Inside the Numbers - Cam vs Clausen - Plus a guest appearance

[ammofan]

Just start Cam. He may have some accuracy issues but I really think they will be sorted out by the middle of the year. He'll only learn by playing.

The problem I have with starting Jimmy is that I can see his ceiling already. He's basically the same player skill-wise, as last year. He's just more confident, little bigger....but he's still the same guy.

This is all being over analyzed. It's the preseason. Half of the starters arent even playing, or they aren't playing the whole time starting QB is in there like they would in Week 1. Just let them play...but right now I like Cam because he shows the most potential to bring us wins this year.

[Miaoww]

Ok prove he doesn't. Other than be contrary to anyone who opposes the viewpoint of the clique you're in I've not seen alot out of you worthy of your opinion of my reply being relevant

Your argument boils down to "I don't like Jimmeh and he was bad last year (in a horrendous situation)".

[Ted Stryker]

Your argument boils down to "I don't like Jimmeh and he was bad last year (in a horrendous situation)".

No, I'll spell it out for you. Regardless of the situation he was in I don't believe he will ever be a good starter based on the fact I've been watching the NFL for over 30 years and I've seen some pretty good qbs and some mediocre ones and some really bad ones and to me jimmy falls between the last 2 groups

I'm not always right and if I'm wrong about Jimmy after he does something I'll man up and admit it

[Ricky Spanish]

I really really really really don't want to have to sit down every sunday this year and watch jimmy struggle getting the ball past the line of scrimmage week in and week out. I really am not a Jimmy supporter, as much as I want to be unbiased and all that crap, I really just hate Jimmy. I hated him before we picked him, and I will probably always hate him because there is no way in hell he leads anyone to a superbowl.

I admit it. I am officially a Jimmy hater. I would rather see Cam under center based alone on the fact that he is not Jimmy.

That and the line looks like crap and a mobile QB would probably be better suited to run the offense.

[TheRed]

Too many player fans in dick measuring contests on this board. Focus guys. Both QB's will be fine. I'm more concerned for the glaring problems with the rest of our team.

With a questionable o line, no solid #2 receiver or cb, and a poor defensive line.. Which QB is going to help out at those positions? Didn't think so..

[thefuzz]

Both look bad to me, with Cam looking noticeably worse.

[jpniner]

They didn't draft Cam #1 to start Jimmy, when they are playing about equal in pre-season. They are building the offense around Cam, not Jimmy also. They went out and got 2 great TE's as safety nets for Cam in the passing game as he comes along to go with our top tier Run Game.

[jpniner]

I really really really really don't want to have to sit down every sunday this year and watch jimmy struggle getting the ball past the line of scrimmage week in and week out. I really am not a Jimmy supporter, as much as I want to be unbiased and all that crap, I really just hate Jimmy. I hated him before we picked him, and I will probably always hate him because there is no way in hell he leads anyone to a superbowl.

I admit it. I am officially a Jimmy hater. I would rather see Cam under center based alone on the fact that he is not Jimmy.

That and the line looks like crap and a mobile QB would probably be better suited to run the offense.

[Snake]

Both had there ups and downs and both cant read defenses at this point. Newton is the most poised and has the better vision but Clausen has the better mechanics. One thing both need is the OL to understand that they are going to have to block multiple blitzes this year and give whoever starts some time. Cause that didn't happen in MIA.

[Miaoww]

They didn't draft Cam #1 to start Jimmy, when they are playing about equal in pre-season. They are building the offense around Cam, not Jimmy also. They went out and got 2 great TE's as safety nets for Cam in the passing game as he comes along to go with our top tier Run Game.

They went out and got two very good TE's cos WE DIDN'T fuging HAVE A RECEIVING TE ON THE ROSTER AND THIS OFFENCE USES TE'S.

I hope that's cleared things up for you.

[footballisasport]

Cam's problems have always been about technique. Why? Athletic QBs got where they are through superior arm strength or their legs, sometimes both. However, the best QBs were not great athletes because they had to be accurate and smart. When your legs will not bail you out or your arm strength cannot compensate for poor decisions, then intelligence and self-dicipline come into focus.

Look at The Golden Calf of Bristol. All that stuff he was doing before the draft to prove he can play QB in the NFL. But when the heat is on, he instinctively resorts back to the things that he has always used-running ability. His mechanics slip back to what they were like at UF.

Bronco Depth chart: Orton>Quinn>The Golden Calf of Bristol.

Athletically, The Golden Calf of Bristol>Quinn>Orton.

Fixing the problems is no small task. I did not want Cam because he needed too much work and we would not have the summer to fix them/learn the playbook. People called me racist. I see his awesome talent. I think he can be the real deal with Shula and I am very impressed with Cam vs. Clausen. However, not yet with Cam vs. NFL.

Go Shula--But starting Cam now does not mean wins, as we saw Friday. Nor did Cam do much to help us win vs. the Giants. So, why does everyone want him to start game one again?

What are u basing your facts on? Three weeks of TC and a couple of preseason games. And u really don't think anything is wrong with your preceptions or personal biases?

As I said before, compare Sam Bradford's rookie preseason stats to Cam's. Not much difference. But go read the reviews and u will see a completely different spin depending on the person. Also keep in mind that Sam had the priviledge of OTA and a full TC. Cam didn't and he is doing just as well as Sam did during his preseason.

If u clearly feel that Cam isn't ready for the NFL, yet he's pretty much on par with the more elite media preferred QBs, then u do need to take off those 1950's circa glasses. The whole Cam isn't "ready for the NFL" is another myth put out and pushed by those who seem to want to keep the QB world a certain way. Heck, I remembered the same media folks push the same BS with Josh Freeman.

As a matter of fact, unlike Blaine Gabbert, this years preferred QB, who is still playing shot-gun and is running out of the pocket at the slightest preceived attack, Cam has already showing us in last week's game than he can sit in the pocket, even thou many wondered why he didn't run. And this week we got the running, even thou many are now trying to use that as grounds to defend their argument that he isn't ready. Yes, Cam has to PROVE that he belongs. Blaine is automatically preceived that he fits and he just has to do enough to back up the preception.

FYI, The Golden Calf of Bristol mechanical issues isn't Cam's. Cam's mechnical issues are over exaggerated for obvious reasons. Tim's problem was always there even while he was in college but he was able to get around it. Cam was used in whatever capacity he was needed during college and now has to train his body to learn something different. That is why if u notice his throwing reps aren't very high for a QB in college. Cam was used more as a runner in college because it benefitted them.

The level of accepted ignorance that is shown towards Cam in this time and age is mind boggling. My question is, why are we intentionally dismissing Cam as not "ready for the NFL" with nothing more than shallow assumptions and false exaggerations when the kid has shown us what he is just if not more capable of doing in a short space of time?

I guess this means everytime Cam doesn't meet some unrealisitic expectation the usual screams of "see we told u he isn't ready for the NFL" will go up.

[jpniner]

They went out and got two very good TE's cos WE DIDN'T fugING HAVE A RECEIVING TE ON THE ROSTER AND THIS OFFENCE USES TE'S.

I hope that's cleared things up for you.

thats my point, this offense will make the passing game easier than other offenses. Between our elite run game(hopefully, OL has me worried) combined with 2 great TE's who no doubt will get most of the passing plays. Alot easier for a rookie to pass to a TE 5-8 yards downfield than to a WR 15 yards downfield, covered by a CB

[mav1234]

stats don't matter from the preseason. bradford took his lumps in his first two preseason games as well and many reports said he didn't look very good at all. The difference? Very few of them commented on throwing off his backfoot, footwork, etc. Is this because the media was bias... or do you think it might be due to the fact he doesn't have the same issues as Cam? They named other issues, such as pocket presence and what not (he had a lot of sacks, but his O-Line blew haard the first two games)

Plus Cam is getting plenty of positive hype... There was a lot of good stuff surrounding his first preseason game. His first start, not so much - he didn't really do much of anything worth getting excited about this last game, but it seems to be mostly fans being negative about him, whereas media is still being pretty reasonable with him, because he wasn't terrible at all, just didn't move the offense well, and the expectations for a #1 pick are always high in a fan base.

Hell, even AFTER Bradford blew away the Patriots his coach didn't name him the starter because he wanted the veteran to start over him, but there was no point once he showed what he could do against the Ravens again the next week. Bradford looked like a rookie early in the preseason too but that quickly changed. Maybe it can for Cam too... If not, there's nothing wrong with rookies looking like rookies. Some coaches, some fans, prefer rookies to sit rather than play. This is no slight on Cam. Hopefully he will be great one day, but that day wasn't Friday, so I don't feel the need to force him out there.

It's silly to use preseason numbers. It's more about how the player is playing the game. If you feel Cam is playing well, you probably want him to start. If you feel he's got a lot to work on, you might not. If you feel both those things, it's going to depend a bit on what you think of Jimmy Clausen, probably, and how you feel about rookie quarterbacks sitting for some time in the regular season.

I still wouldn't be surprised to see Cam start. The gap between him and Clausen is not huge and he is the future. With such limited reps due to the lockout, I'm not surprised Cam still has tons to work on, just as I'm not surprised Clausen looks incomplete too. For some reason, it seems that some posters take not wanting Cam to start or admitting his flaws means you are a hater. Most people who don't want Cam to start still say they think he has the ability to become a great QB.

edit: as to Gabbert, I like what I've seen from the rookie so far. But he also hasn't been named the starter or anything. He's a rookie who should sit and he probably will, though Garrard is doing his best Jimmy Clausen impression as far as not separating himself from a rookie.

[Shufdog]

What are u basing your facts on? Three weeks of TC and a couple of preseason games. And u really don't think anything is wrong with your preceptions or personal biases?

As I said before, compare Sam Bradford's rookie preseason stats to Cam's. Not much difference. But go read the reviews and u will see a completely different spin depending on the person. Also keep in mind that Sam had the priviledge of OTA and a full TC. Cam didn't and he is doing just as well as Sam did during his preseason.

If u clearly feel that Cam isn't ready for the NFL, yet he's pretty much on par with the more elite media preferred QBs, then u do need to take off those 1950's circa glasses. The whole Cam isn't "ready for the NFL" is another myth put out and pushed by those who seem to want to keep the QB world a certain way. Heck, I remembered the same media folks push the same BS with Josh Freeman.

As a matter of fact, unlike Blaine Gabbert, this years preferred QB, who is still playing shot-gun and is running out of the pocket at the slightest preceived attack, Cam has already showing us in last week's game than he can sit in the pocket, even thou many wondered why he didn't run. And this week we got the running, even thou many are now trying to use that as grounds to defend their argument that he isn't ready. Yes, Cam has to PROVE that he belongs. Blaine is automatically preceived that he fits and he just has to do enough to back up the preception.

FYI, The Golden Calf of Bristol mechanical issues isn't Cam's. Cam's mechnical issues are over exaggerated for obvious reasons. Tim's problem was always there even while he was in college but he was able to get around it. Cam was used in whatever capacity he was needed during college and now has to train his body to learn something different. That is why if u notice his throwing reps aren't very high for a QB in college. Cam was used more as a runner in college because it benefitted them.

The level of accepted ignorance that is shown towards Cam in this time and age is mind boggling. My question is, why are we intentionally dismissing Cam as not "ready for the NFL" with nothing more than shallow assumptions and false exaggerations when the kid has shown us what he is just if not more capable of doing in a short space of time?

I guess this means everytime Cam doesn't meet some unrealisitic expectation the usual screams of "see we told u he isn't ready for the NFL" will go up.

He's not ready. :cool: