The Season Is Over

[carpanfan96]

Really?

You seem to believe that their sack, hits and pressures are similar when they aren't. CJ and Allen are two of the leagues premier pass rushers are operating at slightly higher level to Hardy, who was in turn significantly more productive than Brown.

Your claim on stop percentages is kinda pointless and statistically insignificant due to the sheer lack of tackles Brown had made. This means your claimed 5% difference was in fact 1-2 defensive stop variance.

Run defence is what rookies and first time starters struggle with, game experience will help them improve on this. Regardless your decision that he is 'terrible' against the run is a bit extreme. He got exposed in 4 games this season, but also had some pretty darn good games against the run as well. He's raw, but improving and he had a non-stop attitude regardless of the score which suggests he will only get better.

I quoted my source earlier in the thread. Profootballfocus are an independent site, that assign all stats post game, so there are no incorrectly assigned statistic. They also justify how they record pressure so it's not plucked out of thin air like most sites.

Then either they messed up on posting the information of you did in moving it over to here.

In 2010 their numbers are very comparable, however, Brown had a better stop rate (84% vs. 73%). Hardy's 65% stop rate against the run was in the 60's among NFL DE's Compared to a smaller second year player.

Hardy has improved at getting to the QB, but he sucks against the RUN. Yes he's terrible against the run. It isn't harsh, when he ranks 66th in the NFL against the run. Brown ranked 25th against the run > Hardy 66th...

On top of that, he showed very little improvement against the run this season.

http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcsouth/post/_/id/8852/counting-qb-pressures-and-hurries

http://www.everettebrownfranchise.com/ssp/bio

http://www.panthers.com/team/roster/Everette-Brown/87e49ca5-1fc3-40d4-aeb6-bf43fc562240

so forth....so forth..

I don't care how good Hardy is at Rushing the QB when he's as bad as he is stopping the Run. It's not a young players struggles with thing as the Brown stats show. He's just that Bad and has always been that bad against the run. Look at his draft profile > it basically comes out and says he's horrible against the run and it's because he over pursues that he gets that many hurries in the first place. He's a third down pass rusher because of his get the QB on every damn play mentality.

Also like I said earlier, the QB pressure stats are wrong and it's noted on multiple sites that those stats are wrong.

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/player/24437/greg-hardy

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/player/22220/everette-brown

[Urrymonster]

Then either they messed up on posting the information of you did in moving it over to here.

In 2010 their numbers are very comparable, however, Brown had a better stop rate (84% vs. 73%). Hardy's 65% stop rate against the run was in the 60's among NFL DE's Compared to a smaller second year player.

Hardy has improved at getting to the QB, but he sucks against the RUN. Yes he's terrible against the run. It isn't harsh, when he ranks 66th in the NFL against the run. Brown ranked 25th against the run > Hardy 66th...

On top of that, he showed very little improvement against the run this season.

http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcsouth/post/_/id/8852/counting-qb-pressures-and-hurries

http://www.everettebrownfranchise.com/ssp/bio

http://www.panthers.com/team/roster/Everette-Brown/87e49ca5-1fc3-40d4-aeb6-bf43fc562240

so forth....so forth..

I don't care how good Hardy is at Rushing the QB when he's as bad as he is stopping the Run. It's not a young players struggles with thing as the Brown stats show. He's just that Bad and has always been that bad against the run. Look at his draft profile > it basically comes out and says he's horrible against the run and it's because he over pursues that he gets that many hurries in the first place. He's a third down pass rusher because of his get the QB on every damn play mentality.

Also like I said earlier, the QB pressure stats are wrong and it's noted on multiple sites that those stats are wrong.

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/player/24437/greg-hardy

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/player/22220/everette-brown

I seriously can't believe you are using Yasinkas' blog in which he states that the stats are subjective, Brown's own site and ESPN which do real time stat tracking rather than post game analysis.

I also can't believe that your primary reason for thinking Hardy is 'terrible' against the run is because he has a lower 'defensive stop' percentage. As you have pointed out, last year he was used primarily as a pass rushing specialist. Do you think perhaps that is a big reason that his over pursuit was exposed? I mean, if he's sent out on passing downs, he's obviously going to be thinking to stop the run first :rolleyes:

What is more baffling in your use of this statistic is that is fundamentally irrelevant. They are simply determining how many of their tackles were stops, not a percentage on how many stops they got per snap. All this proves is that Hardy makes tackles even if it's after the LoS, suggesting he hustles to plays.

You also keep claiming that Brown and Hardy had comparable seasons in 2010 and yet neglect to mention that Brown saw 130 additional snaps over Hardy.

You also are of the opinion that run stopping is the most important aspect for a DE when we are sitting in a division with Freeman, Ryan and Brees. This is a passing league and you simply have to get pressure from your front four.

Frankly your belief that PFFs stats are wrong is also naive, considering they are an independent site with not obligations to any player, rather you trust statistics offered from the league and team sites which are well known to boost their players statistics. Lets completely disregard that PFF has been used by numerous media sources recently and reporters. But most importantly, lets completely disregard that this particular site has a set way of determining pressure and hits and then applies it to every player, completely removing the subjective nature other sites use.

[saints8-0]

The biggest draft need for the Panthers is QB, Newton is Jamarcus Russel #2 or at the very best Mike Vick, he will never sniff a SB...

What a waste of a #1 pick.

[TheGreatestOfAllTimeCam]

You're the insider with the fancy Twitter account. You tell us who'll be here next year.

[bleys]

:lol:

[PhillyB]

honestly one solid pick or signing at each tier of the defense would make a huge difference... obviously the secondary needs a corner that can play across from gamble, the defensive line needs a playmaker besides CJ, and it would be foolish to ignore critical injuries suffered by beason and davis when there is a realistic possibility that their careers could both be over.

[BBQ&Beer]

The biggest draft need for the Panthers is QB, Newton is Jamarcus Russel #2 or at the very best Mike Vick, he will never sniff a SB...

What a waste of a #1 pick.

Awwwww.... I remember Buc fans saying that. 4000 as a rookie scared the poo outta you huh?