Hurney's Big Decision

[Bj-Monster23]

Hater here, but I see Cam's potential. He could be great. I get it. But think of the organization as a whole, and the situation they are in and the opportunity they have. Read this entirely and objectively and comment, but not if you don't read it to the end and interpret it correctly. THIS IS A LOOK AT HIS OPTIONS and an example is used to illustrate an alternative to drafting Cam that still gets us a top quality franchise QB by the time Cam would be ready to play. THESE ARE THE FACTS, as best we can tell.

1. Hurney thinks Clausen was not given a fair shake and could develop into a starting NFL QB. It does not matter if you disagree or what the coaches/rest of front office think, this is what Hurney thinks. Move forward.

2. (Hypothetically, but would not be surprising) Washington calls. They offer Hurney their first and second rounders in 2011 and 2012 for the first pick. Hurney would be a fool not to do this. (Yes, this is what it would take them to move up--very in line with other drafts) Here is why-

First, he gets the 10th and the 41st picks in this year's draft. Secondly, if he seriously thinks Clausen has a shot at starting in the NFL, you give him the year. Not that he is crowned starter, but you bring in a veteran and Moore. Clausen has to fight for a job like last year. If he rises like Marty thinks he will, we have a QB. If not, you have Moore (who had a QB rating over 90 before last year's train wreck) and you pay for a guy like Hasselbeck or McNabb, --something like that.

You have to remember, Cam Newton may be a star, but it won't happen in 2011. It will take time. We took DE Quinn at #10 and Paea DT at #41, for example. They play now.

Lets say Hurney was wrong and Clausen fails. You still have a veteran and Moore on the roster. Clausen drops to #3 or is traded.

Was Hurney REALLY wrong? There are potentially 3 QBs in the 2012 draft who will be ready about as soon as Cam Newton or even sooner. We have a veteran and Moore on the roster. Lets say we go 8-8 next season and earn the 15th pick. QBs who declared for the 2012 draft: Andrew Luck, Landri Jones, and Matt Barkley. YOU HAVE WASHINGTON's FIRST & SECOND ROUNDERS. Package the Panther first with the Washington Picks and trade up. I am guessing the Skins will suck again this season, so you should easily have enough to move into the top 3. I mean, would we take the 8th and 15th pick in this year's draft? YES. So, you are not abandoning the idea of getting a franchise QB, you table it for a year. Washington's picks are insurance in the event Clausen continues to struggle. Then you know. In addition, you get a stud franchise QB in 2012 if you are wrong in 2011. If you are right and Clausen develops, or Moore, or your veteran takes off, then you have 2 firsts and 2 seconds in 2012.

This is how New England stays ahead of the curve. I am not even suggesting that we will not have a franchise QB under center by 2012. We will. Cam will not be ready until then, so we may never feel the impact of passing on a franchise QB.

Cam may be the best QB in this year's draft, but give him a year in a pro system to develop and put him back into the draft and 2012 (if you could), and I doubt he goes before Luck, Landri and possibly Barkley.

So when you say, "Draft Cam", you have to consider what you would get for him in a trade, how long he will take to develop, and that the extra picks in 2012 give you the coin to move up and get about any player in the draft next year. In addition, your don't short sell a current QB who needs a year in a normal setting to show the GM what he can actually do.

If the Cats get an offer for the pick, I would make sure a #1 in 2012 was part of the deal for this reason.

I have to agree to what you are saying. This is the first person who really gave some specific reason why and why not wise to what we should do. Everybody else just talks about it but never give a good reason or have a good logic about what we should do. So all i have to say if we can get this deal I would take it hands down..

[jpniner]

It was stated that if there is no NFL this year we would have the 3rd pick in the draft next year based on the past three season's of performance.

when was this confirmed

[CarolinaPanthers8789]

Fiz looked it up awhile back it was in the old CBA.

[jpniner]

Fiz looked it up awhile back it was in the old CBA.

so league lied to Steve reed when he reported opposite?

[blackcatgrowl]

Hater here

Stopped reading there.

[CarolinaPanthers8789]

^ I guess so or Steve Reed lied.

[jpniner]

^ I guess so or Steve Reed lied.

did Fiz provide proof or we are just taking his word?

[CarolinaPanthers8789]

He spent time looking it up and found it in the old CBA.

The last thing the NFL will use is the previous rankings.

I would think they would do an average of the past 3 years, a lottery like the NHL did in 2005, or most likely the guys will get a deal done after week 3 because they realize they want to play ball.

[teeray]

I think it is a stretch to think that ANYBODY, can come in here and be ready to go and be our starter on day 1. Luck MAYBE, but Barkely and Jones, those two also are going to need to sit for some amount of time to get used to the NFL.

If you sign a FA are you only signing them to one year contracts??

Do you believe a McNabb would want to come to a 2-14 team for only a 1 year contract?? If you sign him for 2 years do you sit Barkely in 2012 or your FA??

What does Rivera do if they are massive busts?? If Cam busts Rivera will still likely have some time to try and fix the position after 2012. If he waits until next year then he likely has his future riding on one guy. If Barkley fails, Rivera is fired.

So it seems really good in theory and could be a good way to go. But in a lot of ways, especially for Rivera, it is even MORE risky than drafting Cam this year.

[SPANKY]

There will be another QB in the mix no doubt, no matter how much Hurney like's Jimmy. But Jimmy will get his shot in camp, I'd like to see a decent vet QB in there at camp. Maybe they draft a QB, I'am to the point now I just want to wait and see the CBA get done, then we can start to make something happen.

[Marguide]

Cam may be the best QB in this year's draft, but give him a year in a pro system to develop and put him back into the draft and 2012 (if you could), and I doubt he goes before Luck, Landri and possibly Barkley.

I disagree. Give Cam a year in a pro system I have little doubt he goes either 1 or 2 in a 2012 draft.

[jpniner]

He spent time looking it up and found it in the old CBA.

The last thing the NFL will use is the previous rankings.

I would think they would do an average of the past 3 years, a lottery like the NHL did in 2005, or most likely the guys will get a deal done after week 3 because they realize they want to play ball.

I just read through(mostly keyword searched) the Current CBA, 299 pages, and didn't find any clause related to this. "3" is a common determinator for all sorts of things throughout though.

I did find this:

Section 2. Effective Date/Expiration Date: Except as provided in Section 3 below, this Agreement shall be effective from March 8, 2006 until the last

day of the 2012 League Year, except for the provisions relating to the Draft,

Article XVI (College Draft), which shall expire in the League Year immediately

following the expiration or termination of this Agreement.

I bet, if no NFL happens next season but new CBA is agreed to before next years draft they will address Draft order situation as part of the CBA

[Nicbsbll2]

I've got another senario for the OP...

Assume we trade down this year like you propose. The season goes on, we finish with a 7-9 record and pick at around 10 or so.

However, Matt Barkley does his best Jake Locker impression and becomes an absolute flop during the biggest season of his life and Landry Jones decides to return to school. This leaves only 1 good QB prospect in the draft in Andrew Luck.

The poor Bengals, who missed out on taking Newton and Gabbert the previous year, own the 1st pick after the team folded when Carson Palmer retired, have made it known that they will select Andrew Luck first overall.

Unfortunately for Carolina, Jimmy Clausen showed no sign of improvement and remained the 3rd QB on the depth chart for the entire season. Also, our vet QB is also getting up there in age and has only 1, maybe 2, more season left to play.

To summarize, Barkley became Jake Locker, Jones went back to school, Luck is 100% going to the selected by Cincy 1st overall, Clausen didn't show anything, and we have a QB that lead us to a mediocre season that only has 1 year left to play.

Now what do we do about the future at the QB position?

[panthers55]

First of all we know Snyder is a little crazy at times but Allen and Shanahan are not. So the first issue Hurney would have to consider is what they know or think they know to trade first rounders and then give up next year's first and second as well as this year's second to move up 9 spots to take Newton. After all they already have McNabb who we supposedly would want and could simply wait until next year as well and get their QB like we could. If Newton won't be ready for a year and they can pick 3 better ones next year, why move up at all?? It would make no sense unless they felt that Newton or Gabbert were franchise guys who would be better than who they could get next year or they were desperate to pick a QB this year no matter what his potential.

Secondly Hurney would have to wonder how his coaching staff and Richardson will see him if Clausen or Moore don't play well and the offense sucks again. Maybe his job is secure and he has time to develop a player or maybe he is under a mandate to fix it right away. Maybe as others say the choice will be the guy the fans will get excited about so we will pick Newton no matter what. But how he is viewed right now by upper management has to weigh in on how much flexibility he is to not pick a QB and save picks for the future.

Third Hurney will have to decide if he can do better with someone else. Maybe he can trade with Buffalo and still pick in the top 3 this year and get either Newton or Gabbert and perhaps still get our lost second back.

Some of this will depend on whether the CBA is finished or not and whether there was free agency or not and do we have that vetern aboard already.

I am sure there will be offers, the question is whether they are significant enough to consider and whether we feel we can get our vet in FA or not. Lets see where things are at in 4 weeks and then we have enough info to give this thread due justice. Right now there are too many things still unknown to decide what we should do.