Jonathan Stewart The Most Elusive Rb In The Nfl?

[number28]

Not on the bench but if we wanted to pay that almost 9 million a year to another player we could have brought in Mike Williams or a number of other very productive guys. But actually I don't think there is anyone on the bench who can come in and replace Stewart either. HIs production would come from shared carries by everyone else. And if runningbacks are a dime a dozen why are there several making more than Williams is this year and why is Richardson a top 5 pick.

because williams's contract dictated the contract of several RBs in the league and richardson is a complete back who can be had for a much cheaper price via the draft than the market (set by williams's contract) currently asks for.

[CRA]

I disagree on all counts. First of all I think we can and will offer a contract like Williams except it will be back loaded instead of front loaded like William's was to account for signing Stewart next year. I also think Stewart is not in competition with Williams but the going rate for running backs in 2013. If the best deal he can get is less than Williams got but is still better than what anyone else will offer, he would be a fool not to take it. Finally I really doubt they have to trade him or let him walk. If they put a non-exclusive tag on him next year he can negotiate with other teams and find out his worth. Then we either sign him or he goes elsewhere and we get a first rounder which is what we paid for him anyway.

Why would a NFL RB sign a backloaded contract?

Also, if there is comparable money out there for then location and reps/role come into play. Carolina made there choice....paying Stewart like Williams would just be making a mistake worse. Too much talent on the bench...not enough on the field

[The Other Colbert]

Stewy does more with less carries, especially when dwill sometimes comes out flat

[panthers55]

because williams's contract dictated the contract of several RBs in the league and richardson is a complete back who can be had for a much cheaper price via the draft than the market (set by williams's contract) currently asks for.

Which reinforces my point that not all backs are a dime a dozen

[panthers55]

Why would a NFL RB sign a backloaded contract?

Also, if there is comparable money out there for then location and reps/role come into play. Carolina made there choice....paying Stewart like Williams would just be making a mistake worse. Too much talent on the bench...not enough on the field

Most every contract is the NFL is back loaded. Williams was slightly front loaded in year 1, 2 and 3 to account for the years before 2014 but it is still backloaded in 2014 and 2015. Every player knows that only the guaranteed money counts so you take a back loaded contract if the guaranteed money makes sense which can be a combination of signing bonuses, guaranteed salary in years 2 or 3 for example. In addition there are option bonuses, roster bonuses, incentives and other ways to structure a contract.

I know you have to keep up the argument that William's contract doomed the team so now you are taking the second tack that since we signed Williams we are doomed to lose Stewart through a trade or him walking but it just isn't true. We can keep both if we want to. The question is simple do we want to, and does Stewart want to be here. If the answer to both is yes, then we can work something out.

[CRA]

And if runningbacks are a dime a dozen why are there several making more than Williams is this year and why is Richardson a top 5 pick.

None of those making more than Williams on other teams are accounting for 35% of the rushing yards and 27% of the rushing TDs.

Richardson is only a top 5 pick for a team wishing to put a load on him making him responsible for the overwhelming bulk of the production.

The fact we are attempting to pay feature back money for 2 players to be role players is just beyond absurd.

[Lumps]

I would take a 1st or 2nd in a heart beat.

We can not b/c over attached to our players.

Wish Hurney would leave.

fixed.

[Lumps]

But in reality he is a JR guy who will be known for being a JR guy because he isn't good and was kept around until JR is no longer owner. I'd bet on it.

[CRA]

Most every contract is theNFl is back loaded. Williams was slightly front loaded in year 1, 2 and 3 to account for the years before 2014 but it is still backloaded in 2014 and 2015. every player knows that only the guaranteed money counts so you take a back loaded contract if the guaranteed money makes sense which can be a combination of signing bonuses, guaranteed salary in years 2 or 3 for example. In addition there are option bonuses, roster bonuses, incentives and other ways to restructure a contract.

I know you have to keep up the argument that William's contract doomed the team so now you are taking the second tack that since we signed Williams we are doomed to lose Stewart through a trade or him walking but it just isn't true. We can keep both if we want to. The question is simple do we want to, and does Stewart want to be here. If the answer to both is yes, then we can work something out.

Williams contract didn't doom the team....it was just a mistake. Again, you don't pay someone Chris Johnson type money and ask them for DeAngleo 2011 type production. You also don't pay an aging RB feature money when you drafted a young stud like Stewart and he is on your roster.

and yes we can keep both if we want. We could draft Richardson if wanted to....have Williams, Stewart, Richardson, and Tolbert. It comes at a cost to invest in your backfield. Doesn't matter how you play w/ numbers.....doing so prevents you from investing at other spots. Just silly at this point. In this league.

Carolina has one of the most effiecient/productive runners in the NFL.......in Cam Newton. Over investing in the backfield is just silly w/ this roster and scheme.

[panthers55]

None of those making more than Williams on other teams are accounting for 35% of the rushing yards and 27% of the rushing TDs.

Richardson is only a top 5 pick for a team wishing to put a load on him making him responsible for the overwhelming bulk of the production.

The fact we are attempting to pay feature back money for 2 players to be role players is just beyond absurd.

Are you sure about that? Go back and look at the top 5 salaried backs for this year and look at their production last year.

Adrian Peterson accounted for 1100 total yards last year and is coming off ACL surgery. He will account for almost 14 million dollars this year in cap space.

Williams cost 8.5 million and had 970 yards

McFadden cap hit 9.5 million. Total yards in 2011- 775 total yards

[CRA]

you think the Eagles would be interested in acquiring Jonathan Stewart for Williams' cost? your response would be hell no.

you would say the Eagles already have one of the best RBs in the game in McCoy and Vick already brings a unique dimension to that...they just need a role player and need to focus on the rest of the team.

[panthers55]

Williams contract didn't doom the team....it was just a mistake. Again, you don't pay someone Chris Johnson type money and ask them for DeAngleo 2011 type production. You also don't pay an aging RB feature money when you drafted a young stud like Stewart and he is on your roster.

and yes we can keep both if we want. We could draft Richardson if wanted to....have Williams, Stewart, Richardson, and Tolbert. It comes at a cost to invest in your backfield. Doesn't matter how you play w/ numbers.....doing so prevents you from investing at other spots. Just silly at this point. In this league.

Carolina has one of the most effiecient/productive runners in the NFL.......in Cam Newton. Over investing in the backfield is just silly w/ this roster and scheme.

Mistakes in hindsight are easy to point out. Given that Stewart wouldn't negotiate, Newton was a brand new rookie, Fox was hot to sign Williams, and we needed to show fans and players that we weren't cheap after dumping veterans in 2010, we paid what we thought we needed to pay to keep him. Given we were a 2-14 team who was awful and no one wanted to play for us unless we paid them a bunch, it made sense then. The same thing happened with Johnson. Now we are a dynamic team with a new offense and are much sexier to play for. So we may not have to pay as much.

As for Newton reprising last year, lets wait and see. You always seem to be one to jump in headlong stating trends and ideas based on limited information and history. Lets see what happens this year before deciding how thing will be.

[panthers55]

you think the Eagles would be interested in acquiring Jonathan Stewart for Williams' cost? your response would be hell no.

you would say the Eagles already have one of the best RBs in the game in McCoy and Vick already brings a unique dimension to that...they just need a role player and need to focus on the rest of the team.

Poor example they run a west coast offense. Would a team like the Jets bring in Stewart or even Denver who run a WCO but still have Fox as their coach. I think they would want him and might pay him a bunch.

[megadeth078]

If Stewart is not here it won't be because Hurney didn't try and sign him, it will because Stewart wants to go elsewhere. It is Stewart who is supposedly not negotiating. Tolbert was brought in because Stewart wouldn't negotiate from what I can tell. Could we keep both of them? I think so. Williams will count around 8 million cap space next year (4.75 million salary). Stewart will count his prorated signing bonus next year and a nominal salary which is very typical the first year of a contract. If it was like William's contract he will cost 3.2 million in prorated signing bonus and likely 1.5 million in salary. His will be backloaded while WIlliams was somewhat front loaded. So between them it will likely be roughly 13 million. With Tolbert it will be 15 million. How is that much different than this year where Williams costs 8.5 million cap space, Stewart is 2.6 million and Tolbert is 2 million? So we can afford 13 million this year but can't afford 15 million next year??

The reality is that if we can't afford them next year, we can't afford them this year. I think we can afford them this year and can do so again next year. With the increased cap space in 2014 and likelihood that Wiliams will be done in a few years, it makes keeping Stewart both very doable but desirable. If he isn't here it will be by his own making not Hurney's.

Cam is signed through 2014 with an option year already built in 2015. There is absolutely no reason to worry about extending him before 2014 at the earliest. We only have to worry about 2013 and as I just showed a few posts ago, the increase next year to keep Stewart will likely be around 2 million dollars. Not the king's ransom some of you suggest or that much more than we are spendiing this year. With the cap space likely to go up by 20-30 million in 2014, there is not a huge crisis here.

20 million is way overstated. we will spend 13 million this year and likely 15 million next year assuming we keep all three. If we can't afford them next year, we can't afford them this year either,

Sure it is. Cap space is not the same as Salary. Wwe can sign him to a big contract but since he gets the signing bonus up front he doesn't need a big salary. So we have a cap friendly contract for 2013, he gets a fat signing bonus and the majority of the contract is deferred until 2014 or later when the cap increases. Meanwhile William's cap hit if we release him goes down every year so that by 2014 if we do a June 1st release we have a very manageable 3 million a year in dead cap space if hee tailss off his production. If he stay productive the 16 million will be only 1/10th of the cap hit in 2014.

If we trade Stewart it is because we know we can't sign him long-term and can't afford to tag him and pay him 8 million next year. The ball is in his court.

Thanks, you've given me a lot of hope that keeping my favorite player for the long haul isn't impossible. With the increase in cap next season and salary cap shenanigans, I'm starting to think we really can bring Stewart back if we wanted (we do). People can talk all day about spending too much in the backfield, but you're right about us having a lot of money invested in the backfield as of right now. If we are okay with spending that much right now, what's a little more going to hurt considering the increase in salary cap? 13 million doesn't hurt us right now, but 15-17 million next season will kill us?

I can't believe there's people that support giving up the best running back in the league without a fight, especially with the possibility of tagging him and making a team give up a first rounder to take him from us. Stop begging for 3rd rounders guys, we're not out of time or options yet. Stop valuing picks over our own players too. You guys are just as shallow and pathetic as bandwagoners. It's embarrassing.

Good argument about spending 1/6th of the cap last season on two lineman on an average line. Puts it all in perspective I suppose. Oh Hurney, please work that magic of yours that I doubt ever so often.