Just tell the truth about Jake...you don't love him

[bigdog_10_2002]

Contemptment at any position in the NFL is asking for regression.

[Jangler]

No, wasn't directed at anybody specifically. And yet at everybody at the same time...

[thefuzz]

I would venture to say running a WCO inflates QBs #s somewhat (Mr. Scot has long said this and I have read a bunch that backs him up), so does running a bunch of screens. Those lead to a bunch of YAC for WRs and/or RBs in the passing game. Heck the whole WCO leads to more yards for QBs since it relies a lot on YAC by receivers. Jake is...umm...not a lover of the short passing game as far as dumping it off to the RBs. THAT he needs to work on. And I would like to see more screens.

Oh and thanks for the link, cpan96...I wondered where you got those stats!!!

I agree with this, and I think that it leads us to question him sometimes. His touch on short passes, is not something he is known for, and it is something that I think we as a team should try to work on.

I have always questioned why the Panthers have never ran a ton of screens. Before, we had a down field blocker in Moose, and Smith to make the S roll over to his side, and had Foster, who was pretty decent in the open field. Now we still have Smith to roll the S, Moose to block downfield, and Williams who can turn the corner as good as anyone out there.....maybe it's the system, maybe it's Jake, maybe we were good enough in the run game to not have to do it......but only last year.

In team ypa though, which of the top 6 run a WCO?

Chargers*

Saints

Falcons*

Texans

Panthers*

Cardinals*

[Snake]

Its inaccuracy. He's thrown behind Moose several times, does that mean Moose is faster than Smith? He overthrew a wide open Barnidge at Oak, he would have had a TD.

:rofl: Whats dose overthrowing have to do anything about inaccuracy. Smith would have caught it if it would not have been 5 feet in front of him. He has overthrew smith on deep patterns so that is proof he has a good arm. Your point really dose not make since in that way.

[Fireball77]

In team ypa though, which of the top 6 run a WCO?

Chargers*

Saints

Falcons*

Texans

Panthers*

Cardinals*

What do your asterisks denote, btw? Ones that don't run WCO? Are you using the stats from CPF96's links? I looked at Stats inc and the top 7 WR yards after catch (which I don't think is the same stat you are using, so I apologize if this isn't what you are asking) are in order: NO, AZ, NE, Hou, Den, Philly, SD. NO is known for the shorter passes with YAC...I think they have WCO elements in their game though I don't think they are a pure WCO. AZ has two ridiculously talented WRs in Boldin & Fitz who are just great YAC guys. Plus they had a very feeble run game and they had to make up their "run" yards in the pass game like NO had to. NE has the YAC king, Wes Welker and they practically lived on WR screens in the passing game last year. Hou and Den are WCO style Os, though again, not pure I don't think. Philly is WCO for sure (I thought their receivers completely sucked? LOL, another media myth.). I was actually surprised to see SD on that list for receiver YAC. I always think of that corps as kind of average-ish, though Bolter knows I drooled over V. Jackson coming out in the draft and Chambers is a pretty good one.

[thefuzz]

What do your asterisks denote, btw? Ones that don't run WCO? Are you using the stats from CPF96's links? I looked at Stats inc and the top 7 WR yards after catch (which I don't think is the same stat you are using, so I apologize if this isn't what you are asking) are in order: NO, AZ, NE, Hou, Den, Philly, SD. NO is known for the shorter passes with YAC...I think they have WCO elements in their game though I don't think they are a pure WCO. AZ has two ridiculously talented WRs in Boldin & Fitz who are just great YAC guys. Plus they had a very feeble run game and they had to make up their "run" yards in the pass game like NO had to. NE has the YAC king, Wes Welker and they practically lived on WR screens in the passing game last year. Hou and Den are WCO style Os, though again, not pure I don't think. Philly is WCO for sure (I thought their receivers completely sucked? LOL, another media myth.). I was actually surprised to see SD on that list for receiver YAC. I always think of that corps as kind of average-ish, though Bolter knows I drooled over V. Jackson coming out in the draft and Chambers is a pretty good one.

* means made the post season... Philly is the only true WCO IMO. Denver I would say is the only true hybrid WCO out of the rest.

http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/Articles/2_992_Passing_YPA.html

Thats where I got my info from.

I forgot what I was even talking about now.....oh yea, I was trying to figure out why we don't have much YAC.

Oh, Jackson really turned it on in the 2007 playoffs, and has been playing very well since, and Chambers is way way underrated. That dude has been HUGE for the Bolts the past two seasons. Floyd is turning it on pretty good, and Sproles did pretty well catching stuff out of the backfield.

But most of all it's been Chamber taking the double off of Jackson that has let that pass attack flourish. They should be nasty again next year.

[Fireball77]

IMO...why the Cats don't have much YAC=Jake is a longballer by nature. The year they had mega YAC was the "smoke screen to Smitty" year in 2005 I would venture to say.

AJ Smith is kind of a mini Polian. An egotistical d****e... but he knows personnel.

[panthers55]

* means made the post season... Philly is the only true WCO IMO. Denver I would say is the only true hybrid WCO out of the rest.

http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/Articles/2_992_Passing_YPA.html

Thats where I got my info from.

I forgot what I was even talking about now.....oh yea, I was trying to figure out why we don't have much YAC.

Oh, Jackson really turned it on in the 2007 playoffs, and has been playing very well since, and Chambers is way way underrated. That dude has been HUGE for the Bolts the past two seasons. Floyd is turning it on pretty good, and Sproles did pretty well catching stuff out of the backfield.

But most of all it's been Chamber taking the double off of Jackson that has let that pass attack flourish. They should be nasty again next year.

I like that version of net passing yards. Gross passing yards minus sack yards lost divided by passing attempts plus number of sacks allowed.

We were on the list because of Jake's YPA and a decent line that gave up only 20 sacks despite all the shuffling around.

In order for us to get more YAC we have to use our running backs better out of the backfield. Develop a fullback with the ability to also stretch the field. And use Williams out of the backfield on short catches just like we used to use Foster. Who is better out in space than Williams once he gets to the second level. Lets get him out there more often. Maybe have some sets where Williams and Stewart are in there together either going out for short passes, running or staying in for blitz pickup. Don't know how it would work but it would be fun to watch.

[carpanfan96]

Pant55 and Fuzz, that's why I like the adjusted net Air Yards Per Attempt formula.

Here's the formula.....

ANAY/A=(PassingYards - YAC - INTs*45 - SackYards + TDs*10)/(PassAttempts+Sacks)

I gave the top 4 earlier if anyone wants the whole list here's the link.

[thefuzz]

IMO...why the Cats don't have much YAC=Jake is a longballer by nature. The year they had mega YAC was the "smoke screen to Smitty" year in 2005 I would venture to say.

AJ Smith is kind of a mini Polian. An egotistical d****e... but he knows personnel.

Good call on the smoke to Smith, that is true. Still you would think that Smith as post KR/PR, would get massive amounts of YAC. I bet he does, but Moose, and our inability to toss good screens out of the backfield may bring those #'s back to earth.

He is certainly egotistical, no doubt, but is extremely good at what he does. I would love to have him drafting and making Personnel moves for the Panthers.

[carpanfan96]

Fuzz, Steve Smith average 5.6 YAC this past season. Moose average 5.1 YAC this past season. King 3.9 YAC, Jarrett 2.8 YAC, Rosario 3.9 YAC, Williams 7.1 YAC, Stewart 6.5 YAC.

It's just Delhomme had a bunch of deep throws. 45 that went over 20 yards, 9 went over 40 yards. Jake was in the top ten in both Categories despite only throwing 246 Completions out of 414 attempts.

[Panthro]

Complacense at any position in the NFL is asking for regression.

Fixed

[rayzor]

Contemptment at any position in the NFL is asking for regression.

Fixed

:crazy:

you guys make me want to grab a gun and find your old teachers.

[AKPantherFan]

i THINK in the end Delhomme will be remembered not for being a top 5 QB but for the excitement, drive, and leadership he brought to the Panthers.

Lord knows we could have been in a worse QB situation over the last 6 years.