Cam hasn't taken a step back

[ItsNotGonnaBeAlright]

I'd be perfectly ok with the idea that Cam has taken a step back. It would mean that he's gone from great to better than good. I'm ok with that out of a rookie.

[CRA]

It is. The first is winning and losing. The ultimate is ypp. There is nothing else that actually matters when it comes to offense, so you might as well call it last.

1. winning losing.

2. yards per point. scoring offense efficiency. or your total offense's efficiency.

Point differential comes close, but point differential is included in YPP. Because everything is included in YPP. All the NFL stats combined are included in YPP. And anything that's not a stat, but affects that team's ability to score points is also included in YPP. So if you affected our ability to score points somehow by jinxing them, your jinx would be included in ypp. EVERYTHING is included in ypp.

Winning and losing is a team stat. Simple and plain. If you watch Newton, Dalton or if you simply watch football that is indisputable......

Mark Sanchez has wins.....those wins he racked up didn't even come close to representing his QB play. It was not good. The wins was a result of the TEAM.....a top D and rushing attack. They won despite poor QB play often that year.....they got to the AFCCG despite weak rookie QB play.

[Happy Panther]

To be fair, many people had Cam in the top 5 QBs in the league just 4 weeks ago.

If you were to say that was hype back then, you'd be banned.

Ha that's hilarious.

And true.

[CRA]

Cam is a top 5 FF QB.....fantasy football has caused many people to get confused when talking about actual football.

If Cam shows some progression to finish out the season he might be at the bottom of a top 15 list.

[panthers55]

Losing Shockey and not being able to effectively run 2 TE sets has been a setback to our offense. Shockey went down on the first offensive snap of the Titans game and while he played a few snaps in that game he wasn't the same guy.

That is a point I have made as well. Shockey has actually been a lifesaver to Newton. He is money on third down and when Newton needs an outlet. Without him Newton has struggles quite a bit more in the last 2 games.

[TrueDat]

Winning and losing is a team stat. Simple and plain. If you watch Newton, Dalton or if you simply watch football that is indisputable......

Mark Sanchez has wins.....those wins he racked up didn't even come close to representing his QB play. It was not good. The wins was a result of the TEAM.....a top D and rushing attack. They won despite poor QB play often that year.....they got to the AFCCG despite weak rookie QB play.

Winning and losing is a team stat, I know.

Offensive efficiency and a total offenses yards per point efficiency ratio is an offensive stat. 95% percent of the teams who have above average efficiency in offense have winning records.

The more efficient offense wins the game 99%. Offensive efficiency is the next most important statistic. Your offense's efficiency also decides whether or not you have a good defense.

And they probably got there because they had a very efficient offense overall(running usually helps become one). So it made for a very good defense. But to have a efficient offense in the first place you need disciplined quarterback that understands what it means to have one or a coach that knows what it takes to have one and makes sure the rookie follows his directions as instructed and executes what's being asked.

[Davidson Deac II]

On the other hand, when your defense gives up 35 points in the 2nd half of the game, does it really matter what Cam does?

I am not excusing the defense at all.

But it certainly could have mattered what the offense did. One long drive for a td in the third quarter would have taken some time off the clock and given them fewer opportunities to score.

[Mr. Scot]

To be fair, many people had Cam in the top 5 QBs in the league just 4 weeks ago.

If you were to say that was hype back then, you'd be banned. If it wasn't just hype or "beginners luck" as some might put it, you'd have to say it's a step back.

If not, the early season was a mirage.

There is nothing wrong with having a step back from where he was and there is nothing to indicate this trend will continue into the future, but it's a little concerning.

Whatever it is, it doesn't matter. It won't matter until year 3.

I wasn't one of them. I don't consider him a top five QB right now.

I do, however, believe that he can develop into one. Possibly even next season.

[Proudiddy]

I think the whole we should run when we are ahead or we should have a 60-40 split is ridiculous in the context of how playcalling occurs. for example if we run on first down and get 1 yard you can count on the fact we are throwing on second down. If we are incomplete or the pass goes for less than 6 yards, we are throwing on third down. It doesn't matter whether we are ahead or behind because we need a first down and will try and get it anyway we can. On the other hand if we run the ball for 6 yards on first down, the liklihood we run again is at least 50% or higher. It is all a function of foremost down and distance to earn first downs. Running out the clock etc are issues secondarily to the primarily one which is making first downs and advancing the ball. Chud is doing that the best way he knows how. Frankly I don't have any complaints and wonder about people who do.

But, that is my issue with the scheme/play designs when it comes to runs. What does he expect in 1 RB/1 TE sets with a non-blocking TE? He runs a lot of cracks and seals using the WRs out of passing formations when we do run, but it isn't fooling anyone.

And it seems we run our best in the first half and then with the lead is when we start running for a yard a pop and end up spinning our wheels. The run game usually dies in the 2nd half in both attempts and yardage from what I remember in each game.

I don't know that we have any actual "power" runs in our playbook. Only time I've seen a semblance of them was on goal to go, and barely even then.

It's just frustrating that everytime we have gotten the lead the offense loses all rhythm and then it spirals into repeated 3 and outs and putting our sorry defense back out there to get torched...

But, it's clear we are sitting on two different sides of this thing and likely won't budge from our positions lol, so I'll just leave it at that.

[CarolinaPanthersFan#1]

Let's face it, 22 year old Cam is still a lot like a new puppy and peeing on the carpet sometimes when he KNOWS he can't be doing that.

It's like he thinks he can make ANY throw at ANY time or something. You just can't do that in the NFL where everyone is a lot smarter, bigger, and faster.

The coaches need to reel him in BEFORE he gets too reckless and makes too many mistakes. Cam may be a potential superstar in the NFL but he still needs excellent coaching along the way. Michael Jordan had a real good coach with Phil Jackson you know.

By trial and error (kinda like a puppy) Cam is learning what he can and can't get away with in the big, bad NFL. His QB coach Shula apparently needs to work with Cam even more closely on his judgment as far as when to throw it and when to just dump it off, tuck the ball and run for a few yards or just protect the ball and take the big hit in the pocket.

Shula needs to do lots of drills with Cam and closely look at his throwing motion and WHY he keeps throwing it too high too much. His timing is a bit off too. Cam needs to practice setting up to throw in the pocket at warp speed with super quick feet ... feet that can easily slide in the pocket to find a better opening in the line to throw it, etc. Cam is probably staring down receivers too much as well.

This is what the top QB coaches in the NFL get paid the big bucks for. Shula needs to be like a scientist and diagnose exactly what he's doing wrong and then train Cam over and over and over the right way to do it until it sinks in. He needs to set up in the pocket perfectly every time if possible. Perfect throwing motion every time if possible. Really good decision making every time if possible.

PERFECT PRACTICE makes perfect you know. That's how you go from the "conscious incompetence" to the mastery of "unconscious competence" as fast as possible. Lots of perfect reps, lots of time in the film room, lots of discussion with coaches and other players so everyone is "on the same page" and all that.

I remember when Peyton Manning and the Colts won the Super Bowl a few years ago and they compared the Colts passing game to the dancers in the "Nutcracker Suite" Christmas show. They practiced so hard that Peyton and the players could nearly do it blindfolded.

[Oldschool Leroy]

This is what I said about the "rookie wall" a few posts above.

That is one heck of a lot more passes that he's thrown. And that's not counting his practice passes. And that's not counting his offseason passes at IMG. And that's not counting his offseason passes working with George Whitfield pre-draft. Kid has thrown the ball a HELLUVA lot this year.

your posts have been exactly what I have been thinking might be an issue.

[dimbee]

On the other hand, when your defense gives up 35 points in the 2nd half of the game, does it really matter what Cam does?

Yes. Especially considering Cam threw 3 INTs in the second half. Take those picks away and get some scoring drives instead, and it is a totally different ballgame.

[mav1234]

Yes. Especially considering Cam threw 3 INTs in the second half. Take those picks away and get some scoring drives instead, and it is a totally different ballgame.

We were down 42 to 35 when he threw his third INT, and his fourth came on pretty much the last play of the game save for running out the clock.

The lions had 0 points off Cam's first two INTs and we kept our lead through both of them.

Our defense could not stop Detroit really after the first quarter at all... Their defense did stop ours...

It's not that hard to believe that we would have lost even if Cam hadn't thrown those interceptions.... The bigger problem was really the high balls and the offense's general inability to move the ball in the third quarter IMO.

edit: that being said, the interceptions *did not* help at all... but unsurprisingly it was again our defense which gave away a lead and even a tie later in the game and.. blah. Just feel like we are asking too much of a rookie.

[Wyank]

Yes. Especially considering Cam threw 3 INTs in the second half. Take those picks away and get some scoring drives instead, and it is a totally different ballgame.

Last one barely affected anything. Already down 2 TD with no timeouts and around 2 min left in 4th quarter. Int when tied at 35 you can chalk up to choke job if you want to. Already left them score how many points though.

But in reality, the d still gave up a crapload of points in second half before majority of picks in second half happened.