So, yeah, about those DT's

[CatMan72]

sometimes i wonder if people on the huddle really understand the responsibilities of a dt.

So your justifying two tackles by the entire unit?

[carpanfan96]

uhh linebackers are not making plays because they have to compensate for poor Dline.

Yep, but it wasn't the DT's in yesterday's game.

Went back and broke down Atlanta's running game.

Broke down on YPC and yards gained this way

LE/LT runs accounted for 81 yards - ypc 5.7

RE/RT runs accounted for 54 yards - ypc 5.66

OG/Middle runs accounted for 31 yards - ypc 2.5

Most of those outside runs were LE/RE plays, which falls on the DE to force the play back inside and they sucked against the run and have so for the whole season. We just don't have the LB speed now to make up for it. DE is definitely a need as they picked on our DE's and won pretty damn easily.

Also on top of that, most of those yards are on Stretch plays or WR crack back pitch's. The DT's did there job yesterday.

[stirs]

Offense hot and cold

Defense mostly cold

Get over yourselves guys. Who did not expect this. Best DT went down in preseason. Two LB's on IR. No offseason, rookie QB.

Once again, this will be an OTA season for us. We will be a bit better by years end, but about 4 or 5 wins is all you can expect. For those of you that thought the Panthers would be in the playoffs, then you need to grow up a bit and think realistically.

Draft is a long way off. LB, DT, WR and then OLine is the order of things currently. If the BPA is a stud OT, then we might want to take him and give up on the Otah experiment.

[CatMan72]

Yep, but it wasn't the DT's in yesterday's game.

Went back and broke down Atlanta's running game.

Broke down on YPC and yards gained this way

LE/LT runs accounted for 81 yards - ypc 5.7

RE/RT runs accounted for 54 yards - ypc 5.66

OG/Middle runs accounted for 31 yards - ypc 2.5

Most of those outside runs were LE/RE plays, which falls on the DE to force the play back inside and they sucked against the run and have so for the whole season. We just don't have the LB speed now to make up for it. DE is definitely a need as they picked on our DE's and won pretty damn easily.

Even on outside runs it's the DT's job to fight off blocks and get penetration, they didn't do that.

Again I'll go back to this stat: McClain, Fua, Fields and Kearse combined for 2 tackles.

[carpanfan96]

Even on outside runs it's the DT's job to fight off blocks and get penetration, they didn't do that.

Again I'll go back to this stat: McClain, Fua, Fields and Kearse combined for 2 tackles.

Wow, lmao. No Outside runs are on the de's to contain the run and then force it inside. The DT isn't going to be able to do anything against a properly ran stretch play. Same thing with the Crackback pitch's, the DT isn't going to be able to stop that. It's up to the DE's.

Dt's getting penetration on those type of run plays only helps if the DE gets containment, which they can't do the majority of the time. When they did get containment those plays went for losses.

[CatMan72]

Wow, lmao. No Outside runs are on the de's to contain the run and then force it inside. The DT isn't going to be able to do anything against a properly ran stretch play. Same thing with the Crackback pitch's, the DT isn't going to be able to stop that. It's up to the DE's.

You ever play DT? I did... if the DT's can press the gaps on a stretch play they can kill the effectiveness of the play because the blockers can't release as easily and head for the edge. If they can get off the blocks and get into the backfield they can stuff that play.

I'm not saying it's not important for the DE's and LB's to hold the edge, but the DT's are a BIG PART of those plays as well.

[carpanfan96]

Left End / LT running plays

-1 - LE -

1 yards - LT

3 yards - LE

2 yards - LT

33 yards - LE

2 yards QB - LE

8 yards - LE

-4 yards - LE -

-2 yards - LT -

No gain - LE

24 yards - LE

11 yards - LE

2 yards - LT

2 yards - LT

Total LE/LT runs - 14 carries - 81 yards. 5.7 ypc

Right end / RT running plays

4 yards - RT

2 yards - RE

5 yards - RE

8 yards - RE

4 yards QB - RT

14 yards - RE

1 yards - RE

7 yards - RT

6 yards - RE

Total RE/RT runs - 9 carries - 51 yards. 5.66 ypc

Guard runs or gut runs

12 yards LG

3 yards LG

8 yards LG

no gain - Gut

No gain - Gut

1 yard - Gut

no gain - RG

no gain - RG

2 yards - RG

1 yard QB - RG

2 yards - RG

2 yards - RG

Total Gut/G runs - 12 carries for 31 yards. 2.5 ypc

Total runs - 35 carries - 166

If you would like for me to break it down by who made the tackle I will and can.

[CatMan72]

Left End / LT running plays

-1 - LE -

1 yards - LT

3 yards - LE

2 yards - LT

33 yards - LE

2 yards QB - LE

8 yards - LE

-4 yards - LE -

-2 yards - LT -

No gain - LE

24 yards - LE

11 yards - LE

2 yards - LT

2 yards - LT

Total LE/LT runs - 14 carries - 81 yards. 5.7 ypc

Right end / RT running plays

4 yards - RT

2 yards - RE

5 yards - RE

8 yards - RE

4 yards QB - RT

14 yards - RE

1 yards - RE

7 yards - RT

6 yards - RE

Total RE/RT runs - 9 carries - 51 yards. 5.66 ypc

Guard runs or gut runs

12 yards LG

3 yards LG

8 yards LG

no gain - Gut

No gain - Gut

1 yard - Gut

no gain - RG

no gain - RG

2 yards - RG

1 yard QB - RG

2 yards - RG

2 yards - RG

Total Gut/G runs - 12 carries for 31 yards. 2.5 ypc

Total runs - 35 carries - 166

If you would like for me to break it down by who made the tackle I will and can.

Defensive line plays as a unit, you don't blame the RE alone when a stretch play is effective to his side of the field, that's the fallacy in your "breakdown".

[mav1234]

maybe I'm wrong but I've thought Hardy had a problem forcing runs back inside. Never seemed good at holding the edge last year. Makes some nice plays, but I think sometimes he is focused on being the one to make that play instead of redirecting the back.

Fua seems to really get beat hard though, so I don't think all the blame falls on the ends. dunno, maybe I'm missing his good plays.

[CatMan72]

maybe I'm wrong but I've thought Hardy had a problem forcing runs back inside. Never seemed good at holding the edge last year. Makes some nice plays, but I think sometimes he is focused on being the one to make that play instead of redirecting the back.

Nope, that's the biggest hole in his game right now - he's not good at holding the edge.

[nosuchthingasapanther]

Yep, but it wasn't the DT's in yesterday's game.

Went back and broke down Atlanta's running game.

Broke down on YPC and yards gained this way

LE/LT runs accounted for 81 yards - ypc 5.7

RE/RT runs accounted for 54 yards - ypc 5.66

OG/Middle runs accounted for 31 yards - ypc 2.5

Most of those outside runs were LE/RE plays, which falls on the DE to force the play back inside and they sucked against the run and have so for the whole season. We just don't have the LB speed now to make up for it. DE is definitely a need as they picked on our DE's and won pretty damn easily.

Also on top of that, most of those yards are on Stretch plays or WR crack back pitch's. The DT's did there job yesterday.

the falcons have had trouble run blocking the past few weeks.

to compensate, you attack/overload one side of the defensive line...especially when no one on the line has the ability to shed blockers, penetrate, or command a double team.

carolina's done it in the past to jump start their run game.

let's not let one game distract us from the obvious. the defensive line has been the root problem of the defense since last season.

[MadHatter]

Well we are relying on our 3,4,5th LBers.

poo....we were down to our 7th and 8th LB's at times yesterday.

[carpanfan96]

the falcons have had trouble run blocking the past few weeks.

to compensate, you attack/overload one side of the defensive line...especially when no one on the line has the ability to shed blockers, penetrate, or command a double team.

carolina's done it in the past to jump start their run game.

let's not let one game distract us from the obvious. the defensive line has been the root problem of the defense since last season.

I'm not The DT's haven't been playing great. They did there job yesterday though, It was the De's who didn't do the job last night.

It you want more proof at how little a DT does to a stretch run that's executed properly, go back and watch the Detroit - SF game. The three DT's for the Lions had 4 tackles all game and SF killed them on RT/RE runs.

Williams and Suh got penetration quite a bit last night on those run plays, the DE couldn't force it back inside most of the time and they got killed.

A properly ran stretch play minimizes the impact a DT has on the run game, they will usually get hit by the Center and guard. Also the backside tackle will pull depending on the dline alignment. If the TE blocks your DE one on one, then that plays golden.

[MadHatter]

You ever play DT? I did... if the DT's can press the gaps on a stretch play they can kill the effectiveness of the play because the blockers can't release as easily and head for the edge. If they can get off the blocks and get into the backfield they can stuff that play.

I'm not saying it's not important for the DE's and LB's to hold the edge, but the DT's are a BIG PART of those plays as well.

Agreed.

People need to realize that we have 2 rookies playing DT and back-ups playing LB. Anyone who did not think our run defense was going to struggle with the injuries knows NOTHING about football.

I am actually fine with a top 5 pick this season. We need to add a few pieces to the puzzle....and I woudl rather be picking top 5 than 14-16.

I see the future....and it looks bright.