Peter King list Carolina among teams that may be interested in Cutler

[Fox007]

I just want to see someone (anyone) that can hit Smitty in stride for once, before Smitty's speed is gone and he relies solely on good route running and hands to stay elite. :banghead:

Yea me too.

[carpanfan96]

Yea we've gone through this one as well, so I guess Gerrard, Orton, and Grossman are better than Jake?

Didn't think so.

Pleas fully read the original statement I was commenting on. Okay thanks. Those clowns for a season or two, Jake for 6 seasons........mmmmmmmmmm hard to decide on that one.

Garrard is now 24 - 22

Orton is 21 - 12 - barley two seasons as a qb.

Grossman has only played in 30 games which isn't even two seasons.

[Montsta]

Yea we've gone through this one as well, so I guess Gerrard, Orton, and Grossman are better than Jake?

Didn't think so.

That's why I said with so many starts. I don't think anyone here will say any of those 3 are better than Jake. I was using that as more of a complament to everyone's existing football knowledge, not as an end-all, be-all berometer of how good a QB is. My mistake if it came out that way.

It is easy to that the Carolina staff has drafted some good players and drafted some bums. I think they are above average when it comes to the roster decisions. The QB situation is completely different though. As far as the QB goes, they are not looking for best player available. They are looking for max value from minimum risk and building a team around him to absorb his deficiencies. They are building an atmosphere for a hero, an overachiever if you will and at the same time they are building an atmosphere that makes us stomach reality, give him a pass, and make an excuse for him when he blows a play or a game. We are supposed to praise everything positive and accept everything negative. We are being force-fed this blue-collar, everyman with his heart on his sleeve bullpoo and the gimic of Jake Delhomme is just old.

It's genious from the FO perspective but it does not fly with many of us who have seen the rest of the team build into something great and are ready for the last step to be made. Jake is getting us through years of building this and building that in a way. But he is not going to get us over the top. I just don't have faith in that at all.

As much as it hurts me to do so, I do agree with you on this Crolls. They sometimes do shovel the Jake crap down your throat when he does good, but then when he does bad it's like we should cut him some slack because he's no superstar. It's like when I was in highschool and got an "A" on a test and my folks were sooo happy cuz I'm a ******* idiot, but they didn't sweat it much when it was a "D" or an "F", cuz it was sort of expected. I too would like to win because of our QB, not in spite of him. my only quip with Jake is his cap number. For a team that likes low risk investments at the QB position, we sure aren't paying him mediocre QB dollars.

[Fox007]

Pleas fully read the original statement I was commenting on. Okay thanks. Those clowns for a season or two, Jake for 6 seasons........mmmmmmmmmm hard to decide on that one.

Jake used to be that clown for a season or two. 18-14(actually only 17-14 as a STARTER)

Grossman 19-11.

So Grossman has just as much potential going off those stats, as Jake did when he was only a two year starter at the time.(Grossman even managed to go to and lose a SB just like Jake)

Point remains.

[panthers55]

The same 5 people support Jake, and the other 5 don't, neither one is speaking for the Majority no matter what you may be trying to convince yourself.

Overly supporting players on your favorite team, on board dedicated to that team, doesn't make you right or know more about football. That's easy to do.

In my area I can't find a single person who thinks highly of Jake(myself included).

I'm sure everyone around you loves Jake to death, therefore that's the norm to you.

"You are what your numbers say you are"-yea I bet, you were probably the front-runner for Fox's 'stats are for losers' on here.

Fox007,

You find what you are looking for. I doubt you hang out all the time with people who disagree with you so believing everyone thinks your way is understandable. And no not everyone around me loves Jake. Heck I don't even love Jake. I like him and respect him as our quarterback but have repeatedly said I don't think he is elite or that great. But it seems the only way you can view people is by categorizing them in one extreme or the other. That kind of polarization may fit for you but my background and education don't allow me to see things in such a myopic manner.

As for the stats are for loser comment by Fox, you have to understand it in context. He was saying that looking a stat line in the paper doesn't tell you what game film does. He was saying that stats are what the losing team pulls out to justify their losses. But even Fox uses stats when they benefit his point. And he is keenly aware that the stat that really matters is the final score. And that stat is points for versus points against.

[carpanfan96]

That's why I said with so many starts. I don't think anyone here will say any of those 3 are better than Jake. I was using that as more of a complament to everyone's existing football knowledge, not as an end-all, be-all berometer of how good a QB is. My mistake if it came out that way.

As much as it hurts me to do so, I do agree with you on this Crolls. They sometimes do shovel the Jake crap down your throat when he does good, but then when he does bad it's like we should cut him some slack because he's no superstar. It's like when I was in highschool and got an "A" on a test and my folks were sooo happy cuz I'm a ******* idiot, but they didn't sweat it much when it was a "D" or an "F", cuz it was sort of expected. I too would like to win because of our QB, not in spite of him. my only quip with Jake is his cap number. For a team that likes low risk investments at the QB position, we sure aren't paying him mediocre QB dollars.

His salary is average at 6 million, it's his cap hit from signing bonuses and from all those restructures and what not that are killing us and inflating his cap hit up to 11 million.

[carolinarolls]

For a team that likes low risk investments at the QB position, we sure aren't paying him mediocre QB dollars.

He truly is living in a dream world.

Completely off subject but I wonder what other system he would play this well in or put up these number in. I can't think of any. Charlotte is practically a holy manger for this guy and the rest of the roster is like swaddling clothes.

[panthers55]

That's why I said with so many starts. I don't think anyone here will say any of those 3 are better than Jake. I was using that as more of a complament to everyone's existing football knowledge, not as an end-all, be-all berometer of how good a QB is. My mistake if it came out that way.

As much as it hurts me to do so, I do agree with you on this Crolls. They sometimes do shovel the Jake crap down your throat when he does good, but then when he does bad it's like we should cut him some slack because he's no superstar. It's like when I was in highschool and got an "A" on a test and my folks were sooo happy cuz I'm a ******* idiot, but they didn't sweat it much when it was a "D" or an "F", cuz it was sort of expected. I too would like to win because of our QB, not in spite of him. my only quip with Jake is his cap number. For a team that likes low risk investments at the QB position, we sure aren't paying him mediocre QB dollars.

We are winning because of Jake as well. Other than Arizona in the playoffs and the Tampa and Oakland games, how many did we win in spite of him. How about Cutler or Rivers for example. Did they have any poor games where their team won despite them? Do you really expect a quarterback to play well all year every week? What about the 10 games where he had 0 interceptions. What about the 5 come from behind wins he engineered himself. The problem with the naysayers is that they criticize readily but praise sparingly.

As for his cap number, it isn't that high given the average of the top 5 is around 14 million. His cap number is 10 million and his salary for this year is only 5 million which places him in the middle of the pack. And if you feel that is where he is, then we are paying him fairly for what we are getting. Can you think of any other quarterback who led his team to a 12-4 season who makes less??

Me either!!

[Brooklyn Bully]

I love homer polls...

[Montsta]

His salary is average at 6 million, it's his cap hit from signing bonuses and from all those restructures and what not that are killing us and inflating his cap hit up to 11 million.

My apologies for my comment. This is what I meant. I know his base isn't bad, but it's the final # that hurts, regardless of where it comes from. That's the point I was trying to make.

It also sucks when you do an incentive laden contract for guys, and they hit all those incentives. It's good that they did well, but when you weren't counting on say 4 or 5 guys making an extra $700K-$1M a piece, it hurts. Combine that with a bunch of back-loaded contracts before a potentially uncapped year, and that's when you get $25,000 in cap space. And that sucks. I think if we had $10M to play with under the cap, a lot of these Peppers, Cutler, etc. threads would be non existent, because our core is good.

[carpanfan96]

The sports nation polls are usually like that. Sometimes they aren't like that, but for the most part they are.

[carpanfan96]

My apologies for my comment. This is what I meant. I know his base isn't bad, but it's the final # that hurts, regardless of where it comes from. That's the point I was trying to make.

It also sucks when you do an incentive laden contract for guys, and they hit all those incentives. It's good that they did well, but when you weren't counting on say 4 or 5 guys making an extra $700K-$1M a piece, it hurts. Combine that with a bunch of back-loaded contracts before a potentially uncapped year, and that's when you get $25,000 in cap space. And that sucks. I think if we had $10M to play with under the cap, a lot of these Peppers, Cutler, etc. threads would be non existent, because our core is good.

Agreed, I can't wait till we trade Peppers for some draft picks. So we can makes some moves to fix our defense again. Addition by subtraction. Then adding more to it after the fact.

[Montsta]

We are winning because of Jake as well. Other than Arizona in the playoffs and the Tampa and Oakland games, how many did we win in spite of him. How about Cutler or Rivers for example. Did they have any poor games where their team won despite them? Do you really expect a quarterback to play well all year every week? What about the 10 games where he had 0 interceptions. What about the 5 come from behind wins he engineered himself. The problem with the naysayers is that they criticize readily but praise sparingly.

As for his cap number, it isn't that high given the average of the top 5 is around 14 million. His cap number is 10 million and his salary for this year is only 5 million which places him in the middle of the pack. And if you feel that is where he is, then we are paying him fairly for what we are getting. Can you think of any other quarterback who led his team to a 12-4 season who makes less??

Me either!!

I'm playing Devil's Advocate and making a case for both sides. As I said before, I will trust the FO and their decisions. I personally like Jake. I like what he brings to the team. I like the fire he plays with. I like that he is the first one to get down on himself when he has a bad game and never blames anyone else, ever. So don't get my position confused when I point out his shortcomings for the sake of argument. The only thing that I feel we need to do is find his eventual replacement soon if he isn't already on our roster. I think we can all agree Jake will not be playing into his 40's, even if Fox is still our HC.

[carpanfan96]

Here's a new story from the Observer.

3) Trading for Cutler would signal the end of the Jake Delhomme era. There simply is no way the two could co-exist. They are both starters -- and the Panthers seem bullishly set on sticking with Delhomme despite significant public sentiment to the contrary.

Are they right? Time will tell. One thing is for sure, however: It certainly looks like coach John Fox and general manager Marty Hurney are so confident in Delhomme that they're willing to risk their jobs to keep him.

So as intriguing as a Cutler-to-Carolina trade is to talk about, there is little reason to think it'll become a reality.