Brockers Vs Cox

[panthers55]

We are not going to take a DT who plays just nose or the undertackle position We have guys there already and can find similar guys in lower rounds. We only take a DT who can get pressure on the quarterback and can slide out and play a 5 technique in a 3/4 look.

Cox has some of that covered as he is a good pass rusher and is good in an attacking 1 gap scheme. What would be the concerns??? He isn't good against the run and lets be serious, what was the major problem with our DTs last year?? It was a failure to be solid against the run. I really don't see him coming in and shoring that up. People have to remember that he is a junior and has a big learning curve to overcome. His bull rush might have worked in college but won't in the NFL where guys are bigger and more skilled.

Brockers has some concerns as well. He was a sophomore so his learning curve may be steeper than Cox. He was not a great pass rusher and would be chosen more on his upside than his current production. While he has a bigger frame than Cox to build upon he reminds me of Charles Johnson when we drafted him, a guy who needed to mature and get bigger and develop. While that was fine for a third rounder, would people be willing to wait for a year or two if they are a top 10 pick? You have to be willing to gamble on the future and wait for him to develop.

If you are looking for an impact guy who can come in and contribute right away, you would pass on both these guys. Now if you were looking at either in the second or third round then you would likely jump on them. The DT class is deep but there is no one player who is heads and shoulders above the others. You can get good production in the 2nd rounder or even the third. If we hadn't picked up 2 DTs last year then maybe you go this direction but there is no compelling reason to do so now and neither guy is so great to demand a pick in the first.

If we want a pass rusher you would look at Coples and there are questions about him as well. Unfortunately this is a pretty poor draft for defensive line talent as far as top end guys although there is plenty of depth.

[pantherj]

If you had to take a defensive linemen with our first 2 picks, then who would you take? Let's also assume Ingram and Brockers are gone by our second pick.

9.) Coples

40.) Worthy

[panthers55]

If you had to take a defensive linemen with our first 2 picks, then who would you take? Let's also assume Ingram and Brockers are gone by our second pick.

9.) Coples

40.) Worthy

I doubt Worthy is there at 40. And I wouldn't pick 2 DEs with both picks. If we go DE/DT in the first we would have to go LB or CB in the second. Defensive line is not even our biggest need.

[pantherj]

I doubt Worthy is there at 40. And I wouldn't pick 2 DEs with both picks. If we go DE/DT in the first we would have to go LB or CB in the second. Defensive line is not even our biggest need.

If you had to pick 2 defensive linemen with our first 2 picks, who would you take? Set aside that the Panthers won't actually do that. Worthy is a DT.

[Kuech the Sneak]

1)Cox

2)Chandler Jones

[Lout]

If you had to take a defensive linemen with our first 2 picks, then who would you take? Let's also assume Ingram and Brockers are gone by our second pick.

9.) Coples

40.) Worthy

Fletcher Cox and Chandler Jones

[pantherj]

Cox over Coples at 9? How did you two come to that decision? I'm thinking Coples no contest.

[Woodie]

Brockers is clearly a better run defender, and it's not even close. Cox is a better pass rusher, and that's not close either. So the question is what flavor do you prefer? Neither are perfect, but both are reputed to be hard workers and should improve on their weaknesses. Brockers probably has more room to grow simply because he's been playing the position for a lot shorter time (went to LSU as a LB/DE hybrid, and was later moved to DT when he grew into it). The truth is that neither would be bad picks. Each would provide something this team needs right away, and should become more complete with a year or so under their belt.

I'm not going to knock one to pimp the other, I would actually be quite happy with either.

[Kuech the Sneak]

Brockers is clearly a better run defender, and it's not even close. Cox is a better pass rusher, and that's not close either. So the question is what flavor do you prefer? Neither are perfect, but both are reputed to be hard workers and should improve on their weaknesses. Brockers probably has more room to grow simply because he's been playing the position for a lot shorter time (went to LSU as a LB/DE hybrid, and was later moved to DT when he grew into it). The truth is that neither would be bad picks. Each would provide something this team needs right away, and should become more complete with a year or so under their belt.

I'm not going to knock one to pimp the other, I would actually be quite happy with either.

That's how I'm starting to feel, either one would be good. Although I do wanna get tougher against the run

[Woodie]

As for who I would want if we go DT in the 1st:

1st - Brockers/Cox

2nd - Shae McClellan if he is there, otherwise I want Vinnie Curry

That would solidify our DL, and both McClellan and Curry can be that hybrid DE/LB pass rusher that would fit this defense. I like Jones as well, but I really doubt he'll be there at 40.

[Woodie]

That's how I'm starting to feel, either one would be good. Although I do wanna get tougher against the run

I think that will happen regardless of what we do in the draft. I expect the return of Edwards and Beason (even at less than 100%) by itself should make a huge difference in our run defense.

[koolkatluke]

Versus the Run

"

Cox Breakdown vs. the run

http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft/player/_/id/28964/fletcher-cox

Fires out of stance and is strong enough to hold ground in most one-on-one situations when he keeps pad level. Has a powerful upper body and quick, strong hands. Showed much improved awareness in 2011. Can stack and shed in time to make plays at the line of scrimmage. Very good range for a defensive tackle and makes more plays outside the tackle box than most at his position. However, he needs to play with more consistent leverage versus the run. He's not big enough to anchor against double-teams when he doesn't stay low. Gets washed down the line of scrimmage by angle blocks a little too much. Does a better job extending arms and controlling the gap in a five-technique than he does inside at DT, where he's more effective when shooting a gap and trying to disrupt in the backfield. "

Brockers breakdown vs the run

http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/draft/player/_/id/28980/michael-brockers

Versus the Run 1 "Shows adequate to good initial quickness and power. Will come off the ball a bit high at times but shows ability to play with leverage and continues to improve in this area. Displays above-average awareness locating the ball. Powerful upper body. Flashes ability to ragdoll some OL. Does a nice job with swim and rip moves but can be a little loose with technique at times. Generally does a very good job of disengaging quickly once ball is located. But occasionally will let his pads rise while looking for the ball, and will allow OL to establish leverage advantage. Lower body strength is adequate but can improve. Works hard to fight through double-team. Does a nice job of defending lower body on cut blocks. Gives a good effort in pursuit. A powerful hitter. Will sell out to make the play."

[Lout]

That's how I'm starting to feel, either one would be good. Although I do wanna get tougher against the run

I feel like Ron Edwards would help in the run department. We do not have a solid 3-tech to plug in next to him. I feel we would be wasting Ron Edwards talents by drafting Brockers because they play the same position.

[rippadonn]

Brockers would be the future Edwards is only helping for the moment