Newton's Prototype

[Mr. Scot]

I thought I was yours :eek:

So I'm talking to myself?

Crap :eek:

[blackcatgrowl]

Comparing Cam to Favre and Jake means you have a sandy vagina?

Welcome to our discussion.

Maybe you should get up to date on the main points.

Like saying:

Newton's not a pinpoint accurate passer like a Peyton Manning or a Tom Brady

The fact we are having a discussion about his accuracy in any respect after an EPIC rookie debut with a 64.5% completion rate and record breaking yardage is the problem here.

In fact, it's a big problem when someone (or someones) in our fanbase are going to make ridiculous comments like that and say they are being objective.

[Mr. Scot]

Welcome to our discussion.

Maybe you should get up to date on the main points.

Like saying:

The fact we are having a discussion about his accuracy in any respect after an EPIC rookie debut with a 64.5% completion rate and record breaking yardage is the problem here.

In fact, it's a big problem when someone (or someones) in our fanbase are going to make ridiculous comments like that and say they are being objective.

So just to be clear, a quarterback with a 64% completion percentage qualifies as being pinpoint accurate in your opinion?

[rayzor]

The term gunslinger is a slight in football parlance. It refers to players who take chances most of the time ill-advised. Yeah they are high reward and high risk and often hurt a team as much or more than they help. In the history of the old west, gunslingers ended up dead because they took too many chances and overestimated their ability. Quarterbacks who are gunslingers like Favre are known as much for their mistakes like the pick in the championship game as for TDs thrown or great passes.

So no I don't see Newton as a gunslinger at all. in fact I might like him even more if he was. In fact he has been pretty conservative so far and really hasn't turned things loose. Most of the time if the guy isn't open and in single coverage he won't throw it. Just the opposite of a gunslinger really.

For the record I liked Jake alot so I don't have a negative perception like some, but it doesn't fit at this point no matter how many times you try it on.

i guess it's all in your interpretation of what a gunslinger is. i've always considered a gunslinger to be someone who will take risks, esp. on deep balls. they aren't reckless, but they sure don't play it safe. they will gamble but they have enough confidence in their ability and the players they throw to get the job done.

i have seen elements of that not just here, but at auburn. the thing is, he's able to keep it relatively mistake free so far. he's daring with what he does, but it pays off.

[rayzor]

Welcome to our discussion.

Maybe you should get up to date on the main points.

Like saying:

The fact we are having a discussion about his accuracy in any respect after an EPIC rookie debut with a 64.5% completion rate and record breaking yardage is the problem here.

In fact, it's a big problem when someone (or someones) in our fanbase are going to make ridiculous comments like that and say they are being objective.

it's not a ridiculous comment.

meh...you're blowing comments way out of proportion and thinking too emotionally.

done with it. have fun arguing.

[Mr. Scot]

i guess it's all in your interpretation of what a gunslinger is. i've always considered a gunslinger to be someone who will take risks, esp. on deep balls. they aren't reckless, but they sure don't play it safe. they will gamble but they have enough confidence in their ability and the players they throw to get the job done.

i have seen elements of that not just here, but at auburn. the thing is, he's able to keep it relatively mistake free so far. he's daring with what he does, but it pays off.

Kind of like how it is for coaches.

Coach goes for it on fourth and one and makes it: "Gutsy!" :thumbsup:

Coach goes for it on fourth and one and falls short: "Reckless!" :cuss:

[blackcatgrowl]

So just to be clear, a guy with a 64% completion percentage qualifies as being pinpoint accurate in your opinion?

Your attempt to goad me into a strawman argument fails. Why?

Saying Brady and Manning is YOUR comment. Not mine.

You define what exactly qualifies as "pin point accurate" for us, and I'll tell you if I think QBs who fits your definition.

[the butch]

my take on it is that he doesn't really fit the mold of any of those guys. mcnabb probably comes to mind instantly because he's tall, has a big arm, and can move. but i just don't see a mcnabb comparison. perhaps mcnabb's decline skews my perception, but to me cam is in a class all by himself [not necessarily a good or bad thing]. if he can develop into an accurate passer, then we will see an entire new category created.

charisma: favre, elway, bradshaw

accuracy: peyton, brady, brees

mobility: vick, mcnabb, tarkenton

winner: brady, montana, aikman

did i miss a category? point is, cam has all the tools and potential to be a very good quarterback for a long time. one whom has that kind of ability doesn't fit the mold any predecessor; he [or she] is the mold for his [or her] successors.

[Mr. Scot]

Your attempt to goad me into a strawman argument fails. Why?

Saying Brady and Manning is YOUR comment. Not mine.

You define what exactly qualifies as "pin point accurate" for us, and I'll tell you if I think QBs who fits your definition.

Not willing to backup your prior post? Shame :nonod:

Referring to a strawman is hilariously ironic, given that every point you've argued has been with your interpreation of what I'm saying rather than with my actual words :lol:

My comments on accuracy from another thread...

Lot of things factor into accuracy.

Some are coachable (technique). Others, not so much (hand-eye coordination).

Completion percentage can be a little misleading as a measure because you have to factor in receiver performance. Throw in that certain systems (especially the WCO) tend to inflate those numbers. David Carr once had the best completion percentage in the league, but obviously that didn't make him good.

The best way to really measure accuracy is to look at ball placement pass by pass. In that regard, I don't see Newton ever having Manningesque accuracy. More like a pre-surgery Jake Delhomme. Not great, but good enough to win if other factors are in place.

And by "other factors", I mean the team around him.

As has been said here (repeatedly) in terms of accuracy, all I care about is that his passes are catchable. Don't care if they look good. Don't need them to be perfect. If he does more of that than not, then I'll be happy.

So now, how do you measure accuracy?

[whatever]

So just to be clear, a quarterback with a 64% completion percentage qualifies as being pinpoint accurate in your opinion?

considering that he didn't put those numbers up throwing dinks and dunks, it should be pretty impressive. not to mention at least a couple of drops on very catchable passes.

[TheOracle]

It's been discussed many a time on this board. To whom does Cam Newton most closely compare?

Apparently, no one, lol.

[chef17]

Welcome to our discussion.

Maybe you should get up to date on the main points.

Like saying:

The fact we are having a discussion about his accuracy in any respect after an EPIC rookie debut with a 64.5% completion rate and record breaking yardage is the problem here.

In fact, it's a big problem when someone (or someones) in our fanbase are going to make ridiculous comments like that and say they are being objective.

Brady and Manning can squeeze a pass in between two defenders. Cam has yet to do that. Until Cam proves he can, he doesn't have the pinpoint accuracy of Brady or Manning.

[blackcatgrowl]

So now, how do you measure accuracy?

LOL... I knew you'd be unable to respond.

You made the comment that Newton is not pin point accurate. The onus is on you.

Give us a specific frame of reference to show us how to look for "pin point accuracy". Like, what percentage of passes need to hit the receivers hands versus how many passes did they have to jump up to catch.

I'm willing to bet you can't give us this. Why? Because your entire point of view on Newton is subjective factless nonsense. It has been from the start.

[rico6]

Brady and Manning can squeeze a pass in between two defenders. Cam has yet to do that. Until Cam proves he can, he doesn't have the pinpoint accuracy of Brady or Manning.

lolridiculousexpectationsoutofrookie