Panthers surprise Cuts and Restructures?

[csx]

15 mil a year (20 with Newton ) for 2000 yds is not a bad deal

That is a God awful deal

[CRA]

Then give me the numbers. While you are at it do it for Stewart as well. Then break it down between the first half of the year and the second half. Then break it down between right and left side of the line and compare Stewart and Williams so we have a fair comparison. Then go ahead and post it so we can see where you got the numbers. Only then will you assertion have any credibility.

So what are the numbers on Arian Foster? And what about the 10 top runningbacks in the league right now? Until then it is only your opinion. I would also be rather skeptical of any results you produce when it is clear you are so biased to begin with that you will likely only choose to include data which reinforces what you already believe to be true.

As for the assertion that he is slowing down, his yards per carry were the best he has put up in the last 3 seasons and only 1 tenth of a yard below his career high of 5.5 in 2008. So no there doesn't seem to be any slowing down based on the facts.

I'll post it all when I finish what I am working on. As I said, I am working on a RB post for the offseason. I do have first half and 2nd half breakdowns for Williams already. 2011 and 2008 are done. Working on Stewarts. Takes time. I do it at night when bored.

Nothing earth shattering......Stewart is getting better, Williams is declining slightly. It is suppose to happen that way given there ages.

If you don't think Williams is slowing down some.....then you simply are wearing homer glasses. Slowing down doesn't mean suck....nor is it bashing him despite you trying to paint me as a Williams basher.

I will have to work on Foster. Can't pull that stuff out of a hat or at least I don't know of any site that breaks it down for you.

[CRA]

also, can we quit with those nonsense that Williams has never been good between the tackles. 2008 he beasted between the tackles and everything inbetween. When he peaked he could do it all.

[I am Hubby]

DWill will be a Panther for life. Deal with that any way you wish. When the Panthers feel he is showing signs of lack of production they will address the situation. So when we start drafting RBs, that could be a sign of DWill demise. Until that day I am going to continue to revel in our TWO great backs.

The chances are VERY good Stew will be a Panther for life also. Whch is as it should be.

We are blessed to have two quality backs. Why in the world would you want to break that up? Feature backs wear down quick. Is that not enough to convince people that you HAVE to have two backs.

In a few years our money will be taken up by other high prices players. Will the "He is a luxury, get rid of him police come out then too?" This is the challenge. Keeping your team stocked with talent is both difficult and expensive. Let the experts figure it out.

Hey I know this is the interwebz. Everyone is intitled to their very own opinion. Somtimes however, opinions are wrong. Two quality RBs are a neccessity, not a luxury. Ask the Lions what they would do for just one healthy back, let alone two?

As the years go by Cam will be running less, our RBs will be running more. DWill and Stew are it for the moment. Down the road who knows. Just enjoy it while you can. Cuz once DWill leaves we will never be in this position again. Is that what you want?

People trying to cramp my giddy. HA And GOOOOO CATS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[megadeth078]

Why do people assume Stew doesn't want to be paid starter money in his career? Do you guys really think he wants to play for 7 more years getting paid backup money because he's in a system that extends his career? In your guys day-dream scenario of keeping both these running backs for 2 decades, do you ever stop to realize that at one point, they will BOTH have Dwill-like ridiculous contracts? Sorry if this hurts you guys, but Stew isn't gonna settle for small change just because he's part of a 2-back system that "prolongs his career". It doesn't work that way.

Running backs don't last this long in this league, regardless of your guys dream of having the same 2 running backs until 2032, and Stew is going to look to sign big real soon to insure that he gets paid before his career suddenly ends (logic of every running back in the history of the NFL ever). If he doesn't get his money soon, he will just walk. It's really that simple. We can't have both running backs getting paid that kinda money, and by "can't" I mean it wouldn't be responsible in any way at all (there's 53+ other players we have to pay, remember?). Stew is our running back of the future. He's younger, he has more potential, he can execute a wider variety of plays. We're not trying to figure out how to keep both of them forever, we're trying to figure out how soon we should look for Dwill's replacement. Dwill is gonna have to go find somewhere else to get old.

[CRA]

DWill will be a Panther for life. Deal with that any way you wish. When the Panthers feel he is showing signs of lack of production they will address the situation. So when we start drafting RBs, that could be a sign of DWill demise. Until that day I am going to continue to revel in our TWO great backs.

The chances are VERY good Stew will be a Panther for life also. Whch is as it should be.

We are blessed to have two quality backs. Why in the world would you want to break that up? Feature backs wear down quick. Is that not enough to convince people that you HAVE to have two backs.

In a few years our money will be taken up by other high prices players. Will the "He is a luxury, get rid of him police come out then too?" This is the challenge. Keeping your team stocked with talent is both difficult and expensive. Let the experts figure it out.

Hey I know this is the interwebz. Everyone is intitled to their very own opinion. Somtimes however, opinions are wrong. Two quality RBs are a neccessity, not a luxury. Ask the Lions what they would do for just one healthy back, let alone two?

As the years go by Cam will be running less, our RBs will be running more. DWill and Stew are it for the moment. Down the road who knows. Just enjoy it while you can. Cuz once DWill leaves we will never be in this position again. Is that what you want?

People trying to cramp my giddy. HA And GOOOOO CATS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

very few RBs will be with a team for life in today's NFL.......that is if they want to play when they still technically can. A 30 + yr old Williams could easily find his way to another team.

at the end of his contract, it is just common sense to assume better and younger could be brought in to replace him. Has happened to better RBs than Williams and better players. Did Montana, Rice, Emmitt Smith, Reggie White, etc.......move on at the end? Don't get too attached to players. Teams have to do what is best for the team.

If it was a neccessity, you could name another team that has drafted two 1st rounders in a 3 yr window.

When it is time for Cam to slow down, Williams will be out of the league or warming a bench.

Not about Williams, about building a team for today's NFL.

[CRA]

Why do people assume Stew doesn't want to be paid starter money in his career? Do you guys really think he wants to play for 7 more years getting paid backup money because he's in a system that extends his career? In your guys day-dream scenario of keeping both these running backs for 2 decades, do you ever stop to realize that at one point, they will BOTH have Dwill-like ridiculous contracts? Sorry guys, Stew isn't gonna settle for small change just because he's part of a 2-back system that "prolongs his career".

Running backs don't last this long in this league, regardless of your guys dream of having the same 2 running backs until 2032, and Stew is going to look to sign big real soon to insure that he gets paid before his career suddenly ends (logic of every running back in the history of the NFL ever). If he doesn't get his money soon, he will just walk. It's really that simple. We can't have both running backs getting paid that kinda money, and by "can't" I mean it wouldn't be responsible in any way at all (there's 53+ other players we have to pay, remember?). Stew is our running back of the future. He's younger, he has more potential, he can execute a wider variety of plays. We're not trying to figure out how to keep both of them forever, we're trying to figure out how soon we should look for Dwill's replacement. Dwill is gonna have to go find somewhere else to get old.

Stewart has said he wants to go down as an alltime great. Regardless, Stewart's contract will be bigger than the one Williams got if he stays here. He will be younger when he gets his deal and better in the scheme.

[Snake]

Baker, Mare, and Clausen will be cut. Wharton will be restructured cause there is no way we let him even test the market.

[CRA]

Another reason why Deangelo was given a lucrative contract is because it was at a time when both the fans and the league in general were saying that Carolina was cheap. That is a reputation that can destroy a franchise. JR had to set an example saying that if you play well for Carolina, you will be rewarded. We would have a terrible time trying to lure free agents to Carolina if he hadn't done something about the reputation. Now, with Cam as our QB, and JR's generosity, we can attract any free agent in the league who wants to be a part of this franchise.

All that being said, last year the coaches were putting Cam through a crash course, and we asking him to throw the ball a lot. I think that this year, we are going to run the ball a lot more, and Deangelo is going to earn that pay check this year. Think about all the uses we have for him now with Chud's playbook. We are going to see a lot more exotic plays this year like more of the option, that will be designed for Deangelo to hit home runs, which is his forte.

Pretty sure Cam will draw more FAs than the fact they overpaid to keep a super backfield intact.

First year of the new cap.....Carolina already is in a jam. Hard to lure the good FAs when you have no money to sign them.

Don't bet on a 29, 30, 31 or 32 yr old RB to be earning a fat contract with his play. Williams earned his present deal in 2008 and 2009.

Also, maybe we watched different teams, Williams limits what Chud can do when on the field. Stewart gives him all options.

[csx]

JR had to set an example saying that if you play well for Carolina, you will be rewarded.

and then they can't afford to do much of anything to bolster the weak parts of the team....it's not a very effective plan

[megadeth078]

I just wanna clear things up. Dwill is a great player, I hold no ill-feelings towards him, I've never had a problem with his play nor do I now (he would have looked better with more carries, still one-dimensional though), I appreciate what he has done for this team by showing us what's its like to have an actual running back for longer than 2 seasons, and I hope that when he leaves here in a couple more seasons, he will enjoy similar success with another franchise. But if anyone gets in the way of Stew signing a long-term deal in Carolina, you might as well be stranger, cause I don't care for you.

I'm just saying what many already know. If Dwill honestly, truly, deep down to the bottom of his heart believes he's going to finish out his career in Carolina Blue, then I would like to formally volunteer to become his agent because he has a sh*tty one.

:cam:

[CRA]

I agree that Deangelo got too much money, I can't argue that, but I just dont think that he is as run down as you guys make him out. This isnt old-school football where you have one RB that carries the ball 300+ times a season and is dead at age 30.

Deangelo was a back-up for 2 years, and then he shared his carries almost the whole time after that. He can still get the job done, and he still has speed.

Now that we have a full offseason, Chud gets to get into the exotic plays in his playbook that we didnt see much of until late in the season last year. Some of those plays, like the option for example, are going to be perfect for Deangelo to get him the ball in space.

I think that he has at least 3 more good years.

I am not saying he is run down NOW. At 29, 30, 31, and 32.....he will most likely get there fast.

It gets lost when I or others talk about the RB situation.....although it may appear to be DWill bashing session.....it is more of a prasing of how the rest of our backfield/rushing attack and the years they should have in them.

I agree, Williams can play another 3 years. He just won't deserve to steal many touches from runners like Newton/Stewart during that window. Also, it would help to spell Stewart w/ a RB who fits the scheme better and can pass block and catch better.

also, turning 30 for a RB isn't just about touches/hits....it is also flat out age. You can't do what you did at 25 regardless of hits.

[Wyank]

To me it never has been whether Deangelo Williams will have tread left in 3 years. It's been what front office in their right mind would have a cap figure of 16-20 mil being used up on 2 RB splitting time on the field?

I really wish there was a legit source that stated Williams cap hit before escalators each season for the remainder of his contract. He is getting something like 8.7 mil next year. Stewart will get a bigger contract after next year if he is to stay. 17-20 mil on 2 RB per year?

[CRA]

good point. That is alot of money tied up in players that split carries.

especially with a QB also added in taking rushing reps. So they are splitting less reps to a degree than they would with pure pocket passer.