Jonathan Stewart The Most Elusive Rb In The Nfl?

[MHS831]

Look at any roster and what you see are 10-12 players that comprise half the cap room another 10-12 that make a few million and the rest are paid less than a million. Stars get the lion share of the money but journeymen and guys on their rookie contract make up the majority of positions.

Look at any roster and what you see are 10-12 players that comprise half the cap room another 10-12 that make a few million and the rest are paid less than a million. Stars get the lion share of the money but journeymen and guys on their rookie contract make up the majority of positions.

How many rosters allocate $13 million at RB?

[panthers55]

No.

To invest in a position is more than money. If we pay Stewart then we will have more financially invested more than any team. On top, unlike most teams highly paid talent a chunk would be on the sidelines and not the field.

We are the only team to spend 2 first round picks in 3 years on RBs. From a talent aspect, we have also invested with our draft picks more heavily than any team in the NFL in this passing era.

No team is managing their backfield like Carolina is doing. Simple and plain.

If is the center of life. Right now we haven't spent more. Who knows maybe we sign Stewart and release Williams next year and spread the cap hit over 2 years. Maybe we trade Stewart. Maybe we get rid of both of them who knows. But the what if game to try and prove a point is a waste of time. You asked if any team has invested more than we have in the runnin game and the answer is yes. Next year is next year and totally different. Who knows what other teams will do next year. What we have is the here and now.

[panthers55]

How many rosters allocate $13 million at RB?

Vikings have that much of a cap hit on Adrian Peterson alone. How many teams allocate 15 million to a quarterback where ours costs 5 million. Does that mean they are doing it wrong or that they are allocating too much to the quarterback position. Or do you have to move things around and change how you allocate your cap based on who is on your team and how many you keep. You can be assured when Cam gets his new contract and makes 15 million a year, we will have to cut back at other positions. Right now you have the luxury at running back which you won't have later.

[panthers55]

Good points, but we need to roll cheaper. Wish we could keep Stew on a second contract and draft a scatback. Between the scat back and Tolbert, We could keep Stewart's carries around 200. DWill is expensive for a guy who can't run between the tackles--as you say.

This year we don't and maybe next year we do or don't. When Newton gets paid we will have to cut back elsewhere but not necessarily now.

[MHS831]

This year we don't and maybe next year we do or don't. When Newton gets paid we will have to cut back elsewhere but not necessarily now.

This year we don't and maybe next year we do or don't. When Newton gets paid we will have to cut back elsewhere but not necessarily now.

Until we get better at S, DT, G, CB, and DE, I say we cannot afford our RBs now.

You mentioned the top 10-12 players on the roster. I gave you six offensive players covering five positions costing us $47 m. To get that number to 11, add Charles Johnson, Jon Beason, Chris Gamble, Charles Godfrey, and Anderson. The top 11 players on the Panthers covering 10 of the 22 starting positions cost us $84 m.

That leaves $36 million to pay 42 players. No wonder we have holes.

[ed bell]

It has crossed my mind that part of the playbook last year might have been implemented to keep Cam in the comfort zone at times. I wouldn't be surprised if a portion of the plays we saw last year end up disappearing from heavy rotation and are replaced with ones that play to the personnel we field in 2012.

If Cam can continue advancing his passing proficiency, the design of the run attack with the guys we have will earn it's keep. The pieces are there. I think the team is going to roll the dice with that and worry about Stewart later.

[MHS831]

Vikings have that much of a cap hit on Adrian Peterson alone. How many teams allocate 15 million to a quarterback where ours costs 5 million. Does that mean they are doing it wrong or that they are allocating too much to the quarterback position. Or do you have to move things around and change how you allocate your cap based on who is on your team and how many you keep. You can be assured when Cam gets his new contract and makes 15 million a year, we will have to cut back at other positions. Right now you have the luxury at running back which you won't have later.

Vikings have that much of a cap hit on Adrian Peterson alone. How many teams allocate 15 million to a quarterback where ours costs 5 million. Does that mean they are doing it wrong or that they are allocating too much to the quarterback position. Or do you have to move things around and change how you allocate your cap based on who is on your team and how many you keep. You can be assured when Cam gets his new contract and makes 15 million a year, we will have to cut back at other positions. Right now you have the luxury at running back which you won't have later.

Peterson's contract is not that high--$8 million in 2012. Even so, they overpaid because they do not have a QB. Besides, you picked a team that has a record worse than ours. Why do we have a luxury at RB, a DEVALUED position, but we have no DTs? Why is Munnerlyn still on tthe team when opposing QBs connected on 65% of passes to his man? Why are we 25th in the league in sacks? Why is Sherrod Martin sdtill employed? Who is our second guard? Who do we have to play behind a LB with 3 ACL surgeries in 2 years? Who will play behind Beason if the Achilles never recovers?

Luxury is right. It is like we are making Lexus payments while the family starves. We do not need to cut the salary at RB when Cam needs more $$, we need to do it now so we have a defense behind him and a line in front of him.

[panthers55]

Until we get better at S, DT, G, CB, and DE, I say we cannot afford our RBs now.

You mentioned the top 10-12 players on the roster. I gave you six offensive players covering five positions costing us $47 m. To get that number to 11, add Charles Johnson, Jon Beason, Chris Gamble, Charles Godfrey, and Anderson. The top 11 players on the Panthers covering 10 of the 22 starting positions cost us $84 m.

That leaves $36 million to pay 42 players. No wonder we have holes.

I came up with different numbers, still high but lower than yours.

Johnson-------------------------------------10 million

Gamble--------------------------------------9.75 million

Gross----------------------------------------9.33 million

Williams-------------------------------------8.45 million

Smith-----------------------------------------8.2 million

Newton--------------------------------------5 million

Beason--------------------------------------4.8 million

Kalil-------------------------------------------4.5 million

Olsen-----------------------------------------4.1 million

Anderson------------------------------------3.9 million

Mare------------------------------------------3,2 million

Godfrey--------------------------------------2.6 million

Here are the top 12- they count 73.8 Apparently Kalil makes less than I thought. Still a lot though and spread between defense and offense (5 defense, 7 offense)

[PantherPhann89]

I'd love for us to resign Stew. Tolbert signed for FB money, not RB money, so thats a good thing. Here are the isues involved in us keeping Stew.

1) Does Stew want to stay in Carolina? If yes see #2, If no see #3

2) Will D. Will renegoiate his contract to keep him? If yes see #4, If no see #3a & 3b

3a) Attempt to trade him, although it would be hard since every other team know that we'll cut if we can't work out a trade, or franchise him in order to keep him long enough to trade him. Only now may be on the hook to pay them both alotta money the same year.

4) Sign Stew

[ed bell]

As far as how money is spread out between players now, with the exception of a couple contract re-structures, cuts, and FA signings in the off-season that number has been on the books and in play throughout the 2011season. No surprise there. No reason to believe Ron is crying about cap space and personnel at this point. Last year was evaluation time. This year he coaches up what he has and tries to add/improve where they can. The Draft is where ownership wants that to happen. I expect that's what we'll see even if the OL is in the mix for the draft.

[panthers55]

Peterson's contract is not that high--$8 million in 2012. Even so, they overpaid because they do not have a QB. Besides, you picked a team that has a record worse than ours. Why do we have a luxury at RB, a DEVALUED position, but we have no DTs? Why is Munnerlyn still on tthe team when opposing QBs connected on 65% of passes to his man? Why are we 25th in the league in sacks? Why is Sherrod Martin sdtill employed? Who is our second guard? Who do we have to play behind a LB with 3 ACL surgeries in 2 years? Who will play behind Beason if the Achilles never recovers?

Luxury is right. It is like we are making Lexus payments while the family starves. We do not need to cut the salary at RB when Cam needs more $$, we need to do it now so we have a defense behind him and a line in front of him.

Salary for Williams is 5.25 and Stewart is 1.3 million so Peterson still makes more. Now lets look at cap. Peterson's cap is hard to pinpoint since there are incentives totalling 2 million a year but it is likely in excess of 12 million a year since the total value is 7 years and 100 million. Meanwhile Williams is 8.75 and Stewart is 2.6. So as I said, Peterson makes more than Williams and Stewart together.

We are spending 44 million on defensive starters and 55 on offense starters the best I can figure. if we don't have the right players it isn't just because of the money spent on running back. The rest is depth, special teams, etc. We are paying enough to have good players in the right spots.

[ed bell]

I asked before why a team would value a 1 year rookie contract and a possibility of having to franchise the player in year two for a 2nd round pick.

Generally, the team trading the draft pick to us for Stew will only do it if they can come to an agreement with him on a new contract.

So this would be a "sign and trade"? Kind of like asking Stewart to work a deal with team X, when he has already declined to discuss it with us. I wonder how that would go? He doesn't budge, no trade...unless the knight in shining armor shows up. I guess we'll see.

So he wouldn't play this year under his rookie deal in this scenario. He'd have a new deal right off the bat? One of the attractive parts of acquiring him is his affordable contract, but the downside of that is the reality of renting him for one year.

I'm not going to read anything into him refusing to negotiate early. Obviously he'd be losing leverage or money by doing that. I think that could back-fire on him if traded, but hey, who knows? Best case this year is for him to complete his rookie contract and continue to be elite level in his production despite the limited carries.

Damn, are you totally new to NFL football.

Another team would NOT give up anything of value without having a new long-term deal discussed. There is no way they would give up a pick to have him for one year.

The quality and knowledge of posters on this board is really declining lately.

I did mention the Franchise option for year two, but that can be trouble for teams. Looks to me like someone has to come over the top for JStew for any trade to happen. I guess we'll see.

[MHS831]

Salary for Williams is 5.25 and Stewart is 1.3 million so Peterson still makes more.

You provided Williams' salary at $8.45 million a few posts ago.

[MHS831]

I came up with different numbers, still high but lower than yours.

Johnson-------------------------------------10 million

Gamble--------------------------------------9.75 million

Gross----------------------------------------9.33 million

Williams-------------------------------------8.45 million

Smith-----------------------------------------8.2 million

Newton--------------------------------------5 million

Beason--------------------------------------4.8 million

Kalil-------------------------------------------4.5 million

Olsen-----------------------------------------4.1 million

Anderson------------------------------------3.9 million

Mare------------------------------------------3,2 million

Godfrey--------------------------------------2.6 million

Here are the top 12- they count 73.8 Apparently Kalil makes less than I thought. Still a lot though and spread between defense and offense (5 defense, 7 offense)

Good job. Kalil and Beason's salaries seem low--but I do not know the details of the contract. When you consider that these numbers do not include premium positions--where we should be strongly invested: NT, DT, LG, RG, RT, WLB, #2 WR, and #2 CB, it is easy to understand why we are in such a mess.