Marty Hurney is a terrible GM

[frash.exe]

Ugoh started as a rookie...just wanted to point that out.

I got my years mixed up. 2006 I thought he got drafted. My bad.

My point is still made though.

[The Answer]

I'll give you my opinion on how he is doing as GM after these couple weeks.

[Urrymonster]

Funny. Tarik Glenn, all pro LT for Indy retires and out from the backups emerges a 2nd year player called Tony Ugoh.

New England linemen get replaced frequently with little or no dropoff.

And GTFO out with the beatdown. You're making yourself look a fool with the personal attack. A year ago you probably wouldn't even recognize Gross as a franchise anything player. He was solid, probably our only solid lineman but he wasn't Steve Smith caliber to anybody.

Whether or not you like it some players just want to hit the market, and what the f*ck do you do then when you realize they just want to leave and money isn't going to solve the problem?

When do the Pats replace their OL with cheaper players?

RT - Kaczur - Starter for 4 years

RG - Yates - Longtime Pats player replaced Hochstein who is still on the roster

C - Koppen - Starter since 2003

LG - Mankins - First round draft pick - Starter since 2005

LT - Light - Starter since 2001

Seems to me they have done everything to keep the same 5 guys together...

Regarding the Ugoh situation, they drafted him to replace Glen. They probably knew he was going to retire before the draft and thus picked one up as early as they could. Ugoh was also one of the safest PASS protection OTs in that draft - Indy can't run the ball though...

The reason Gross was not a franchise player was simply because he was not playing in a franchise position. That's why the over reaction to Otah is a little silly. People seem to think he will be able to slide over to LT, but essentially he has pretty poor pass protection skills. Gross on the other hand can do both decently and with our style of football that is important. He is not perfect and makes mistakes, but free agents and youngsters alike are not as proficient as Gross in BOTH areas. The guy is the leader of our OL. We NEED to keep him.

[bigdog_10_2002]

as long as he and Fox field a competitive football team, (which they have done every year), I think he is doing a good job at GM

[Pumpkin Eater]

So...

John Fox sucks because he can't make it to the Super Bowl every year with all the massive amounts of talent on his roster, but Hurney sucks because he can never get any good players to play for us?

You nailed it.

[Punisher]

So...

John Fox sucks because he can't make it to the Super Bowl every year with all the massive amounts of talent on his roster, but Hurney sucks because he can never get any good players to play for us?

That is my battle cry.

[Punisher]

I got my years mixed up. 2006 I thought he got drafted. My bad.

My point is still made though.

No it doesn't. They thought Glenn would retire. He did. They got a replacement for him. The replacement wasn't sitting on the bench. :mad2:

If Gross goes, look for us to replace him.

[frash.exe]

When do the Pats replace their OL with cheaper players?

RT - Kaczur - Starter for 4 years

RG - Yates - Longtime Pats player replaced Hochstein who is still on the roster

C - Koppen - Starter since 2003

LG - Mankins - First round draft pick - Starter since 2005

LT - Light - Starter since 2001

So NE's linemen never get hurt? They never have backups play in their place with little dropoff? BTW, Yates has started like 11 games for the Pats in 5 years.

Regarding the Ugoh situation, they drafted him to replace Glen. They probably knew he was going to retire before the draft and thus picked one up as early as they could. Ugoh was also one of the safest PASS protection OTs in that draft - Indy can't run the ball though...

...and thus they knew the day would soon come and prepared accordingly. Ugoh's strength was his pass protection, but that's fine because the Colts don't even try to run the ball. That's Peyton's offense.

The reason Gross was not a franchise player was simply because he was not playing in a franchise position. That's why the over reaction to Otah is a little silly. People seem to think he will be able to slide over to LT, but essentially he has pretty poor pass protection skills. Gross on the other hand can do both decently and with our style of football that is important. He is not perfect and makes mistakes, but free agents and youngsters alike are not as proficient as Gross in BOTH areas. The guy is the leader of our OL. We NEED to keep him.

Poor pass protection skills? Dude Delhomme got sacked only 20 times last year. You know what, Gross had the same knock on him coming out of college, that he was only a RT. He proved us wrong. Otah, with no pro experience put up a phenomenal first year, and now, with a year under his belt, he should get even better. The only glaring question mark is his durability.

If we can keep Gross that's fine, but I don't feel like paying another player 12+ million a year on average, and if he wants to leave, we have no choice anyway.

[fitty76]

Does Hurney handle the salary cap?

[JakeFlake]

Does Hurney handle the salary cap?

I think Rob Rogers does that.

[1789Cardiac Cats9020]

I was just reading Florio's piece on all of the power Gross has over the Panthers organization in the next couple of weeks and made me realize just how bad Hurney is.

How did he manage to let it get to the point where half of our Pro Bowlers are going to be UFAs in a few weeks if nothing is done? If he and the team knew that Peppers didn't want to play with us anymore at the start of the season when he turned down that massive contract offer, why not trade him before the trading deadline so Peppers' agent couldn't make a power play by going public with Peppers' intent not to play here next year? Also, since he knew Peppers was unlikely to be here next year, why didn't he make it a priority to get JG resigned during the season like he did with Gamble?

Do yourself a favor and just not talk anymore in this thread

[Urrymonster]

So NE's linemen never get hurt? They never have backups play in their place with little dropoff? BTW, Yates has started like 11 games for the Pats in 5 years.

Seriously bud...

YOU were the one who said NE drops their best linemen. They don't. In fact they have had the same line for the last 3 years with Yates breaking into the starting line this year. Yes Yates has only started 11 games, but he is the starter now and Hochstein who was the incumbent for the previous 4 years or so is STILL on the roster. Of course they have injuries, but you are claiming they dump their starters the moment they have an adequate replacement?! We had a few injuries this year that resulted in emergency back up play, they did well, but like NE the starters go straight back in. They even splashed out on a first rounder in Mankins. This is something you simply are wrong, please just accept it. It is not even opinionated, it's fact. Please just accept that you are wrong on this.

...and thus they knew the day would soon come and prepared accordingly. Ugoh's strength was his pass protection, but that's fine because the Colts don't even try to run the ball. That's Peyton's offense.

No. No they weren't. They were FORCED into picking up an OT because they didn't have a replacement ready and were FORCED to start Ugoh when they had planned to sit him for a season or two. This could be deemed an opinion so it may be something we will have to disagree on.

Poor pass protection skills? Dude Delhomme got sacked only 20 times last year. You know what, Gross had the same knock on him coming out of college, that he was only a RT. He proved us wrong. Otah, with no pro experience put up a phenomenal first year, and now, with a year under his belt, he should get even better. The only glaring question mark is his durability.

Think you may have misunderstood me. I love Otah and think the pick exchange was inspired the moment we did it and I never questioned how much we gave up. The fact is that Otah is still raw in pass protection and was beaten a fair few times by speed rushers. The reason we did not give up a huge amount of sacks was that people were constantly trying to deal with our running game. When they shut that down, the sacks flooded in. I love Otah but possibly 90% of people who watch the Panthers can accept that pass protection is an area he definately needs to improve on and so I would be very very loathe to thrust him into LT. It is just too big of a risk. Plus it just means we need to find a new RT instead and could be downgrading both spots in the process.

You also kind of proved my point. Gross was seen as a RT by many people, including their organisation (why move him to RT and Wharton to LT). That is why suddenly people consider him a franchise player, is because he proved them wrong. BUT that does not mean any Joe Bloggs can do it and thus it is a serious risk entrusting the LT spot with Otah or a rookie.

If we can keep Gross that's fine, but I don't feel like paying another player 12+ million a year on average, and if he wants to leave, we have no choice anyway.[b/]

Not sure he will be $12 million a year, I thought it would be in line with $8-10 million a year. But you clearly do not value or appreciate continuity on the lines and thus any figure would be too much in your eyes. Just consider this. Why are so many teams picking OL right at the top of the draft?