What is this UPSIDE that makes Cam better than Gabbert?

[CarolinaBlue34]

Gabbert is the best opinion for a pro-style quarterback in the draft this year, i think to be a quarterback in the NFL the best intangible to have is football IQ and from what i have heard Gabbert studies film like its a religion.

[monstercat]

I posted this in another thread as well.

...didn't know Gabbert told people he scored a 41 at the combine, you have proof he was the one who said it? If you do, then he is a liar...but that is unfounded unless you have proof.

Do you think people would care if Cam had said it, if the situation was reversed? I sure don't, and that's the whole point. They would point to "team Newton" and claim they, which includes Cam, are a bunch of liars and that it was just another red flag. You know it and I know it.

[micnificent28]

Do the people who want us to draft Cam Newton think of him as a first season starter and/or do you think we'll be winning immediately in a 2008 Falcons fashion if that's the case?

This isn't a rhetorical question, I legitimately want to see some opinions on it.

Do I think cam can come in and have a Bradford like year day 1? No but I do believe that he can contribute early on in the offense. I think you can make him the backup and give him 8-10 snaps week one. Those snaps would be from his auburn playbook while letting him learn ours. If vince young can come in his rookie season and contribute early why can't cam? What makes him a longer study or bigger project than young?

[monstercat]

At least one former NFL coach agrees with me...http://www.charlotteobserver.com/2011/03/18/2152777/reeves-carolina-panthers-should.html

"If I'm them, I'm taking Cam Newton," former Falcons and Broncos coach Dan Reeves said. "I think that guy is going to be a great player.

"You can't win without one, and trust me, when I lost them, I got fired."

Read more: http://www.charlotteobserver.com/2011/03/18/2152777/reeves-carolina-panthers-should.html#ixzz1H42yfjM3

[mav1234]

At least one former NFL coach agrees with me...

Newsflash: If there was a consensus on who to take in this draft then we wouldn't even be having this discussion.

Plenty of coaches like Gabbert, plenty like Newton.

I don't think anyone reasonable is suggesting nobody wants Newton, or everybody wants Gabbert or anything close to that.

[monstercat]

Newsflash: If there was a consensus on who to take in this draft then we wouldn't even be having this discussion.

Plenty of coaches like Gabbert, plenty like Newton.

I don't think anyone reasonable is suggesting nobody wants Newton, or everybody wants Gabbert or anything close to that.

What former coach says that we should take Gabbert? I have heard/read where former GM's said it, but if a coach said it, then I missed it. Heck, even Lombardi is saying that we should take a QB. The only difference is that he likes Gabbert more because he believes Gabbert is a safer pick.

Pretty much all of them believe that Cam has more upside though, which is what this thread is about.

[MHS831]

At least one former NFL coach agrees with me...http://www.charlotteobserver.com/2011/03/18/2152777/reeves-carolina-panthers-should.html

"If I'm them, I'm taking Cam Newton," former Falcons and Broncos coach Dan Reeves said. "I think that guy is going to be a great player.

"You can't win without one, and trust me, when I lost them, I got fired."

Read more: http://www.charlotteobserver.com/2011/03/18/2152777/reeves-carolina-panthers-should.html#ixzz1H42yfjM3

Darin Gantt is behind most of the pro Cam/Charlotte Observer propaganda. Reeves worked with Cam at the Senior Bowl. Funny he puts out this article the day the AP press released Gabbert's pro day results. He did the same thing last year with the great Armanti Edwards. Reeves also (basically) traded LT (Tomlinson) and Drew Brees to San Diego for Michael Vick. Hmmm. I would not brag about that.

Gantt is the poster boy for nut hugging. Sure, he found a former coach who thinks Newton is the deal. Since Gabbert is rated higher on many boards, why is he stuck on Newton?

Gabbert just had a pro day where he outperformed Newton with unfamiliar WRs (remember Cam's combine excuse?). Many scouts praised Gabbert. Many experts (former GMs, director or player personnel, etc) said Gabbert should go #1. Considering the Panthers have Gabbert coming in today, would a responsible, unbiased journalist not cover THAT story?

Gantt is pathetic. His bias (ASU, for example. How many other reporters make their alma maters so obvious?) is his downfall.

I made these points to show you how bias exists even in the press. Why do you think Gantt is biased? Good question. Cam is the hot star and his name sells papers. Why? Because he was the QB of the National Champs, Heisman winner, and the NCAA scandal. He is always a story. Gabbert stays in the shadows. Does than make Cam a better prospect?

[MHS831]

I posted this in another thread as well, but what would you (and I'm talking primarily to MHS831 here) have said about this hypothetical situation...

Team Newton releases info that Cam scored a 32 on his Wonderlic. Everybody is fully impressed. Several days later, we learn that it was actually a 21, and furthermore, the 32 was scored at Whitfield's training facility.

The questions about his character would have exploded. Everyone would be calling him a liar, saying it was proof that he hasn't changed, etc.

Admit it. There is a double standard.

There is a double standard, of course. Much of that is brought on by Cam's character. Should a person with a checkered past not be scrutinized more than a person without one? Is is a double standard to wonder about character based on the past before you give a 21 year old the key to the city?

Who said it had to be fair? Actually, it would not be fair to Gabbert if these things weren't brought up. I have a reputation in my world because I earned it. I don't expect a guy with a shady past to be on equal footing with me when applying for a job.

[mav1234]

What former coach says that we should take Gabbert? I have heard/read where former GM's said it, but if a coach said it, then I missed it. Heck, even Lombardi is saying that we should take a QB. The only difference is that he likes Gabbert more because he believes Gabbert is a safer pick.

Pretty much all of them believe that Cam has more upside though.

It's possible Reeves is the only former coach who has weighed in. I'm not really in the mood to go looking through the other thread to see who has "sided" with Gabbert. Suffice it to say I think enough people have come down on both sides to say that there is no clear agreement as to who to take. Nobody makes perfect decisions, either, which is one reason why these guys are commentators now.

I also do not know how much greater they all think Cam's upside really is. But you're right, many of them say Gabbert should be the pick because he already looks better now and he'll have less of a transition etc.

I don't care if he has less of a transition, he still will have one and I don't want either of them.

[mav1234]

Considering the Panthers have Gabbert coming in today, would a responsible, unbiased journalist not cover THAT story?

Gantt is pathetic. His bias (ASU, for example. How many other reporters make their alma maters so obvious?) is his downfall.

While I think he is right that we won't take Gabbert, I do find this weird. Maybe one of the other guys is going to cover it. It's really weird that on a day when we're having a private workout and meeting with him and breaking bread etc there's nothing positive about him on the Observer, haha.

Guess there's nothing positive to say! :rolleyes:

[Marguide]

I posted this in another thread as well.

...didn't know Gabbert told people he scored a 41 at the combine, you have proof he was the one who said it? If you do, then he is a liar...but that is unfounded unless you have proof.

My post was not a criticism of Gabbert. Someone on his team (probably his agent) released misleading info. It happens.

My criticism was of the holier-than-thou posters that look for every opportunity to call Newton's character into question.

I have no doubt Gabbert is a good, smart kid. I just don't care for him much as a QB.

[monstercat]

There is a double standard, of course. Much of that is brought on by Cam's character. Should a person with a checkered past not be scrutinized more than a person without one? Is is a double standard to wonder about character based on the past before you give a 21 year old the key to the city?

Who said it had to be fair? Actually, it would not be fair to Gabbert if these things weren't brought up. I have a reputation in my world because I earned it. I don't expect a guy with a shady past to be on equal footing with me when applying for a job.

There is a big difference between scrutinizing a player, and already having your mind made up that he's a bad person, even though you have never met the guy or asked him a single question. Even Mayock said that he doesn't really care about what happened at Florida. He has also said that Cam's upside is enormous, which is what you're trying to disprove.

Stevie Wonder can see that Cam has more upside than any QB in this draft.

[teeray]

Darin Gantt is behind most of the pro Cam/Charlotte Observer propaganda. Reeves worked with Cam at the Senior Bowl. Funny he puts out this article the day the AP press released Gabbert's pro day results. He did the same thing last year with the great Armanti Edwards. Reeves also (basically) traded LT (Tomlinson) and Drew Brees to San Diego for Michael Vick. Hmmm. I would not brag about that.

Gantt is the poster boy for nut hugging. Sure, he found a former coach who thinks Newton is the deal. Since Gabbert is rated higher on many boards, why is he stuck on Newton?

Gabbert just had a pro day where he outperformed Newton with unfamiliar WRs (remember Cam's combine excuse?). Many scouts praised Gabbert. Many experts (former GMs, director or player personnel, etc) said Gabbert should go #1. Considering the Panthers have Gabbert coming in today, would a responsible, unbiased journalist not cover THAT story?

Gantt is pathetic. His bias (ASU, for example. How many other reporters make their alma maters so obvious?) is his downfall.

I made these points to show you how bias exists even in the press. Why do you think Gantt is biased? Good question. Cam is the hot star and his name sells papers. Why? Because he was the QB of the National Champs, Heisman winner, and the NCAA scandal. He is always a story. Gabbert stays in the shadows. Does than make Cam a better prospect?

:rofl: this is so fugging rediculous. We have gone from everything is a smoke screen to it is a media conspiracy to draft Cam to sell newspapers.

You guys should sit back and read some of the poo you throw out there. As a matter of fact we had our private day with Cam the other day and there was no coverage of the workout. Just Sorensen's article. Yesterday there were two different articles about Gabbert.

I cannot stop laughing at you guys who are really starting to panic that we may actually pick Cam. :lol:

Uhhh....uhhh... its a smoke screen..... no, no wait it is a media conspiracy... no, no wait, I got it.....

:rofl: you guys really make me laugh. Fugging Darin Gantt and your newpapers! :rofl:

[MHS831]

There is a big difference between scrutinizing a player, and already having your mind made up that he's a bad person, even though you have never met the guy or asked him a single question. Even Mayock said that he doesn't really care about what happened at Florida. He has also said that Cam's upside is enormous, which is what you're trying to disprove.

Stevie Wonder can see that Cam has more upside than any QB in this draft.

How do you judge upside? I said in another thread: Cam has more athleticism and can throw harder than or as hard these QBs: Big Ben, Unitas, Montana, Brees, Rivers, Brady, P Manning, Marino, Favre, & Moon.

The QBs who come to mind with similar athletic abilities: Ryan Leaf, J. Russell, Vick, The Golden Calf of Bristol, R. Cunningham, Culpepper, Akili Smith, Tavares Jackson, McNair (maybe).

In college, the names on the list on the bottom were more successful. So, I ask you, how do you measure upside?