John Fox in perspective: How do you judge?

[top dawg]

As with Jake Delhomme, Coach John Fox has lost favor with a portion of Carolina's fan base. Are we being too critical? Or, should we wander through our own form of desert for 40 years until Fox delivers us to the promised land? Has he earned that much with a respectable .563 winning percentage, a trip to 3 postseasons and a Super Bowl? I am just asking the question, I don't know if I'd dump Fox or not, particularly after a 12-4 season, but I am a little restless and critical after viewing some of his work over the past 3 seasons.

Like I referenced in another discussion, Fox has looked just downright confused at times which has been reflected onto the field. I don't know whether it's the play on the field that causes the seeming bewilderment on the sidelines, or vice versa. Perhaps its a domino, pinball or snowball effect in reference to the confusion. I don't know. But, the utter annihilation at the hands of the Cards is more than just a red flag, it may be a red stop sign.

In a period where Mike Shanahan and Jon Gruden were let go, and after viewing the misfortune of Marty Schottenheimer with his conservative "Marty ball", you can't help but ask yourself if Fox should be kicked to the curb also. But, like I alluded to before, he has had a modicum of success, especially when looking at the current crop of coaches.

Here is some information for you to base your assessment.

Some are a little dated, but still offers some insight.

From a CBS sports forum:

* Vince Lombardi: 96 wins, .738 winning percentage, 2 Super Bowl wins, 5 NFL championships, 9-1 postseason record.

* Don Shula: 328 wins, .678 winning percentage, 2 Super Bowl wins, 1 NFL championship, 19-17 post season record.

* Tom Landry: 250 wins, .607 winning persentage, 2 Super Bowl wins, 20 consecutive winning seasons (NFL record), 20-16 post season record.

* Chuck Noll: 186 wins, .572 winnnining percentage, 4 Super Bowl wins, 16-8 post season record.

* George Halas: 318 wins, .682 winning percentage, 6 NFL championships, 6-4 postseason record.

* Bill Walsh: 92 wins, .609 winning percentage, 3 Super Bowl wins, 10-4 post season record.

* Bill Belichick: 138 wins, .623 winning percentage, 3 Super Bowl wins, 15-4 post season record.

EA Sports Top 25

ColdHardFootballFacts.com

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Current Coaches

[GRWatcher]

John Fox in perspective: How do you judge?

You don't.

[AKPantherFan]

holy poo..... did you leave off any HOF coaches?

[AKPantherFan]

LOOOOK--

John Fox's problem is right the opposite of Jake.

With Jake, everything is in your face this is what I did, or I screwed up, blah,blah,blah....

Fox is straight up communist. We really don't know poo about Fox other than he is conservative. He is very 1 dimensional to the public, and thats what is pissing folks off.

[GRWatcher]

holy sh*t..... did you leave off any HOF coaches?

Marv Levy

Joe Gibbs

I don't accept homework at my age. :rant:

[AKPantherFan]

Marv Levy

Joe Gibbs

I don't accept homework at my age. :rant:

he lost me at Lombardi.......

[AKPantherFan]

why would he even mention Fox's name with Lombardi??

FAIL

[AKPantherFan]

Looking at that list though.... Shula was a bad ass Mo Fo.

30+ post season games ..... WOW

[holycrikey]

I see no reason to boot him, especially after a 12-4 season. If he goes right back to his ways of ultra-conservatism while hovering over his D-coordinator along with a junky record next season....then sure, it might be time for change. But he deserves at least one more season.

Let's not forget that he helped join a big core of the team. Fox and his staff have done quite well in the draft in the past years. Look at some of the guys they've come across: Jordan Gross, Chris Gamble, Travelle Wharton, Thomas Davis, Geoff Hangartner, DeAngelo Williams, Richard Marshall, Jon Beason, Ryan Kalil, Jonathan Stewart, Jeff Otah, etc. These are only a few of our starters since 2003 via the draft. Is it all Fox's success? No. But he's built a solid team with solid personnel. Our team is almost year in and year out a threatening team (look at the debacle of teams like the Browns, Lions, 49ers, Raiders, etc since 2002ish.)

I will admit that I'm not as big of a fan of Fox as I was up until 2006 or so, but I think he's a good coach.

[top dawg]

If you're going to judge, then why not judge by the best?

Yeah, an old '73 pinto will get you from point A to point B, but I am not going to mistake it for a Ford GT which will get me to point B a whole lot faster.

If you want titles, you have to look at the guys who have them, If you want victories, you have to do the same. Post season victories, etc., etc. Victories and Super Bowls are the best case scenario. In any event, there are more recent coaches by which to make a comparison...Gruden and Shanahan, Cowher, Reid.

[Doc Holiday]

Looking at that list though.... Shula was a bad ass Mo Fo.

30+ post season games ..... WOW

better stat he won it all 3 times and lost 17 times in the post season.

Tom Landry won just 2 times and lot 16 times

of course with that said

2* Chuck Noll: 186 wins, .572 winnnining percentage, 4 Super Bowl wins, 16-8 post season record.

5* George Halas: 318 wins, .682 winning percentage, 6 NFL championships, 6-4 postseason record.

4* Bill Walsh: 92 wins, .609 winning percentage, 3 Super Bowl wins, 10-4 post season record.

3* Bill Belichick: 138 wins, .623 winning percentage, 3 Super Bowl wins, 15-4 post season record.

1* Vince Lombardi: 96 wins, .738 winning percentage, 2 Super Bowl wins, 5 NFL championships, 9-1 postseason record.

[top dawg]

I don't accept homework at my age. :rant:

It's the homework that makes us one of the most knowledgeable fan bases there is.

[frash.exe]

As with Jake Delhomme, Coach John Fox has lost favor with a portion of Carolina's fan base. Are we being too critical? Or, should we wander through our own form of desert for 40 years until Fox delivers us to the promised land? Has he earned that much with a respectable .563 winning percentage, a trip to 3 postseasons and a Super Bowl? I am just asking the question, I don't know if I'd dump Fox or not, particularly after a 12-4 season, but I am a little restless and critical after viewing some of his work over the past 3 seasons.

Like I referenced in another discussion, Fox has looked just downright confused at times which has been reflected onto the field. I don't know whether it's the field on the play that causes the seeming bewilderment on the sidelines, or vice versa. Perhaps its a domino, pinball or snowball effect in reference to the confusion. I don't know. But, the utter annihilation at the hands of the Cards is more than just a red flag, it may be a red stop sign.

In a period where Mike Shanahan and Jon Gruden were let go, and after viewing the misfortune of Marty Schottenheimer with his conservative "Marty ball", you can't help but ask yourself if Fox should be kicked to the curb also. But, like I alluded to before, he has had a modicum of success, especially when looking at the current crop of coaches.

WHA?! criticism of Foxy? Criticism of any kind on this forum? GET HIM!!!!!!!!

[Mr. Scot]

Looking at that list though.... Shula was a bad ass Mo Fo.

30+ post season games ..... WOW

He was, but for a fair space of time Marv Levy practically owned him.

My jury is still out on Fox, honestly. Overall positive, but definite issues.

This coming season will be an important one.