Elite/Good/Game Manager(Decent)/Bad

[koolkatluke]

Lot of confusion between good QBs, elite QBs and game managers so I decided to make a list.

NFCW

STL: Bradford=Young Game manager, probably will be good

SEA:Hass=Bad

SF: A/T Smith=Bad

AZ: Anderson=Bad, Skelton=Bad w/ potential

3/4 should be looking for new QBs

NFCN

CHI:Cutler=Good

GB:Rodgers=Elite

MIN:Favre/Tarvaris=Bad

DET:Stafford=Good but needs to be on the field longer to determine

Minny needs to find a new QB fast

NFCE

DAL:Romo=Good

WASH:McNabb=Game Manager, Rexy=Game Manager

NYG:Eli=Game Manager

PHI:Vick=Elite

Washington needs a QB that Shanny likes and NYG should look to upgrade but the name won't allow them to

NFCS

NO:Brees=Elite

ATL:Ryan=Game Manager

TB:Freeman=Good

CAR:Clausen=Bad

We need a QB

AFCW

SD: Rivers=Elite

KC: Cassell=Game Manager

OAK: Cambell=Game Manager at best

DEN: The Golden Calf of Bristol=Game Manager with potential to be good

Oak needs a QB and I think Denver will too

AFCN

BALT:Flacco = Game Manager

CIN:Palmer = Good (had a down year but isn't finished)

CLE: McCoy=Game Manager at best

PITT: Big Ben=Good

Cle will need a new QB and I think Cincy will just because of the fan/media pressure but I think Palmer is still a good QB

AFCE

NE: Brady=Elite

NYJ:Sanchez = Game Manager with Good potential

MIA:Henne=Bad

BUFF:Fitz = Game Manager

Mia and Buff need new QBs

AFCS

INDY: Manning=Elite

JAC: Garrard= Game Manager

TEN:VY/Kerry=Game Manager

HOU:Schaub=Good

I'd say Ten gets a new QB soon and Jac as well

You say I speak nonsense????? Really??? Really???

Look at who you've put in the same catagory as Matt Moore

Flacco

Garrard

Ryan

Eli

McNabb

Bradford

and I'm the one with the nonsense?

All these guys have proven they don't poo on themselves when the game matters.

[Unibrow]

How is Ryan Fitzpatrick "poor?" He has thrown 23 TD's with only 15 INT's, to a receiving corp of Lee Evans and Steve Johnson, a running game of Fred Jackson, and the coaching of Chan Gailey. His YPA has improved every year for the last 3 years, as have his TD's. He's average, but I think he could be good unless he regresses horribly next year.

[koolkatluke]

You say I speak nonsense????? Really??? Really???

Look at who you've put in the same catagory as Matt Moore

Flacco

Garrard

Ryan

Eli

McNabb

Bradford

and I'm the one with the nonsense?

All these guys have proven they don't poo on themselves when the game matters.

You know what is funny Hass, Rexy, Henne and Cambell have proven more then Moore and you have them as worst on your list.

[koolkatluke]

My question is if Matt moore was on another team doing the same thing he's done here would we even know who he is?

[TheRealDeal]

KKL you just quoted yourself you know that right?

You obviously don't understand the thread or the concept of the thread so this is my last response to you. You've taken a good thread about a topic we haven't talked about lately and made it the same old thing, which I am partly guilty for by participating with you. I will no longer derail my own thread.

[koolkatluke]

KKL you just quoted yourself you know that right?

You obviously don't understand the thread or the concept of the thread so this is my last response to you. You've taken a good thread about a topic we haven't talked about lately and made it the same old thing, which I am partly guilty for by participating with you. I will no longer derail my own thread.

No I just set a trap and you jump right in to it. (Proven your great Football knowlege to everyone).:yesnod:

If you didn't catch that I was being sarcastics on the last line.

[bleys]

I had Ben in that "good" category. I just can't get over the fact that Charlie Batch was lighting it up in his place. They have probably the best defense in the NFL and one of the best running games.

He's on the cusp but the Batch thing bothers me.

by that logic (perhaps more extreme), Brady is just a good QB since Cassel took over without skipping a beat. Big Ben is an elite QB, I don't care what bias people have with him (and I'm referring to pre-scandal)..

Fitzpatrick is pretty decent QB.. I don't think Buffalo will be looking for a replacement, but perhaps a project.. he's earned the clear starting spot for next year.. how he does with that is left to be seen..

Flacco is a good qb.. not a game manager, look at his stats.. he's been one of the better QBs this year.. or at least 2nd half of the season..

[theyhateme45]

I don't like either of them to be honest, Eli has a ring, but when i look at the too, give Moore that oline, Nicks, Steve Smith (the other one), Manningham, and Kevin Boss, who knows. I do know Eli Manning is average at best. really good QBs don't throw 24 interceptions.

People really use stats to affirm there bias of/hate for any particular player..... Everyone has said Drew Brees is Elite.... Good Qb's don't throw 24 interceptions? Well Mr. Brees has 21.... That's damn near 24.... and he only has 2 more td's than Manning..... So is Brees now Garbage and in the same boat as Moore??

Just curious.

[theyhateme45]

You say I speak nonsense????? Really??? Really???

Look at who you've put in the same catagory as Matt Moore

Flacco

Garrard

Ryan

Eli

McNabb

Bradford

and I'm the one with the nonsense?

All these guys have proven they don't poo on themselves when the game matters.

Putting all those QB's in the same boat as Moore right now is an absolute Joke.... Did people not remember his games this year? He was given the keys to the car and trashed the hell out of it. I was on the Moore Bandwagon to, but C'MON MAN!!!

[TheRealDeal]

This list was more than stats. It's about where the QB's abilities are all else remaining constant. Therefor, you have to take into account their supporting cast, their schedule, their coaching, their system, everything and really look into what they bring to the table and not just on what they are producing. Some guys have been on pretty damn good teams and not really taken those teams to the next level. Some guys have been on bad teams and played bad. Some guys have been on decent teams and played decent. Some guys have been on bad teams and played decent.

You also can't use length of career or past accomplishments to bash a newer player in the league (ie McNabb and Bradford). Once McNabb left that QB friendly system he hasn't done much. Sure he's had a good career but other guys in that system did as well (Vick, Garcia, Kolb) so you have to consider that.

[Unibrow]

You also can't use length of career or past accomplishments to bash a newer player in the league (ie McNabb and Bradford). Once McNabb left that QB friendly system he hasn't done much. Sure he's had a good career but other guys in that system did as well (Vick, Garcia, Kolb) so you have to consider that.

That QB friendly system had him throwing to the likes of Freddie Mitchell, James Thrash, Hank Baskett, etc. The one year he got an elite WR he went to the Super Bowl. This year he had Santana Moss, Chris Cooley, Anthony Armstrong, and the corpse of Joey Galloway to throw to. I do think his skills have fallen off but remember he was from the same draft as Culpepper, who fell off way quicker and more spectacularly.

[TheRealDeal]

That QB friendly system had him throwing to the likes of Freddie Mitchell, James Thrash, Hank Baskett, etc. The one year he got an elite WR he went to the Super Bowl. This year he had Santana Moss, Chris Cooley, Anthony Armstrong, and the corpse of Joey Galloway to throw to. I do think his skills have fallen off but remember he was from the same draft as Culpepper, who fell off way quicker and more spectacularly.

He also had one of the best pass catching RBs ever in his backfield and they used that in place of a running game. There are many things to consider and he's fallen off since he left Philly. Each and every QB they've put in place of him when he was there and after (Garcia, Kolb, Vick) has played well and put up big numbers. His best days are behind him and that's reflected in my original post.

[koolkatluke]

Your list is a fraud plain and simple. You my have had a argument early but when you put QB's like Mcnabb and Eli in the same grouping as Moore you lose all credibility.

You downgrade Mcnabb for being in a QB freindly system but Call Vick elite in the same system with better weapons then Mcnabb had. Mcnabb took that team too 5 nfc championship games and 1 superbowl with wr like F mitchell and Todd pinkston. Question how often did Westbrooke play a full season???? Since he was a major weapon for Mcnabb missing him as much as he has been injured would only make Mcnabb achievements look better.

I ask this question again if Moore played for the Browns with the same # and achievements would he even be rated? I argue Chris Redman of the Falcons has done more then him.

[TheRealDeal]

Another thing in consideration is if the players best years are behind them or in their future. Guys like Cassell, Sanchez, and Bradford are on the rise while Hass and McNabb are at the end of their run.