NFLPA Said --VS--NFL/Owners Said

[mountainpantherfan]

It's pretty simple. If your boss and the company that employed you were making more money than ever before, many using state funded facilities, and they came to you and said you now have to work more hours for less money, you'd be okay with that I'm sure.

Hell no, and then I would quit and walk out the door. Go start my own business, get a job with a competitor, go back to college and start a new career path or just find a new job in a new field.

Or I would weigh my options and possibly just stay and accept it or bide my time until a better situations came around.

Either way there are far more options than just fight through litigation or take a pay cut. Peyton Manning, Tom Brady or Drew Brees would get signed by a UFL or CFL or AFL team in a heart beat and possibly make even more money.

[Stumpy]

Accidental Pie :(

What job requires you to invest 20 years of your life for that specific job?

I used the "20 years" making fun of him, because i don't think any NFL player played football for 20 years before they got to the NFL either.

3/4 of what you learn in school has no relation to your career path so not exactly a fair comparison

And I'm sure all that pee-wee through middle school football has a huge relation to the NFL too.

The bottom line is, most people invest at least 17 years of their lives preparing for their respective careers. The first 13 of those may not relate directly to their career path. However, if you know of a university that doesn't require a K-12 education, let me know because I'll just save my kids the time and send them straight there.

[Brandon]

The fact of the matter is the union had planned to decertify all along, and the worst thing is that these players who helped this process were severely misinformed as to what they were getting into. DeSmith made a HUGE mistake decertifying while still at the negotiating table, and rejecting an offer widely similar to what the players were asking for and it will show up once the players lose in court. Because of this, if things aren't resolved quickly, we may have just lost the sport we love most because some very selfish individuals wanted to play out some sort of ill-informed David vs Goliath fantasy. My comments aren't to be mistaken for trying to absolve the owners of all wrong-doing in this matter, but the union never negotiated in good faith.

[mountainpantherfan]

Those without existing contracts could. Not those with contracts.

Not according to my understanding. When teams sign "players" to contracts they are actually signing that player's playing rights within the NFL. Now, there are financial obligations that could impact a player's ability to walk away from a NFL contract.

There could be some language in contracts that would say if a player would leave or retire they couldn't go to another league but considering the situation, the owners are locking out the players, then it would be a hard case to win in a courtroom for the owners. Hell, the Vick didn't have to pay back his signing bonus after the dog fighting crimes I don't see a judge awarding money to owners within this situation.

Really the only obligations that are on players in the NFL are the ones they volunteerly place upon themselves via the CBA. No CBA, no obligations, no restrictions. The NFL is just like any other business.

[mountainpantherfan]

Depends on what you mean by financially invested. Paul Allen doesn't give a poo if the lockout goes on forever. But a guy like James Anderson...this is his entire livelihood. He's *100%* invested in the league financially. Without the NFL, he has to change careers.

Besides, the NFL didn't gain its $9 billion a year popularity on the backs of the owners, it gained its popularity through guys like Peyton Manning and Michael Vick and even The Golden Calf of Bristol. You don't see many guys at Panthers games with Jerry Richardson jerseys on, do you?

The USFL signed some big names back in the 80's including Steve Young amoung others. Currently the UFL is trying to do the same thing. If the players are the ones that make the game what it is, why haven't other leagues been successful?

Guys like Manning and Vick and The Golden Calf of Bristol are popular because of the NFL and the NFL is popular because of great personalities like them.

If the players are truely that important and the owners are that disposable, then let them go do it on their own. I really can't say that enough.

[chef17]

Accidental Pie :(

I used the "20 years" making fun of him, because i don't think any NFL player played football for 20 years before they got to the NFL either.

Yeah I was just being a dick :dita:

And I'm sure all that pee-wee through middle school football has a huge relation to the NFL too.

The bottom line is, most people invest at least 17 years of their lives preparing for their respective careers. The first 13 of those may not relate directly to their career path. However, if you know of a university that doesn't require a K-12 education, let me know because I'll just save my kids the time and send them straight there.

Clown college :D

[Stumpy]

Yeah I was just being a dick :dita:

Clown college :D

Yeah, but if you want to make any money in the clown industry, you gotta go over to France and be one of dem fancy la-di-da clowns dat don't do no talkin.

I'll be damned if I let my kids be French. Freedom Fries FTW!

[mountainpantherfan]

Also, anyone here who says that they wouldn't go to court to battle reduction in pay and longer work hours if they thought they had a chance to win is a liar. I don't care who you are or how much money you have you would do it. The only reason people don't is when they don't believe they have any chance of winning.

I liked your entire post but the quoted portion if very true. But also true is that if any person on here were an owner of a business they would fight to maximize their profits.

It's only natural for us to pick sides but neither side is right or wrong. They both have taken positions that while I may disagree with, I respect from their prespective.

[chef17]

Yeah, but if you want to make any money in the clown industry, you gotta go over to France and be one of dem fancy la-di-da clowns dat don't do no talkin.

I'll be damned if I let my kids be French. Freedom Fries FTW!

Lol rep just cause that was funny as hell

[Montsta]

They've invest 20 years of their lives to becoming an NFL player, not to mention the physical damage their bodies endure playing in the league for an average of 3.5 years.....all the owners did was lay down some cash and buy a team....who really made the investment?

If you know "A" NFL player who has retired, ask them what physical problems they have from playing in the NFL. I know several and not one of them doesn't suffer from some lingering injury and by suffer I mean it limits their physical abilities.

My aunt was a court stenographer for 30 years. She has such bad carpel tunnel from it that she has had at least 3 surgeries and is constantly in pain with it. My dad has been a self employed contractor for roughly the same amount of time, and can barely lift his arms up higher than his shoulders now (think McCain). My grandfather was a union painter for 40 years and died of mesothelioma from asbestos. And my dads best friend is a journeyman mechanic and has such brutal arthritis that he can't play softball or do a lot of the things he loves anymore.

So boo-hoo to the supposed tough guys that play football and have lingering injuries from a 10 year career. fug you you whiny pussies.

[party_animal]

i feel no sympathy for the players at all. they are employees to the owners. outside of football there are very few instances where general employees are able to dictate and negotiate their compensation to such a ridiculous level. these are grown men getting paid to play a game.

i, however, get paid for doing a job that's far more important and often requires me putting my life on the line for an entire nation of people that i have never met before. to do my job i will NEVER see the amount of money these so called men get paid for half a season of football. i don't get to renegotiate my contract in my favor. i get what i'm offered every four to six years, take it or leave it.

it's sad that a bunch of grown men couldn't find a fair way to share that much revenue. it's sad they're trying to take this to court. it's sad that the fans that help pay their salaries are the ones being hurt the most by all these political games. it actually kind of pisses me off because it shows me these men know nothing about true leadership or sacrifice. kids and adults alike look up these clowns as role models. to me, they're not honorable at all.

really? they are complaining about potential pay cuts. at the end of the day they were going to be okay regardless. they would still have more money than most of us will ever see. they would still have endorsements. they would still drive nicer cars and live in nicer houses than most of us. and they complain about health care?

my advice to fix the problem? hey NFL players. invest your money wisely and re-evaluate what's really important. because not all of us are as lucky as they are to play a game for a living. no some of us, actually have to earn what little money we make and do something far more important than throwing passes on a sunday.

[Lords0fPain]

It's pretty simple. If your boss and the company that employed you were making more money than ever before, many using state funded facilities, and they came to you and said you now have to work more hours for less money, you'd be okay with that I'm sure.

How are they working more hours? They came off the 18 game season. Not to mention they were going to use 2 preseason games for the extra 2 games. Which all players are required to be at and PREPARED to play (anyway) if the coach chooses for them to do so. And I have seen coaches make their starters play about whole time in all 4 preseason games (Tom Coughlin stands out off the top of my head). Not to mention they cut a lot of other areas of time requirements for the players, that the players walked away from.

The CBA isn't a good thing for all players, our new HC talked about how he was forced out due the CBA. The mid-range players are getting screwed and they better wake up, instead of keep feeding the superstars (Manning, Brees, etc) pockets.

In case you missed the OP:

"We offered, in fact we agreed to the union’s request for a cash team minimum for the first time in league history. We agreed to it at their number and their structure. Evidently not good enough.

We told the union that for 2011 and 2012, we would play within the existing 16-game regular season format, and we committed to them, notwithstanding the rights we have in the current agreement, we would not change to 18 games without their consent. Evidently not good enough.

At the same time, we agreed to implement wide ranging health and safety changes, reducing the offseason program by five weeks, reducing the practice time in the preseason, reducing the practice time and contract drills during the regular season and expanding the number of days off for players. Evidently not good enough."

[Lords0fPain]

Look more in the letter from gooddell, posted in another thread:

http://www.carolinahuddle.com/forum/carolina-panthers/57848-letter-from-roger-goodell.html

Unfortunately, I have to tell you that earlier today the players' union walked away from mediation and collective bargaining and has initiated litigation against the clubs. In an effort to get a fair agreement now, our clubs offered a deal today that was, among other things, designed to have no adverse financial impact on veteran players in the early years, and would have met the players’ financial demands in the latter years of the agreement.

The proposal we made included an offer to narrow the player compensation gap that existed in the negotiations by splitting the difference; guarantee a reallocation of savings from first-round rookies to veterans and retirees without negatively affecting compensation for rounds 2-7; no compensation reduction for veterans; implement new year-round health and safety rules; retain the current 16-4 season format for at least two years with any subsequent changes subject to the approval of the league and union; and establish a new legacy fund for retired players ($82 million contributed by the owners over the next two years).

[ed bell]

So let me get one thing straight here....part of the proposed CBA as offered by the owners reduces the offseason program by five weeks, reduces the practice time in the preseason, reduces the practice time and contract drills during the regular season and expands the number of days off for players.......

Sounds like shorter workdays overall, an extra 5 weeks off in the off-season and more days off during the season? With no real pay cuts relative to current salary levels?

It boggles the mind.......