Admit it, as soon as Rivera shut it down with 1 min left in 1st half...

[pantherpain]

We all knew it was coming, it's the Panther way.

[mav1234]

Bleys, if we only expected that because of "the trend," then I guess Mike Smith didn't expect a collapse at all considering he called those timeouts when we started doing it.

He knows we can't close games because we don't make adjustments. They did the same thing in Atlanta, difference was we didn't control that game at any point like we did this one.

How many times does the same thing have to happen before people understand it isn't just "being young" or things not going our way. There are some serious problems with coaching here.

You guys act like this happens all the time or something. Here's what it has been this year:

vs ARZ: 1 minute left, drive for a FG by us, ARZ get ball to start 2nd half

vs GB: 45 seconds left, failed drive for us, GB gets ball to start 2nd half

vs Jax: 1:30 left, we try to drive but have to punt after a penalty call, Jax gets ball to start 2nd half

vs CHI: 2:32 left, we drive for a FG, CHI gets ball to start 2nd half

vs NO: Saints had like a 4 minute drive to end the first half. They also got the ball to start the 2nd half.

vs ATL1: 3:50ish left, we drive and drive ends in an interception which ATL does nothing with other than burn clock, but this really isn't the final 2 minutes so is not the same thing. We get the ball to start the second half.

vs WAS: 1 m left, we throw some incompletes, punt it away, get a fumble recovery, kick a FG. They get the ball to start the 2nd half

vs MIN: 42 seconds left, we run D-Will once then go to the half. We get the ball to start the 2nd half.

vs TEN: We tried to drive but it didn't matter, we were getting hammered.

vs DET: 3:50ish left, we were being safe but a DET penalty got us a first down so Rivera went for it, got a FG. We got the ball to start the 2nd half.

vs IND: 1:46 left, drive for a blocked FG. They get the ball to start the 2nd half.

vs TB: 1 m left, we drive for a FG. They get the ball to start the 2nd half.

vs Atl2: 1:30 left, we are forced to punt after a few runs. We get the ball to start the 2nd half.

Ok so...

vs Minnesota we went to the half after letting the clock run out, lost the game, vs Detroit we got a FG at the end of the half, lost the game... Both games we got the ball to start the 3rd quarter.

I think Rivera basically has decided he generally will run the clock out at the end of a half if he gets the ball back to start the 3rd. He isn't the only coach to look at it that way.

[Proudiddy]

That's key. The individual playcalling on offense and defense by the coordinators is definitely more aggressive than it was under Fox, but all of the in-game head coaching decisions are just as conservative as they've ever been.

Yup. We look cooler losing, but we're still losing because we're scared to win.

[Sword]

it just show's Rivera doesn't know how to manage situations when the team is ahead at half time.

[Sam Mills Fan]

It's not the getting conservative with 2 minutes left in the half so much as it is just getting extremely conservative in general as soon as we go up by 14+ points whenever.

[Proudiddy]

You guys act like this happens all the time or something. Here's what it has been this year:

vs ARZ: 1 minute left, drive for a FG by us, ARZ get ball to start 2nd half

vs GB: 45 seconds left, failed drive for us, GB gets ball to start 2nd half

vs Jax: 1:30 left, we try to drive but have to punt after a penalty call, Jax gets ball to start 2nd half

vs CHI: 2:32 left, we drive for a FG, CHI gets ball to start 2nd half

vs NO: Saints had like a 4 minute drive to end the first half. They also got the ball to start the 2nd half.

vs ATL1: 3:50ish left, we drive and drive ends in an interception which ATL does nothing with other than burn clock, but this really isn't the final 2 minutes so is not the same thing. We get the ball to start the second half.

vs WAS: 1 m left, we throw some incompletes, punt it away, get a fumble recovery, kick a FG. They get the ball to start the 2nd half

vs MIN: 42 seconds left, we run D-Will once then go to the half. We get the ball to start the 2nd half.

vs TEN: We tried to drive but it didn't matter, we were getting hammered.

vs DET: 3:50ish left, we were being safe but a DET penalty got us a first down so Rivera went for it, got a FG. We got the ball to start the 2nd half.

vs IND: 1:46 left, drive for a blocked FG. They get the ball to start the 2nd half.

vs TB: 1 m left, we drive for a FG. They get the ball to start the 2nd half.

vs Atl2: 1:30 left, we are forced to punt after a few runs. We get the ball to start the 2nd half.

Ok so...

vs Minnesota we went to the half after letting the clock run out, lost the game, vs Detroit we got a FG at the end of the half, lost the game... Both games we got the ball to start the 3rd quarter.

I think Rivera basically has decided he generally will run the clock out at the end of a half if he gets the ball back to start the 3rd. He isn't the only coach to look at it that way.

It's not just taking into account the last drive of the 1st and first drive of the 2nd... It's the philosophical approach.

[mav1234]

But mav, now imagine we actually try to drive down the field to end the first half and get at least a FG...

Now we get the ball in the second half... What if we get a FG there too? What if we got a TD on either of those drives? The game would've been over, no need to press if they score.

We play to not lose rather than play to win. Coach has changed but the philosophy hasn't...

you're playing with hypotheticals but there are a million scenarios that change the outcome of this game. What if we go down the field and score at the start of the 2nd half and get a TD?? What if we go down the field and Cam doesn't throw an interception and we get a FG or TD?? The game would've been over, no need to press if they score! What if Mare makes the kick? What if the defense intercepts that Ryan pass instead of JJ catching a 77+ yard TD? What if we score any points at all in the 2nd half?

Just no point... We've lost many games where we had FGs at the end of halves, and we've won others. I don't think that drive killed it for this offense at all. If it did, then we've got some growing up to do.

[Proudiddy]

It's not the getting conservative with 2 minutes left in the half so much as it is just getting extremely conservative in general as soon as we go up by 14+ points whenever.

This.

The same thing I complained about in the famous "regressing" thread about Chud, which I said was hurting Cam as a result... Look what happened today.

[bleys]

yeah, that's what I said.

smh...

coaches don't execute on the field...

McDermott is legit too...

[doghead28]

yes i had a bad feeling after that. I was yellling at the tv"don't go john fox on me now!" but they did.

[mav1234]

It's not just taking into account the last drive of the 1st and first drive of the 2nd... It's the philosophical approach.

The thing is, we complain when Cam/Chud go deep too much, we complain when they don't. We open the 2nd half with a deep pass, a run, and another pass. We weren't getting conservative and we were still trying to win, but the execution wasn't there.

Hell, if anything, that last series of the game is a good example of why sometimes you don't want to try to go for it all at once and instead you need a different approach to moving the ball. Meh.

[Matthias]

For those of you who didn't think this effected the game, Cam was coming off the field shaking his head. That is a visible sign the playcalling effected him deeply.

[Proudiddy]

you're playing with hypotheticals but there are a million scenarios that change the outcome of this game. What if we go down the field and score at the start of the 2nd half and get a TD?? What if we go down the field and Cam doesn't throw an interception and we get a FG or TD?? The game would've been over, no need to press if they score! What if Mare makes the kick? What if the defense intercepts that Ryan pass instead of JJ catching a 77+ yard TD? What if we score any points at all in the 2nd half?

Just no point... We've lost many games where we had FGs at the end of halves, and we've won others. I don't think that drive killed it for this offense at all. If it did, then we've got some growing up to do.

You're right, there are a lot of "what ifs," but we don't know because we don't try. Again, it's the philosophy, not specific plays.

[mav1234]

For those of you who didn't think this effected the game, Cam was coming off the field shaking his head. That is a visible sign the playcalling effected him deeply.

if Cam and this team are so mentally weak that not getting a first down because your power running back gets stopped on 3rd and 1 defeated him to the point the game was lost for our offense on that possession, we're in trouble.

You're right, there are a lot of "what ifs," but we don't know because we don't try. Again, it's the philosophy, not specific plays.

but that's the whole thing, I completely disagree that is his philosophy... running out the clock to try to go in with a 23 to 7 lead isn't being overly conservative, especially when your bruising back actually gains 9 yards on 2 carries. It wasn't like he had them kneel on it, but for all we know Chud actually saw something he thought could be exploited with Stew.

it's 3rd and 1, and you want to tell me you think we shouldn't hand it to J Stew? Meh. I like seeing Cam convert them but I don't think that giving it to Stew instead of Cam was evidence of a reluctance to actually keep on the pressure, and the fact our 3rd quarter drive started with the pass it did tells me we weren't trying to go conservative.