Pat White in the second round for Panthers?

[Nu Guns]

Vick's playing style is disliked for the simlar reasons as Shaq in his prime. All Shaq could do is dunk and all Vick can do is run.

A lot of people myself included hate Vick's style because it changes the game. TRhats just my own personal annoyance though. I have no issue with scrambling QB'S, but Vick and Young can only impress running the ball not passing it.

Vick and Young will poster boys for mobile qb's for a long time. They were marketed to death by the NFL .

S.Young,Cunningham,Mcnabb could also pass the ball. If Pat White playing style is more like them...I will take him!

[Mr. Scot]

im confused? when did the discussion go from football to race?

Generally happens about the time KT posts in the thread

White suffered with a very restrictive system which as many WVU fans will attest, didn't use him properly.

I get what you're trying to say, but I don't think "restrictive" is the right word.

Rodriguez' schemes were heavily run based, and he never coached White up much as a passer. Squirrel did a pretty good job of pointing out the differences when Bill Stewart took over.

Height and lack of experience as a pocket passer are likely to be White's biggest obstacles in the NFL, but he's a hard worker and a high character guy. I wouldn't be at all surprised to see him overcome those hurdles (and I'll be cheering if he does).

But I don't buy for a minute that any of it'll be in a Panther uniform :sosp:

[top dawg]

Damn!

I think that this thread has veered a little off the beaten path. Chubbs, KT and Squirrel have all made valid points to try and get back on task, and I am going to give my take to try and put this monkey to bed.

As alluded to by Chubbs, Pat White is an individual. To surmise what type of player that he will be is quite natural and entertaining, but in the end it's all opinion. Like many other players, particularly QBs, coming out of college, we won't know whether White is a diamond in the rough, just another bench warmer, or even a Monday morning QB (i.e. not NFL material) until we see what he does in an NFL uniform.

Obviously, there are probably going to be some comparisons to other QBs, like maybe Vick or Young because they are mobile and black. But, like it or not, like KT has alluded to, some people probably make those comparisons simply because all three are black. The curious thing is that it appears that some of you are quick to compare the negatives, even though it is not an intellectually honest comparison because White has been a stand-up guy. So, to compare White to Vick or Young in that sense does not really hold water, and---like I said before---White is an individual. He has no history of off field antics or profound emotional issues.

One negative that has been pointed out is that White is not an accurate passer. But, like Squirrel pointed out, the statement is not accurate according to those who have followed his development. In fact, White impressed scouts at the NFL combine so much with his game (passing accuracy included), that he arguably became the biggest subject coming out of the combine. Many said that he did what Stafford and Sanchez failed to do, and that was rise to the occasion and actually surpass expectations.

One of the biggest questions (among other related issues) about White is whether his size will enable him to become an effective starting NFL QB. I would like to move the thread back towards that central question (like I alluded to many posts ago), and say again that people said the same thing about arguably the most prolific QB in the game today, Drew Brees. Moreover, perhaps the more germane question in relation to the Huddle is whether White would be worth taking if he is still on the board when our number comes up. We all have our opinions, but all I ask is that the opinions be based in fact, and not unfair and disingenuous comparisons.

[SorthNarolina]

i really don't think anybody was making the comparisons because white is black

name the really dynamic mobile qbs (who really are dangerous with the ball in their hands) of this decade and it just so happens that most of them are black, nobody is deliberatley comparing him to black qbs

trying to say that posters are intentionally ingoring guys like jeff garcia isn't really accurate, jeff garcia has never been the athlete that any of these more recent guys have been

the guy i really think of is seneca wallace, he is really the best example of what people are expecting white to be, but hopefully better utilized and more of a integral part of the offense

[King Taharqa]

Obviously, there are probably going to be some comparisons to other QBs, like maybe Vick or Young because they are mobile and black. But, like it or not, like KT has alluded to, some people probably make those comparisons simply because all three are black. The curious thing is that it appears that some of you are quick to compare the negatives, even though it is not an intellectually honest comparison because White has been a stand-up guy. So, to compare White to Vick or Young in that sense does not really hold water, and---like I dais before---White is an individual. He has no history of of ffield antics or profound emotional issues.

And thats the danger of comparing every black QB who can run fast to Mike Vick are. People assume that player is a shitty passer, and has 0 upside in that department. You've got people in this thread who have never seen the guy play but because he's black and runs fast have it programmed in their head that he must cant pass. Pat White is so much more than that. He's a high IQ guy with outstanding character that is underappreciated. Ive even seen folks on this board try to compare Vick and McNabb.

[17+89=6]

I go to ECU, and I got to see him play live this year. And a couple other times on television. But, against us, he got worked. ECU has a very good defense, and he seemed confused. He didn't know what to do himself. Of course, everyone looks at the North Carolina game and says this kids going to be good. But for me, the ECU and Colorado games offset that "amazing" bowl game. He may be good, he may not. All I know is I don't think it's a great idea to use a 2nd rounder on him.

[Squirrel]

I go to ECU, and I got to see him play live this year. And a couple other times on television. But, against us, he got worked. ECU has a very good defense, and he seemed confused. He didn't know what to do himself. Of course, everyone looks at the North Carolina game and says this kids going to be good. But for me, the ECU and Colorado games offset that "amazing" bowl game. He may be good, he may not. All I know is I don't think it's a great idea to use a 2nd rounder on him.

Beginning of the year he was learning a new system that is why he didnt look that good. He finally clicked in late November.

[rayzor]

bringing it back down to race...predictable.

move on. get over it. get your head out of the idea that people think about that in regards to football. you don't see people crying over the lack of white players at many positions at the pro level. you don't see them crying about the overwhelming number of black people dominating the NBA?

who cares about race? not as many as you think. the only people it really matters to or who thinks that it is an issue are the one that makes a big deal about it. those who don't care don't push what they feel isn't an issue.

man i hate how talks about pat white get lowered to race talk. just stop it.

[rayzor]

btw...if it isn't about race then why isn't there the screaming about The Golden Calf of Bristol and how he should be considered a QB because that is the position he wants to play. comparing The Golden Calf of Bristol's situation to The Golden Calf of Bristol's is incredibly valid. both players have played QB throughout their career, that is what they want to do, and they are being told that they should be drafted as something else.

color doesn't matter.

[Squirrel]

Because The Golden Calf of Bristol sucks.

[King Taharqa]

bringing it back down to race...predictable.

move on. get over it. get your head out of the idea that people think about that in regards to football. you don't see people crying over the lack of white players at many positions at the pro level.

You also dont hear about black people crying over the lack black kickers and punters at the pro level? Why? Because kicker is not a leadership role. Thats not a position of authority or one who is looked to for that. Nobody cares about being no damn kicker. The NFL in all levels of this game from the front office to the football field TRADITIONALLY doesnt put blacks in positions of authority. In 75 years of football, 1 black GM, 10 black head coaches, probably less than 20 starting black QBs out of a pool of thousands upon thousands of opportunities. Keep in mind this is a league that has made billions upon billions of $$$ on the thousands upon thousands of black athletes who've played in it. If those FACTS embarass you, be mad at the NFL for embracing their "good old boy" culture.

you don't see them crying about the overwhelming number of black people dominating the NBA?

I hear people bitching about the NBA all the time and raving about college basketball who are "harder working" and more "fundamentally sound" because they dont get paid. Its no secret alot of the NFL fanbase and old guard HATE the NBA.

who cares about race? not as many as you think. the only people it really matters to or who thinks that it is an issue are the one that makes a big deal about it. those who don't care don't push what they feel isn't an issue.

man i hate how talks about pat white get lowered to race talk. just stop it.

Get used to it. Until you see more black QBs get more opportunities to shine and people stop putting burdens on them that they never even dream of putting on the white players with less athletic ability deal with it. In 14 years of football the Panthers have had 3 black QBs on their roster. 2 never saw virtually any gameday action, and the other was a 1st year stopgap who was quickly disposed of when the opportunity presented itself the following year. So if it makes you mad that someone points out that FACT, be mad at the Panthers.

[rayzor]

i can't get mad because color doesn't matter to me.

i just see players. i don't care what their skin color is any more than i care about mine or yours.

i won't hire someone, fire someone, work with someone, work for someone, be friends with someone, be fans of someone based on the color of their skin. it has nothing to do with perceived ability to lead. we as a culture have gotten past that....well, most of us have. the panthers should never hire someone for any job just because we need another one to fill this quota and say that they aren't a racist organization. they should always get the best available person for the job regardless of their pigmentation.

doing that for any reason is wrong.

[X-Clown]

You also dont hear about black people crying over the lack black kickers and punters at the pro level? Why? Because kicker is not a leadership role. Thats not a position of authority or one who is looked to for that. Nobody cares about being no damn kicker. The NFL in all levels of this game from the front office to the football field TRADITIONALLY doesnt put blacks in positions of authority. In 75 years of football, 1 black GM, 10 black head coaches, probably less than 20 starting black QBs out of a pool of thousands upon thousands of opportunities. Keep in mind this is a league that has made billions upon billions of $$$ on the thousands upon thousands of black athletes who've played in it. If those FACTS embarass you, be mad at the NFL for embracing their "good old boy" culture.

Have there really been only 10 black head coaches in league history? I'm coming up with 10 just off the top of my head and I know I have to be forgetting some.

Mike Tomlin

Lovie Smith

Tony Dungy

Dennis Green

Art Shell

Herm Edwards

Marvin Lewis

Romeo Crennel

Mike Singletary

Raheem Morris

You notice a lot of those guys have coached in the last 3 years...I think we're starting to see a turn on that corner, especially since 3 of the last 6 superbowl coaches have been black, including two superbowl winners in Tomlin and Dungy.

I hear people bitching about the NBA all the time and raving about college basketball who are "harder working" and more "fundamentally sound" because they dont get paid. Its no secret alot of the NFL fanbase and old guard HATE the NBA.

I will agree with this as 100% correct. The league is "watered down" and "full of thugs".

Get used to it. Until you see more black QBs get more opportunities to shine and people stop putting burdens on them that they never even dream of putting on the white players with less athletic ability deal with it. In 14 years of football the Panthers have had 3 black QBs on their roster. 2 never saw virtually any gameday action, and the other was a 1st year stopgap who was quickly disposed of when the opportunity presented itself the following year. So if it makes you mad that someone points out that FACT, be mad at the Panthers.

Sounds like it's more of a league problem than a Panther specific one.

[King Taharqa]

I dont think the Panthers are a racist organization and I dont think they should hire someone just because. But their track record speaks for itself. They've NEVER drafted a black QB EVER. What does that tell us? That tells us they dont value the ability and potential a black QB can bring to this franchise. A guy people can look up to as a leader and face. A guy that can make plays with his arm and his feet. A guy that can rally his teammates and inspire them thru his unique style of play. When they wanted players at other positions, they found ways to get those players. Yet we've never nabbed us a young black QB wiith some upside and ability. To ignore that trend is looney. And its not like we havent drafted the Chris Weinkes and Stefan Lefors of the world!! We always claim we want to be Pittsburgh. Pittsburgh had 2 black QBs on their roster just last year! And get this, they won a Super Bowl! Dan Rooney has been a trail blazer in the league for giving black guys opportunities as leaders. He is a living legend. The rest of the league including the Panthers needs to catch up.