I'm starting 2 hope Jimmy can prove people wrong.

[Happy Panther]

but I'm betting he wins the job outright. .

I'm going to start betting people high steaks that this doesn't happen

[Cyberjag]

like I said, downfield doesn't mean 20 or 40 yards. It is the 10 to 20 yard window downfield that is important.

2007 Browns - Derrick Anderson (from ESPN).

Passes thrown 11-20 yards -1439 yards, 12 TDs

Passes thrown 21-30 yards - 305 yards, 4 TDs

Passes thrown 31-40 yards - 216 yards, 4 TDs.

that is 1966 yards and 20 TDs from throws 10 yards or further downfield. They are the most important throws in Chud's offense (11-20 range)......you can checkdown or take the occassinal 20+ deep shot but his offense lives and dies in the 10-20 yard area downfield. You gotta be able to sit in the pocket and throw downfield or Chud's offense doesn't work (10-20 yards is downfield).

Passes thrown 0-10 yards - 1573 yards, 8 TDs.

And the Browns scored 18 rushing TDs as well, which is what you expect when you're close to the goal line.

Then you want to consider all the YAC from the backs as well, and that 11-20 yards number probably gets cut in half in terms of how far he's actually being asked to throw the ball.

Cherry-pick all you want. It's painfully obvious that you have such a negative bias towards Clausen that it's pointless to even go on about it. We get it, you think he'll fail. If we were going to a WCO you would probably be posting about how he's not a fit for that either.

I believe he'll improve a ton, and I also acknowledge that a drastic improvement will only get him into "decent NFL QB" territory. And the only thing you're convincing me of is your own stubborn streak.

[csx]

I'm going to start betting people high steaks that this doesn't happen

make it a porterhouse and you got a bet

[CRA]

Passes thrown 0-10 yards - 1573 yards, 8 TDs.

And the Browns scored 18 rushing TDs as well, which is what you expect when you're close to the goal line.

Then you want to consider all the YAC from the backs as well, and that 11-20 yards number probably gets cut in half in terms of how far he's actually being asked to throw the ball.Cherry-pick all you want. It's painfully obvious that you have such a negative bias towards Clausen that it's pointless to even go on about it. We get it, you think he'll fail. If we were going to a WCO you would probably be posting about how he's not a fit for that either.

I believe he'll improve a ton, and I also acknowledge that a drastic improvement will only get him into "decent NFL QB" territory. And the only thing you're convincing me of is your own stubborn streak.

No. What you are failing to acknowledge is that stat I showed shows how far he actually threw the ball (he physically threw it 10 yards or further)......NOT how far a play went b/c of YAC added in.

that isn't cherry picking.....it is showing what throws are important in Chud's offense. 10 -20 yards downfield is key for a QB in his offense. Throwing a screen and him taking it 15 yards is not a 10-20 yard throw and not in those stats.

and again, I have repeatedly stated Clausen is suited more for a WCO. I mean, I think we drafted 2 QBs who didn't fit what Fox did....which is why I didn't want either to play. I wanted them to wait until a new OC came to see what we would run. I don't think he fits in an offenses that requires a QB to stay in the pocket and throwing downfield. Fox's did and so will Riveras. Clausen hasn't shown in college or the pros he is good at that

[PrimeTyme]

it would be great if Clausen had a big

[Cyberjag]

No. What you are failing to acknowledge is that stat I showed shows how far he actually threw the ball (he physically threw it 10 yards or further)......NOT how far a play went b/c of YAC added in.

that isn't cherry picking.....it is showing what throws are important in Chud's offense.

and again, I have repeatedly stated Clausen is suited more for a WCO. I mean, I think we drafted 2 QBs who didn't fit what Fox did....which is why I didn't want either to play. I wanted them to wait until a new OC came to see what we would run. I don't think he fits in an offenses that requires a QB to stay in the pocket and throwing downfield. Fox's did and so will Riveras. Clausen hasn't in college or the pros he is good at that

Put YAC in and it becomes obvious that most of his throws were 10 yards or less. And it might be to your benefit to read up on Norv Turner's influence on the Coryell offense as far as it relates to the passing game. And I am deeply skeptical of your claims that you would say Clausen was going to excel in a WCO if we had one, I don't honestly believe there is any scenario in which you would predict even decent play from him.

[MHS831]

Name the rookie QBs in the NFL today and throughout its history who would have shown us anything that suggested an NFL caliber QB?

(Answer: lots)

Not here they wouldn't. Clausen is a second rounder. What I saw was confusion based on a poorly executed game plans, pressure from missed blocks, rookies running poor routes, and a young QB who was thrown against the toughest schedule in the NFL.

Sorry he didn't dazzle with super fast checkdowns and tight 40-yard spirals. When he is in attack mode, that happens. When he is in defense mode, it doesn't. Most of this season featured people pinning their ears back and bringing blitzes. Our line was broken and the WRs were still works in progress. Hang Clausen!!

Now, I saw some nice fades to Smith, I saw him hit the seam routes. Not as many as one would like, but to say that he showed nothing means to me that you refused to acknowledge anything. You were biased and didn't like losing so you found it easier to attack the QB without the multitude of factors working against him.

[CRA]

Put YAC in and it becomes obvious that most of his throws were 10 yards or less. And it might be to your benefit to read up on Norv Turner's influence on the Coryell offense as far as it relates to the passing game. And I am deeply skeptical of your claims that you would say Clausen was going to excel in a WCO if we had one, I don't honestly believe there is any scenario in which you would predict even decent play from him.

what I am telling you again.....the stat shows how far he threw the ball downfield. It isn't a net result of a play w/ YAC factored in. the majority of Anderson's production (yardage and TDs) was from throws 10 yards or further. Again, that is when he literally threw the ball 10 yards or more downfield. That is what you have to be able to do in Chud's offense. Throw it 10-20 yards. A screen/checkdown where he runs it 15 yards is NOT a ball thrown 10-20 yards.

I never said Clasuen would excel....I have repeatedly stated he is looks to better suited for a WCO.

[Dpantherman]

Im not sure that you should be considered a fan of the team if you hope one of the guys on the team fails. I hope everyone succeeds, because if they do, then so does the team.

[Cyberjag]

Ok, so his receivers averaged 5 yards after the catch. Most of Anderson's throws were in the 0-10 yard range, and that includes yards after catch. The second most throws were in the 11-20 yard range, which also includes yards after catch.

Now this is where I go out on a looooong limb. If I take the yards after catch away, then we're looking at 6-14 yards for an 11-20 yard throw, right? So take about half of them and call it 10 yards or less in the air. That leaves you with the VAST majority of his passing requiring under 10 yards in the air. Which you think Clausen can't do reliably.

[TheRealDeal]

You guys all act like Clausen is your boy from back when and the franchise is so invested in him that they must give him another shot.

Rivera won't care about last year, he cares about the future and you are all idiots if you think he's going to "give Jimmy another shot" because he was in a bad spot.

After the hire I've stated multiple times that they need to bring in competition and if he wins it then he should start and I'll be fine with that but lately I'm getting a "hunch" that he will be cut before the season starts. Just a hunch.

[Carl Spackler]

You guys all act like Clausen is your boy from back when and the franchise is so invested in him that they must give him another shot.

Rivera won't care about last year, he cares about the future and you are all idiots if you think he's going to "give Jimmy another shot" because he was in a bad spot.

After the hire I've stated multiple times that they need to bring in competition and if he wins it then he should start and I'll be fine with that but lately I'm getting a "hunch" that he will be cut before the season starts. Just a hunch.

Of course when that doesn't happen will we get you to admit you were wrong? Of course not. I've got a "hunch" Moore won't be a Panther. And Clausen will probably be #2 on the roster and depth chart

[TheRealDeal]

Of course when that doesn't happen will we get you to admit you were wrong? Of course not. I've got a "hunch" Moore won't be a Panther. And Clausen will probably be #2 on the roster and depth chart

It's possible both our hunches won't happen, that's why they are hunches.

If I had to make a bet, I'd bet it'll be Moore, Vet, Clausen next year but don't be surprised if Clausen isn't around.

[CRA]

Ok, so his receivers averaged 5 yards after the catch. Most of Anderson's throws were in the 0-10 yard range, and that includes yards after catch. The second most throws were in the 11-20 yard range, which also includes yards after catch.

Now this is where I go out on a looooong limb. If I take the yards after catch away, then we're looking at 6-14 yards for an 11-20 yard throw, right? So take about half of them and call it 10 yards or less in the air. That leaves you with the VAST majority of his passing requiring under 10 yards in the air. Which you think Clausen can't do reliably.

the production is what matters. the prodcution in Chud's offense came from throws 10 yards or further. YES, he completed passes shorter. But the offense functioned b/c of being able to go downfield (10-20 yards). The production in the pass game came when the players got the ball in their hands at least 10 yards downfield. Whoever plays QB in Carolina will have to be able to get the ball in the hands of players once they are 10 yards or farther downfield.

beating a dead horse. Clausen can't stay in a pocket and let plays develop. He didn't in college. He didn't this season. You think he somehow will learn to stay in the pocket and on top of that make throws over NFL lines......I don't. I hope he does but I just don't think it is realistic from his play. I am offically retiring from any thread with Clausen in the title until TC.....so I apologize if I don't respond.