"Building through the Draft" is the motto of losers

[Sam Mills Fan]

Every Super Bowl champion of the past decade except Steeler ones have had big-time free agent contributors. And all three times the Panthers made the NFC CG, those teams had big-time free agent contributors too.

It's laughable to suggest that the Packers don't sign anyone. Do the names Ryan Pickett and Charles Woodson mean anything to you guys? Both of those signings, especially Woodson, are about as big as they come. They also have plenty of other key contributors that came via free agency or trade.

If you use the Packers as an example, you should feel very very embarrassed that you don't know what you're talking about.

[Sam Mills Fan]

I do disagree that building through the draft is the "motto of losers" though. Ideally, you'd like the majority of your starters to be guys that you drafted with natural holes (because it's impossible to hit on all of your picks and you only get 7 base picks per year anyway)filled by quality free agents.

That's the thing I don't get. It's like if you want quality free agents to be signed, then you don't want to build through the draft. Why is it impossible to do both? I'm not saying we need to go on an Eagles spending spree, that's taking free agency to the extreme. But the other extreme is what the Panthers under Marty Hurney do as in not signing anyone worth a damn. Why not mix them together and have a happy medium?

[TheOracle]

The best idea is to make smart draft choices and pick up reliable no-BS free agents. Until we consistently do that we'll be talking about "next year".

Agree for the most part, but it depends on how you define smart. If you draft guys in hopes that they'll turn into pro bowlers based on what your scouts said, then you're starting off stupid. You're putting all of your eggs in a basket if that's your mindset heading in. Then when they don't pan out, you start back over looking at the next draft class?

Every decision that's made is based on a "PHILOSOPHY". Hurney preaches "building through the draft". This thread is simply a critique of that philosophy.

I think the draft is important, but I think it's less important for "winning" franchises than it is for losing ones. The question then becomes, is the Draft only what it takes to get a team to the "winning" group? Clearly, no.

But again, a few smart moves these days, a winning season happens, and now you have guys knocking on your door trying to get in, and then you have the advantage in CHOOSING who to take.

This is about strategy. Building a winner. Starts with changing the way Hurney thinks. Free Agency this offseason coming up, is the next step in getting the Panthers moving in the direction they want to go quicker than just drafting guys and HOPING they turn into something.

[Gabeking]

[Mage]

Do the names Ryan Pickett and Charles Woodson mean anything to you guys?

And how long did it take for them to win the Super Bowl after signing Woodson?

Their drafting was clearly far more important in their Super Bowl victory (Matthews, Raji, Rodgers, Sitton, Jennings, Nelson, Jones, Collins, etc.). You build your team through the draft and then you sign a free agent that you feel will certainly make or break your team.

But, even still, the Steelers example is valid. They never sign big time free agents and always build through the draft. They always win. Redskins always sign free agents and they always lose.

[Udogg]

And how long did it take for them to win the Super Bowl after signing Woodson?

Their drafting was clearly far more important in their Super Bowl victory (Matthews, Raji, Rodgers, Sitton, Jennings, Nelson, Jones, Collins, etc.). You build your team through the draft and then you sign a free agent that you feel will certainly make or break your team.

But, even still, the Steelers example is valid. They never sign big time free agents and always build through the draft. They always win. Redskins always sign free agents and they always lose.

Good post. Also to add to that. Is the big time FA cost to value really worth it. Let's take Julius Peppers for example. We all know he is a great player (people who say he isn't are still bitter). He does makes the bears defense better. However is he so much better that it justifies his cost? Wouldn't it be worth it to Chicago to have to quality WR (Mike Martz offense) rather than Julius Peppers? How about improving the OL to keep Cutler from dying? The bears defense seemed to be doing fine before Julius got there imo.

Also using GB for example, the Charles Woodson of GB isn't the Charles Woodson of the Raiders. He is instrumental, and a great player. But the other corners are monsters also. There defense can afford to jump routes and gamble. They encourage it. Also playing with the lead all the time and having teams have to press to score because #12 and Driver,Nelson, Jennings,etc are coming on the field makes it easier also.

I don't disagree that some "QUALITY" FA could help this team win. But defining that term and picking the right players is not as easy as people make it seem.

[csx]

I do disagree that building through the draft is the "motto of losers" though. Ideally, you'd like the majority of your starters to be guys that you drafted with natural holes (because it's impossible to hit on all of your picks and you only get 7 base picks per year anyway)filled by quality free agents.

That's the thing I don't get. It's like if you want quality free agents to be signed, then you don't want to build through the draft. Why is it impossible to do both? I'm not saying we need to go on an Eagles spending spree, that's taking free agency to the extreme. But the other extreme is what the Panthers under Marty Hurney do as in not signing anyone worth a damn. Why not mix them together and have a happy medium?

You do mix but you need the ratio to lean towards a draft buit team. Build through the draft and take advantage of what's available to fill a hole or get that special player. You can afford to do that when you draft well.

[CPSupporter]

Yea you are probably right. It isn't like the GB's current roster is 48 out of 52 draft picks. YOU ARE A DUMBA$$! Go sit down and come up with a better complaint.

[(╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻]

Oh look, another thread where fans think that they know how to build a winning football organization.

[TheOracle]

And how long did it take for them to win the Super Bowl after signing Woodson?

Their drafting was clearly far more important in their Super Bowl victory (Matthews, Raji, Rodgers, Sitton, Jennings, Nelson, Jones, Collins, etc.). You build your team through the draft and then you sign a free agent that you feel will certainly make or break your team.

But, even still, the Steelers example is valid. They never sign big time free agents and always build through the draft. They always win. Redskins always sign free agents and they always lose.

First of all, using Dan Snyder and the 2011 Philadelphia Eagles as examples to try and disprove this is a joke. Both just spend or spent money on shiny objects without much PLANNING put into it. Them failing is a sign that STUPID DECISIONS come back to bite you. I'm talking about "SMART" signings.

Define "build your team". Most of the players on any team at any given time will likely be that team's draft picks, some undrafted players they picked up. That's the nucleus. The draft is going to occur, players are going to be drafted. You talk about "a" key free agent making or breaking a team. Well, what's different than what I'm saying? The Panthers should pick up some SECONDARY HELP in Free Agency from proven commodities if they can and maybe another D lineman if none of these new guys they just picked up show anything the next four games, and maybe draft a couple of quality young linebackers which is a position that shouldn't be hard to find.

I'm all for drafting smart. I'm criticizing Hurney's stubborn FIXATION on the draft, at the expense of doing whatever it takes to build a winner. If the team and fans are fine with hovering in mediocrity for a few years in hopes that guys will live up to the potential that Hurney sees in them, then make the draft 90% of the plan. If the team wants to win sooner (not discounting drafting well which should still be occurring during this time), then make some good signings at key positions and build for the short- and long-term.

That's all I'm saying.:cornut:

[Jangler]

I guess The Oracle lost his virginity cuz he ain't seeing poo anymore.

[Killa Cam 69]

this guy is hilarious

[Brooklyn Bully]

You win by doing BOTH, people. You sign some good FAs AND you build via the Draft. The OP has a slight point, no matter how much you want to rub GB and Pitt in his face. BTW, they have stellar QBs. Now we do too.

Look, our pitiful past speaks for itself. We're obviously not doing something right. If you want to see what happens now that we do have the QB, fine. But you have to do both, IMO, to win in the NFL. Hopefully they draft well next season, the guys they drafted this season pan out, and they add some FAs who WILL perform from day one and aren't some scrub from another team.

Do that, and then we have a chance to not be the same lowly piece of crap team we've always been.

[davos]

You win by doing BOTH, people. You sign some good FAs AND you build via the Draft. The OP has a slight point, no matter how much you want to rub GB and Pitt in his face. BTW, they have stellar QBs. Now we do too.

Look, our pitiful past speaks for itself. We're obviously not doing something right. If you want to see what happens now that we do have the QB, fine. But you have to do both, IMO, to win in the NFL. Hopefully they draft well next season, the guys they drafted this season pan out, and they add some FAs who WILL perform from day one and aren't some scrub from another team.

Do that, and then we have a chance to not be the same lowly piece of crap team we've always been.

boom!

good drafting + good FA signings = improved team & potential contender