Cam vs Tim

[Showtime]

This team wouldn't have made the playoffs drafting Cam, sitting him, and starting Anderson anyway... and most veterans weren't going to come here to start for a single year.

No kidding. Who the heck even thought we would sign Anderson? Where did that even come from? If not re-signing Moore who would have been cheap as dirt wasn't obvious we had no intention from the get go to make a run for it this year, if signing Anderson didn't signal that, it sure as hell signaled it after we lost Beason, Thomas Davis, and needed receivers so damn bad earlier in the season and we did NOTHING about it.

Nothing. We were dead set on playing Cam since before draft I think and no matter what we were going to be ok with a losing season. But some wanna sit there and talk about a losing mentality when basically that's exactly what this season has been. We had no intention of offering him any real competition in training camp. We knew that getting a rookie ready for this season in a lock-out year would not be realistic. We knew teams with vet QB's would be at a huge advantage.

We laid down.

[mav1234]

Moore wasn't going to play for us, dude. He didn't want to come here and play bench warmer for a rookie again.

You're right, they did want to play Newton this year, because they decided that since they were going to play him in the future anyway they might as well play him this year.

Even despite that, our rookie QB isn't losing us as many games as our total poo defense.

[ed bell]

i was in favor of cam riding the bench this season, but i was wrong

Exactly....Moore? I wondered if he might stay, but he wasn't the sort of vet that could mentor a rookie, so I understand cutting him loose. McNabb? Overpaid and an absolute failure in Minnesota to the point where they opted for Ponder, a true rookie prospect that definitely needed time. He cleared wavers and is sitting at home. Young? A disaster of a backup on a Philly team that is one win removed from our record while being mentioned as Super Bowl material...None change the record we have, yet starting any of them stunts the growth and experience Cam gets.

[ed bell]

No kidding. Who the heck even thought we would sign Anderson? Where did that even come from?

He's a veteran ex-pro bowler under Chud....knows the system, how it's implemented and how to succeed in it....made perfect sense. No complaint there...I hated it when I thought we might have to utilize him, but now I see the direction.

[Showtime]

Let me put it to you this way. If you really have come to the belief this team didn't have the personnel to make a good run for it this year, I have news for you. Outside of Cam Newton and a tight end...we are in worse shape right now, personnel wise, then we were at the start of this season. We are missing a lot of big name players, and we did little outside of getting Olson and Cam Newton to prepare us for a winning season next year. We don't even have a damn serious back-up QB man.

We are worse. So if you think the answer is personnel, then it's going to take another 3 years to fill all the holes and I expect more holes to continue opening up so you have plenty of time to keep making these types of excuses.

But I don't buy into all that. All this team really needed was re-gaining stability at coaching, a sound coaching philosophy, some solid QB play under center and some consistency. What we need is solid execution. That's basically what's missing. Building from the top down. It's not personnel that's kept us from winning. It was execution. It was mistakes. It was penalties. It was not finishing. It was giving up plays on defense. It was a rookie QB who gets flustered. It was a gazillion picks in bad times.

Teams with stacked rosters, vets, and elite QB's would end up losing if they played as sloppy and bad as we did, and they do. Philly and the Cowboys for example. Philly was the "dream team". Losers cause they can't get their poo together and play bad football. Cowboys, the same.

Meanwhile you guy act like teams like the 49ers, Lions, Broncos, Cincinnati, Houston, Titans have this incredible line-up of players and don't have the same issues we do. Houston is down to their third string QB and is a damn rookie. These teams aren't freaking more stacked than Philladelphia and Cowboys. They are just better coached, have a better attitude, and they are playing better football. They execute. They play as a team. They are in it to win it. They all started with a good coach and good coaching and they can plug guys in and out and continue chugging along. And they don't make a lot of mistakes. That's what makes a good team. That's what we had for awhile there.

[Showtime]

He's a veteran ex-pro bowler under Chud....knows the system, how it's implemented and how to succeed in it....made perfect sense. No complaint there...I hated it when I thought we might have to utilize him, but now I see the direction.

Really so why didn't we start him game 1 if he was so good? How the fug did he get beat by a guy who's never even learned basic football QB strategy in college? Come on. We started Cam because of one reason and one reason alone:

"No matter what happens we can still make a damn buck of this kid"

Anderson wasn't going to sell tickets. Fans would have not accepted this type of season so kindly if we were going to lose with a vet under center.

[mav1234]

What this team really needed to have any shot this year was for us not to go into a season without a starting DT on the active roster and without a decent #2 CB and to lose two of our starting three linebackers.

[Showtime]

Exactly....Moore? I wondered if he might stay, but he wasn't the sort of vet that could mentor a rookie, so I understand cutting him loose. McNabb? Overpaid and an absolute failure in Minnesota to the point where they opted for Ponder, a true rookie prospect that definitely needed time. He cleared wavers and is sitting at home. Young? A disaster of a backup on a Philly team that is one win removed from our record while being mentioned as Super Bowl material...None change the record we have, yet starting any of them stunts the growth and experience Cam gets.

And Anderson is? We had Weinke mentoring Cam. WEINKE! I laughed when read about it this past summer. Let me say it again: WEINKE!

I didn't want us to keep Moore to mentor Cam. The starting QB's primary job isn't to mentor back-ups. If we wanted a mentor for Cam, keep Jake. That guy actually has experience and is a good leader and that's what you want from mentors. Not to teach you the skill part, but to teach you leadership, a few pointers here and there. Like for example, how to handle pressure. But there's a QB coach position for the rest of that. I mean come on, let a leader like Delhomme walk who would would have been perfect for mentoring a QB and would have automatically gained Cam's respect, and use Anderson and Weinke. Makes no damn sense. Moore would have been fine. We would have done better with Moore, and Moore would have performed much better with us and our players than he's done in Miami. He's dealing with the same poo there, that he dealt with here, and still managed a few wins with that pooty as team. Consistency and stability goes a long way, something we didn't have last year. In the future Cam might be the long term answer, but as far as transitioning goes, no doubt that would have been the smarter choice.

I don't see how anyone can say that was the correct decision. What it was in reality was the cheapest possible way of running a team in a season that they believed would be a losing season.

What other coach in the NFL and what other organization keeps talking about having a "young team that's growing and learning" 14 weeks into a losing season and actually gets to feel comfortable about keeping their job? Only us.

It's like a sermon at church on Sunday morning.

[mav1234]

also I really don't think they started Cam purely because of money. They did it because they saw that the last group of rookies to start their first year did very well, especially with a decent defense around them. The FO figured, hey, we've got one of the best defensive coaches in the league, one of the best MLBs in the league, a great line backing corps, young players we believe it, it'll be great! But.. it wasn't. Our defense blows... and it shows. harr.

[Showtime]

also I really don't think they started Cam purely because of money. They did it because they saw that the last group of rookies to start their first year did very well, especially with a decent defense around them. The FO figured, hey, we've got one of the best defensive coaches in the league, one of the best MLBs in the league, a great line backing corps, young players we believe it, it'll be great! But.. it wasn't. Our defense blows... and it shows. harr.

With a first year coach and without a solid vet that they actually beat in a lockout year? It's apples and oranges. You can't compare us and our situation, and 2010, with those other years.

The kid had his own media workout for Christ's sake and the media drooled and foamed at the mouth. He could sell TV without even being in the NFL. I think sometimes people forget the difference between college and NFL, is that this is primarily a business and sometimes you have to deal with poo like this which is what sometimes makes pro sports shitty.

[teeray]

Unless we signed Brees, Rodgers, or Brady this team would still be 4-9. Maybe worse. You can't win with a terrible defense unless you have a super elite QB. Cam may be that some day but he isn't right now as a rookie.

What Cam and the entire offense has been is good enough to win a lot of games. Unfortunately, our other two units have not done their jobs.

[Dilated_chakra]

Showtime with the exception of the titans game we have had a chance to win every game this year and a good chance at that with the toughest schedule in the league. The cards just didn't fall in our favor and we learned how to lose all the close ones. IMO we have talent and are well coached. It's actually amazing how we have played with a new system and a very young team with minimal time to prepare. To me cam looks like a seasoned vet and I would rather have him than anyone. you are the dumbest fan I have ever seen on the huddle which happens to have the dumbest bloggers in the history of the web. You sir take the top prize.

[ed bell]

Uhm Matt Moore, Mcnabb, Young, you name it. Even Jake Delhomme would have given us a better chance at a winning season this year. Any of those guys would have been a smarter decision day 1 than a rookie QB who self-admitted had no idea how to read NFL defenses in a lockout year.

Four wrong answers...I asked for the veteran that would have been a better option and you gave me two guys who have turned in absolutely pathetic performances, a guy who wasn't even on any roster until an emergency signing allowed him to hold a clipboard and Moore, who needed a change and wasn't staying here.

This is all that translates to: " Since we ended up losing, it couldn't have possible been any better no matter what we would have done."

Don't put words in my mouth.....sounds good lodged in your wall of text nobody wanted, but dead wrong and amusing considering your suggestions outlined above.

Harbaugh - 49ers. Winning

Cincinnati-Bengals. Decent.

Fox -Broncos - Winning.

49ers- doing great, we'll see how that works out...Bengals, doing what you are absolutely against,so nice try there...and we are seeing how that is working out....Broncos? 1-6 with Orton, fans revolt, Elway caves in and no way Fox was OK with the The Golden Calf of Bristol option. They went with the "OK fans, you asked for it". Then The Golden Calf of Bristol does what he did, tried his best with tremendous results in the win column, but he's almost as much of a rookie as Cam considering a brand new regime.

I mean look around. Even Yates, a third string QB. Rode the bench all season long. Came in and won 2 back to back. Playing rookie QB's is not quite 100% guarantee you will end up having a losing season, but it's up there. It's pretty damn close.

Great example, a complete playoff team on both sides of the ball manages to win games with a QB who hasn't started a game in his life.....hmmmmm

Teams who went with rookies: Vikings, Jaguars, us...losers. Only Cinci pulled it off...barely and they are not done yet. Things are not looking so hot for them anymore either.

Wrong, McNabb was benched then released; right, but they cut an 8 million salary and the consensus starter who is now unemployed; right, but it was the correct move considering the options of Anderson and Clausen; and right....Cincinati's very good defense wasn't able to continue to carry the inexperienced QB, but they made a great gutsy call as well, and it should pay off. Good for Cincinati. They have sucked balls for DECADES.

You really don't think we would have been better off in a lock-out year with a veteran QB? You don't think it would have been in everyone's best interest if we would have re-signed a vet, let Cam learn in practice or compete for the job? You don't think Cam Newton would have been better off concentrating in practice, learning the basics, before actually stepping foot on the field? Do you truly buy into this retarded mentality all this somehow helped Cam Newton develop into an elite QB in the long run? That this is how you develop elite QB's?

Cam's real game experience providing him with an accelerated development schedule and invaluable leg up on fulfilling the role of our franchise QB is a retarded mentality? While your best option was claiming we're a "winning" playoff team by simply replacing Cam with Matt Moore, while Cam practices against our second team/practice squad defense? Wow...

Give me a break. It has nothing to do with it. It's just an excuse. It's not backed up by anything. You think if the Colts didn't play Peyton and he didn't throw 28 picks his first year, he would have never ended up a good QB?

He most certainly didn't need to start as a rookie to become an elite QB, but I'd be a fool to say it was a bad decision. I asked if you had seen the QB situation the Colts were in....and had been in for years....find a backup QB listed for 1998...look who was on the 1997 roster....they made the best call despite the terrible year. Reminds me of us in some ways.

This is exactly what I am talking about. Sound logic. Common sense. It's just right out the window this year. It's gone for most people.

I've seen enough of your logic here, and "sound" doesn't exactly spring into mind. I've got enough common sense to be able to decide that.

[ed bell]

Unless we signed Brees, Rodgers, or Brady this team would still be 4-9. Maybe worse. You can't win with a terrible defense unless you have a super elite QB. Cam may be that some day but he isn't right now as a rookie.

What Cam and the entire offense has been is good enough to win a lot of games. Unfortunately, our other two units have not done their jobs.

Pretty much....what did I read today? The Panthers have never averaged more yards per attempt on offense and allowed more yards per attempt on defense.....add the rookie mistakes, short off-season and rookie staff....