need as Punter at this point. You draft LB you draft for back ups and 9 is too high to do that.

[mav1234]

LB is about as much of a need as Punter at this point. You draft LB you draft for back ups and 9 is too high to do that.

Depending on what you think of our situation at punter, you might be right - but not because we would be drafting a backup.

It is a very, very bad idea to lean on TD as a starter. I love the guy, but he needs to work his way back into health and start off as a backup. Beason may make it back, but he may never be the same. If Kuechley is the best defensive player on the board when we pick, he would be an upgrade to a position that really does need some. As much as we rag on DT, that position also has a player returning from injury. CB is a huge need but the team may think there is not a CB that they want at #9.

edit: also, bringing TD Back does not mean we are going to rely on him and not plan for a situation where he doesn't make it back with full durability...

[Snake]

Depending on what you think of our situation at punter, you might be right - but not because we would be drafting a backup.

It is a very, very bad idea to lean on TD as a starter. I love the guy, but he needs to work his way back into health and start off as a backup. Beason may make it back, but he may never be the same. If Kuechley is the best defensive player on the board when we pick, he would be an upgrade to a position that really does need some. As much as we rag on DT, that position also has a player returning from injury. CB is a huge need but the team may think there is not a CB that they want at #9.

edit: also, bringing TD Back does not mean we are going to rely on him and not plan for a situation where he doesn't make it back with full durability...

Its all in how much you trust our medical staff. I agree about TD but Beason will be back 100% and everything points to that. At this point you can't draft on if poo happens. Trust me Rivera has a contingency plan if TD can't go and it's someone already in our system. He is a very smart man and not one to be unprepared.

[panthers55]

Hows that comparison later in the draft? I doubt it gets better. Or do you suggest we never draft dt because its too risky?

If you don't draft a DT in the first or second round I don't see anyone who would be an upgrade over McClain so I probably wouldn't draft someone this year. I would rather bring in a few DEs, a corner, a safety, and a couple of linebackers. Maybe we go OL, WR and TE for depth in the later rounds to see if we can find a nice surprise.

I don't really see much risk in any position beyond the third round really. Once you get in the 4th round you are picking the 105th best player that year. There are no guarantees at that spot. If you get a starter you are ecstatic, if you get a contributor you are happy, if you get a bust, on to then next guy.

[mmmbeans]

If you don't draft a DT in the first or second round I don't see anyone who would be an upgrade over McClain so I probably wouldn't draft someone this year. I would rather bring in a few DEs, a corner, a safety, and a couple of linebackers. Maybe we go OL, WR and TE for depth in the later rounds to see if we can find a nice surprise.

I don't really see much risk in any position beyond the third round really. Once you get in the 4th round you are picking the 105th best player that year. There are no guarantees at that spot. If you get a starter you are ecstatic, if you get a contributor you are happy, if you get a bust, on to then next guy.

so no DT before the 4th?

[panthers55]

Its all in how much you trust our medical staff. I agree about TD but Beason will be back 100% and everything points to that. At this point you can't draft on if poo happens. Trust me Rivera has a contingency plan if TD can't go and it's someone already in our system. He is a very smart man and not one to be unprepared.

What points to it? We have his word and a video that shows no true explosiveness and a bunch of baby chop steps. When he has to run 30 yards from sideline to sideline to make a tackle and he does it with speed and explosiveness then we have a sign. When someone falls on that achilles and he gets back up with no limp or pain we have a sign. What we have now is a decade of review of previous surgery patients which shows that none of the linebackers came back 100% the first year. So he would be the first. And you say he is a smart man to be prepared but we shouldn't be prepared for him to struggle. Total double speak. We need to be prepared for both of them to struggle,otherwise we get the same thing as last year. Whether we draft a LB in the first 2nd or 4th, we need to go no further in looking for depth or a possible starter.

[panthers55]

so no DT before the 4th?

That would be me. But you can all be glad that I have no say in the matter nor any expertise as a scout or front office manager.

[CRA]

LB is about as much of a need as Punter at this point. You draft LB you draft for back ups and 9 is too high to do that.

False. We need a OLB. Davis is done. MLB is still an unknown to a degree in terms is effectiveness as well.

[mmmbeans]

That would be me. But you can all be glad that I have no say in the matter nor any expertise as a scout or front office manager.

I'd say judging by hurney's track record, he agrees with you for the most part.

[Snake]

False. We need a OLB. Davis is done. MLB is still an unknown to a degree in terms is effectiveness as well.

Oh yea cause we are so bad ass we dont even need a Punter this year... :rolleyes:

[Snake]

What points to it? We have his word and a video that shows no true explosiveness and a bunch of baby chop steps. When he has to run 30 yards from sideline to sideline to make a tackle and he does it with speed and explosiveness then we have a sign. When someone falls on that achilles and he gets back up with no limp or pain we have a sign. What we have now is a decade of review of previous surgery patients which shows that none of the linebackers came back 100% the first year. So he would be the first. And you say he is a smart man to be prepared but we shouldn't be prepared for him to struggle. Total double speak. We need to be prepared for both of them to struggle,otherwise we get the same thing as last year. Whether we draft a LB in the first 2nd or 4th, we need to go no further in looking for depth or a possible starter.

:rolleyes: