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Arsens mock 1.0

Ja Rhule

By Ja Rhule,
in Carolina Panthers

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MHS831 Grand Master

MHS831

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I can say this--I think it was the year we drafted Thomas Davis was the last time I have seen so much variety on our first round draft pick. I have seen Brockers, Kirkpatrick, Reiff, Martin, Jenkins, DeCastro, Still, Coples, Ingram, Upshaw, Blackmon, Wright, and even Richardson. After free agency, after we see what Marty does with Shockey, Wharton, etc., maybe we can narrow it to 5 or 6.

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Actionman0z Veteran

Actionman0z

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Why do you want a guard so bad in the 1st?

I think at that spot he will be BPA. I would rather have a guy I know a sure thing, all-pro guard for the next 10 years, then a dude who MIGHT BE the best DT in a draft.... at #9 you gotta have the sure thing... and I think Decastro and Kalil at Center guard is nasty! Why not? Cam Newton is the QB, and protecting him from inside pressue is a must, because he can escape the outside rush... If there was someone else at #9 who was a NO BRAINER I would be all for it. I think hes the best option. I think we are okay at CB with Hogan, and if not, its the deepest position in the draft. Im not so sure we need another DE or DT.. we're young there... we'll see. I think OLB is a need, but later on in the draft I like Zach Brown if he is there at #40.. why not?

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Jackofalltrades Community Regular

Jackofalltrades

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I just don't see us taking another ASU player with a second round pick and I graduated from ASU. I like Quick, but only with a later round pick. We also need an 0-line player to replace Otah who is his last contract year and Hangartner who is a free agent. Wharton may get released due to his contract and Schwartz is coming off a hip injury. We have so many needs on defense, we can take the BPA on defense with our first pick.

I also like the idea of trading down for more picks as long as we stay in mid 1st round.

Quick might not last until the third, not to mention the forth where we could pick him. Where he went to school really shouldn't matter. To me he's the Brockers of the WR's, incredibly raw with a very high ceiling. He reminds me of A Boldin and wouldn't mind gambling a second on him.

Check back at his football career, from birth to now and then look at what he's done. I think he's a great talent and would be another young, tall, fast vertical threat to grow with Cam.

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koolkatluke Newbie

koolkatluke

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I think at that spot he will be BPA. I would rather have a guy I know a sure thing, all-pro guard for the next 10 years, then a dude who MIGHT BE the best DT in a draft.... at #9 you gotta have the sure thing... and I think Decastro and Kalil at Center guard is nasty! Why not? Cam Newton is the QB, and protecting him from inside pressue is a must, because he can escape the outside rush... If there was someone else at #9 who was a NO BRAINER I would be all for it. I think hes the best option. I think we are okay at CB with Hogan, and if not, its the deepest position in the draft. Im not so sure we need another DE or DT.. we're young there... we'll see. I think OLB is a need, but later on in the draft I like Zach Brown if he is there at #40.. why not?

This is all based on your opinion. Just like Hogan (who played in 2 games maybe. none of them he started) we have 4-5 guys who can play guard as well. But you choose to have more faith in hogan and no faith in the 4-5 guys we have to play guard.

Then who waste a top 10 pick on a guard? When is the last time that happened?

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Actionman0z Veteran

Actionman0z

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This is all based on your opinion. Just like Hogan (who played in 2 games maybe. none of them he started) we have 4-5 guys who can play guard as well. But you choose to have more faith in hogan and no faith in the 4-5 guys we have to play guard.

Then who waste a top 10 pick on a guard? When is the last time that happened?

Yes, for sure, my opinion. I dont know the last time it happened. But I dont know the last time I heard all the draft analysts say that a G was the most polished O-line player in the draft either. Tell me the 4-5 Guard options on the team? Zach Williams? Gary Williams? Wharton? Bell.. maybe, if Otah is good? I like the idea of drafting a CB at 9 also, and I think that would be the best spot on D to draft.

Hogan had a first round grade but was recovering from surgery, so we'll see. Its not that I have more faith in him, its just that I think Decastro gives us an INSTANT upgrade inside, which I think with Cam is very important. Im not saying it will happen, just saying if it does, I wont be upset or suprised, but I understand the need/want to upgrade the defense and I wont argue with that at all...

The Crux to my argument is this: Decastro at 9, regardless of Value because of position, is as close to a sure thing as possible.. the other options on defense that we are looking at are RAW, have POT problems, Motor problems, scheme fit issues, and other concerns. When you draft a guy like Decastro, you are getting a plug and play all-pro candidate, at 9 sounds pretty darn good. But yes, JUST MY OPINION.

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koolkatluke Newbie

koolkatluke

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Yes, for sure, my opinion. I dont know the last time it happened. But I dont know the last time I heard all the draft analysts say that a G was the most polished O-line player in the draft either. Tell me the 4-5 Guard options on the team? Zach Williams? Gary Williams? Wharton? Bell.. maybe, if Otah is good? I like the idea of drafting a CB at 9 also, and I think that would be the best spot on D to draft.

Hogan had a first round grade but was recovering from surgery, so we'll see. Its not that I have more faith in him, its just that I think Decastro gives us an INSTANT upgrade inside, which I think with Cam is very important. Im not saying it will happen, just saying if it does, I wont be upset or suprised, but I understand the need/want to upgrade the defense and I wont argue with that at all...

The Crux to my argument is this: Decastro at 9, regardless of Value because of position, is as close to a sure thing as possible.. the other options on defense that we are looking at are RAW, have POT problems, Motor problems, scheme fit issues, and other concerns. When you draft a guy like Decastro, you are getting a plug and play all-pro candidate, at 9 sounds pretty darn good. But yes, JUST MY OPINION.

Same type player most team get in the later rounds.

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koolkatluke Newbie

koolkatluke

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Not really with this kid, read the write-ups about him. He does exactly what we're looking for. And if OG is not valuable, then neither is DT. Please, just stop talking to me.

Dude you are arguing against facts. I showed you that in the last 2 years their are no Guard drafted in the top 10 that is all pro or pro bowl.

I even showed you that out of the top 10 guards this year 1 was a 1st round pick (32nd) and 6 were either drafted after round 4 or undrafted.

Only thing you bring to this debate is how good this kid is. History and stats back me up.

It is a bad move for our team that has 6 guys (1 that needs to be either cut or redo his contract) that can play the guard position and be solid. To draft a guard in the top 10 is crazy when you have a bad defense and 4-5 young guys who are ready to compete for that position. It's a proven fact that most of your better Guards in the league weren't 1st round picks.

Better yet name me 2-3 top 10 drafted guards and their acheviements?

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Actionman0z Veteran

Actionman0z

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Dude you are arguing against facts. I showed you that in the last 2 years their are no Guard drafted in the top 10 that is all pro or pro bowl.

I even showed you that out of the top 10 guards this year 1 was a 1st round pick (32nd) and 6 were either drafted after round 4 or undrafted.

Only thing you bring to this debate is how good this kid is. History and stats back me up.

It is a bad move for our team that has 6 guys (1 that needs to be either cut or redo his contract) that can play the guard position and be solid. To draft a guard in the top 10 is crazy when you have a bad defense and 4-5 young guys who are ready to compete for that position. It's a proven fact that most of your better Guards in the league weren't 1st round picks.

Better yet name me 2-3 top 10 drafted guards and their acheviements?

Again, I go back to the idea that before the new CBA it seemed silly to draft a guard in the top 10. Im not advocating the selection, just saying with the way this draft board is set up, he seems to be the SAFEST pick. He scares me the least is the point I was trying to make, Steve Hutchinson is the only guy close that comes to mind. The main thing I was trying to say is that the DL guys all are boom or bust, (mainly, with history, BUST), so a guy like Decastro is the SAFE pick, and one I would not be opposed to.. I also like Dre Kirkpatrick there... because Hogan is a question mark. I think regardless of players on the team that can "fill in" at Guard, Decastro would make us better, allow us to cut Wharton outright, and be a pro-bowler for us. I, like you, am a Panthers fan, and I hope that they draft someone who can come in and start tomorrow, and I do not think thats any of the DT's with the #9 overall selection.. At 40, Im all for it.

Your facts also prove that more often than not DT's taken in the top 10 normally do not perform to the standard of the selection.. but I understand your reasoning to NOT take a Guard in the top #10.

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koolkatluke Newbie

koolkatluke

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Again, I go back to the idea that before the new CBA it seemed silly to draft a guard in the top 10. Im not advocating the selection, just saying with the way this draft board is set up, he seems to be the SAFEST pick. He scares me the least is the point I was trying to make, Steve Hutchinson is the only guy close that comes to mind. The main thing I was trying to say is that the DL guys all are boom or bust, (mainly, with history, BUST), so a guy like Decastro is the SAFE pick, and one I would not be opposed to.. I also like Dre Kirkpatrick there... because Hogan is a question mark. I think regardless of players on the team that can "fill in" at Guard, Decastro would make us better, allow us to cut Wharton outright, and be a pro-bowler for us. I, like you, am a Panthers fan, and I hope that they draft someone who can come in and start tomorrow, and I do not think thats any of the DT's with the #9 overall selection.. At 40, Im all for it.

Your facts also prove that more often than not DT's taken in the top 10 normally do not perform to the standard of the selection.. but I understand your reasoning to NOT take a Guard in the top #10.

This is where we disagree. I think we can cut Wharton without drafting Decastro. I also don't think he makes our offense that much better then Schwarts, Bell, Williams, Bernadue (on the left side), Hangtarner or Zemiba playing. JMO

I rather take the risk on drafting a player in a position of need that can have a bigger impact on this team success.

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