Clausen - Personal Beef with Smitty Affecting His Play?/Overall Improvement?

[Awesomeness!!]

I think Jimmy may have peaked today. Expect a sharp decline starting Thursday.

[CRA]

Clausen will look for Smitty just like he does everyone else.....if your route is a comeback or go on the sideline he will look to see if you are open and take a shot. Outside of that, it has to be a dump off, quick slant, screen etc. He completely refuses to give any route over the middle of the field a chance even w/ open WRs.

Jimmy has consistantly refused to look downfield and over the middle. Which is the majority of the field. Big plays happen there.....and when Jimmy refuses to pull the trigger you see Smitty erupt like he did today. Can't blame him....that play setup exactly how Carolina wanted it.

Watching Skelton today....just shows how far behind Jimmy is with basics. Dumping off and going to the sideline is what Jimmy does. In Skelton's second start (although flawed and looking like a rookie), he showed the basics Jimmy doesn't have at this level. Skeleton looked to make plays downfield and using the big space between the sidelines.

Skeleton looked to have potenital to grasp what the NFL is about. Clausen still hasn't shown that. Clausen throws a decent ball down the sideline.....but that is all he has in his game.

[Vagrant]

You can't throw the ball down field if you don't have enough time in the pocket for the WR to finish his route. Jimmy isn't a God and he may not even be an NFL quarterback... it remains to be seen. However, nobody could have success behind this line. They're a group of run blockers. Their pass protection sucks nuts and that dates back to the days of Delhomme.

[AceMan]

So do we wait on Clausen to improve or get better protection if we draft Luck or any other 1st round QB?

[Proudiddy]

So do we wait on Clausen to improve or get better protection if we draft Luck or any other 1st round QB?

I understand our OL isn't great in pass pro, but again, the stuff Clausen is doing isn't the OL's fault. There's a reason Moore had more TDs AND INTs in his time as the starter - HE ACTUALLY TOOK CHANCES DOWNFIELD. Sometimes it worked, sometimes it backfired, and a few of those were b/c of poor throws that he purposely put too much air under. I bet if he continued to start and wouldn't have got injured, you wouldn't have seen those same INTs again.

Clausen, as I, and others have said repeatedly since seeing him in extensive action, refuses to throw it downfield - especially the middle. Any routes that require more than one move he dumps it down before they get to the 2nd. If it's a long developing route (drag) it's already out of the question before the play starts. He's looking for the short dumpoff, all the time, or as CRA said, any route that's coming back to him. He won't take any shots with a route going away from him.

I've also noticed he seems hesitant to throw the "Are you a legit NFL QB?" route - the out.

Saying all that, we can't sit on our hands and hope/wait to see improvement. It's like the RB position to me at this point, you load up talent, invest picks early to shore up that position with said talent, and the more you got the better chance you have at hitting on one. Then you trade the excess. Although I have a hard time seeing Clausen being anything but a backup now, being that all 31 other teams passed on him before he played a game... Take Luck.

[CRA]

You can't throw the ball down field if you don't have enough time in the pocket for the WR to finish his route. Jimmy isn't a God and he may not even be an NFL quarterback... it remains to be seen. However, nobody could have success behind this line. They're a group of run blockers. Their pass protection sucks nuts and that dates back to the days of Delhomme.

again, that has nothing to do with Clausen not throwing over the middle. We have seen him w/ time and with open WRs. He doesn't want to make those plays and there is too much to process for him. Regardless of time, he is only comfortable going down the sideline.

[Proudiddy]

again, that has nothing to do with Clausen not throwing over the middle. We have seen him w/ time and with open WRs. He doesn't want to make those plays and there is too much to process for him. Regardless of time, he is only comfortable going down the sideline.

It also seems he looks to break the pocket more often than he does to step up in it and find a throwing lane, which leads to decreased time to get a pass off. I've also said several times over the last several weeks, it appears many of the sacks he's taken have been a result of him not identifying the blitzer.

[Vagrant]

again, that has nothing to do with Clausen not throwing over the middle. We have seen him w/ time and with open WRs. He doesn't want to make those plays and there is too much to process for him. Regardless of time, he is only comfortable going down the sideline.

We can't say, "regardless of time", when all he has ever had is not enough time. Because saying that he does X "regardless of time", implies that we have seen him exhibit the same behavior when he has an adequate amount of time to go through his reads without being forced to move the pocket, throw it out of bounds, take a sack, or check down. I am of the opinion that he has never had that amount of time.

And those that are saying that Andrew Luck will come in and deliver immediately without a vast improvement by this offensive line are kidding themselves in my estimation. Going through your progressions takes time.... and if you don't get it then you don't get it.

[CRA]

It also seems he looks to break the pocket more often than he does to step up in it and find a throwing lane, which leads to decreased time to get a pass off. I've also said several times over the last several weeks, it appears many of the sacks he's taken have been a result of him not identifying the blitzer.

yep, that is a huge part of it. Lots of NFL QBs see similar pressure.......and make plays. Since they know how to move in the pocket they pull plays off and therefore the OL doesn't get slammed as garbage.

poor QB play makes an OL look worse than it is. Carolina's OL ain't great but Clausen's decisions make the protection look worse than it is. Good QBs would have stepped up and made plays often when Jimmy scrambles for his life. Sure, sometimes Clausen is a dead duck in there.....but that happens to the other QBs as well.

[CRA]

We can't say, "regardless of time", when all he has ever had is not enough time. Because saying that he does X "regardless of time", implies that we have seen him exhibit the same behavior when he has an adequate amount of time to go through his reads without being forced to move the pocket, throw it out of bounds, take a sack, or check down. I am of the opinion that he has never had that amount of time.

And those that are saying that Andrew Luck will come in and deliver immediately without a vast improvement by this offensive line are kidding themselves in my estimation. Going through your progressions takes time.... and if you don't get it then you don't get it.

we have seen him w/ time.

plays with good protection also result in him scrambling right and throwing it away......he doesn't do that just when protection has been bad. You take away his first read and he simply can't process things at this point beyond that. When that throw isn't there.....he is more comfortable having WRs break of there routes and he scrambles.

the 3rd down throw by Skelton where Beason had the terrific breakup is the EXACT type throw Clausen needs to be willing to make. He has time for those.....he can't process things and doesn't try....which is why Smitty got pissy.

[Pox 08]

I think it's more about Fox and company probably telling him to play it safe , and a lack of trust in his Oline. At this point, it seems that the Oline doesn't trust him and he doesn't trust them.

I like the kid, I think he has all the tools to eventually be a great qb in the league. I'd like to see what he evolves into with an offense style built around him.

[Proudiddy]

yep, that is a huge part of it. Lots of NFL QBs see similar pressure.......and make plays. Since they know how to move in the pocket they pull plays off and therefore the OL doesn't get slammed as garbage.

poor QB play makes an OL look worse than it is. Carolina's OL ain't great but Clausen's decisions make the protection look worse than it is. Good QBs would have stepped up and made plays often when Jimmy scrambles for his life. Sure, sometimes Clausen is a dead duck in there.....but that happens to the other QBs as well.

Completely agreed. That's why I get so tired of the rookie argument. If, as fans, we are seeing this crap every week, he's got to see it too... And if he doesn't then he doesn't have a very bright future, which as it stands now, that's how it is looking. Bradford, McCoy, Skelton have all looked better in terms of fundamentals (and in Bradford and McCoy's cases better overall period), and they don't miss a beat. We were killing Skelton all day, yet look what he was doing at the end of the game today... He kept his eyes downfield and bought time.

I get so sick of seeing the same mistakes and problems from him and people pinning it on the coaches, OL, or being a rookie. It only works for so long... I looked up his stats prior to last week compared to Bradford and noticed Clausen is even below Sam Bradford in yards per attempt he's dead last in the league).

That says a lot about what he's doing considering this offense was designed for the passing game to provide an occasional big play/deep pass to compliment a pounding run game. Bradford's offense is designed for the short pass in a WCO style. And additionally, the advantage of the WCO Bradford is running is that it is efficient and offers higher completion %, but relies heavily on the QB to be accurate and the WRs to make plays after the catch. Bradford's whole WR Corps has been practice squad scrubs for most of the season, yet he's looked better.

Just saying, there's no excuse now. The average fan that plays Madden on a regular basis or that has studied books on coaching can pick up the stuff he's still failing at. It's just hard for me to fathom that he still hasn't improved on these things, and I have really been hoping he would.

[davos]

The Goodson-slot play with absolutely no one guarding him was quite possibly the most obvious problem in Clausen's better than usual game today. Two kids that were at the most 13 in my section were shouting at him being open, yet Clausen waited like 10 seconds then threw a terrible low ball somewhere in that direction. I'm trying to be patient with Pickles, but damn

[mick eye]

You know i was planning on starting a counter argument thread of the previous

"Who wants to defend Clausen now? named

"Who wants to badmouth and talk poo even after he plays decent? But honestly its the same old tired crowd.