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Those who want Cam Newton First overall...

Ricky Spanish

By Ricky Spanish,
in Carolina Panthers

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Mvp2014 Collaborator

Mvp2014

Posted
Posted

Now you are grasping at straws. Using that philosophy we must have been rebuilding as well since we went 8-8 last year before we went what will be 1-15 or 2-14 this year. The reality is that the year they went 4-12 was the last year under the old regime. They hire Mike Smith, bring in Ryan and in his first year they go 11-5. No need for sucking for years or stockpiling picks through the draft. Besides look at the bottom dwellers like Detroit and Buffalo for example. They have has high draft picks for years and still mostly suck. It isn't the draft picks with the exception of a franchise quarterback, it is the coach and his staff. In each case they are better more because they have a new coach and staff rather than just getting better draft picks.

We can do the same thing. Bring in a good coach, get our franchise quarterback and bring a few free agents and we can back in the mix in 2011. The whole "you got suck a few years and it is in our best interest to suck" is really a bogus argument.

Oh sorry, I guess I dont consider trading your 1st, 3rd, and 5th pick rebuilding when you do nothing in free agency and let the best player in the history of your club go in free agency. Its all dependent on if Luck comes out, what free agents we get, coaches, and so on, We'll see whos grasping for straws when Luck stays in school and we go 5-11 next year

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Rhys Newbie

Rhys

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You went a long way to prove nothing. [...]

With all that said Luck would be a great pick. But Newton won't be a bust unless he goes a team that doesn't develop him and work with him.

One could just as easily dissect your argument and declare it useless.

Florida had much better talent while The Golden Calf of Bristol was there versus the talent Auburn has this year.

Does Stanford have equal the talent of Auburn? Meaning you could use the same argument that Luck has done what he's done at Stanford with less talent than Newton has with Auburn.

Secondly The Golden Calf of Bristol was in that system for 3 years while this is the first for newton which makes a huge difference.

Newton was AT FLORIDA for two years, you think he learned nothing of the spread while he was there? Though you could consider it less, could he not derive any experience at QB from the year he spent at Blinn and the national title he took them to?

So you are comparing Tebows best season of the 3 against Newton's first year numbers and assuming that the talent between a very good Florida team and a very average Auburn team without Newton is equal.

Yet you compare Newton's JUNIOR season to Luck's FRESHMAN season. That's a perfectly equal comparison too. :rolleyes:

The fact that they have to load the box to stop Newton is a testament to his skill not a reason he is successful.

Something he won't face in the NFL with any consistency like he did in college. So how relevant is that?

Then you use Lucks numbers in a different system in a difference conference and assume you can make direct comparisons??? Not even close.

Show me the data that proves QBs coming out of the oh-so-powerful-god-like SEC do better than QBs coming out of other BCS conferences?

Newton picked things faster likely because a spread offense is easier to learn. Still it shows that he masters things easily

Again you assume that the time he spent in Florida learning under The Golden Calf of Bristol/Meyer is null.

The Manning Leaf debate happened over a decade ago and there have been multiple quarterbacks from the spread offense that have done very well in the NFL. Include Flacco' date=' Ryan, and Bradford in that mix. So the Ryan Leaf thing is old and tired and needs to be retired. [/quote']

That point is valid, not because of the spread vs pro-style, but because of the level of maturity/work ethic, a quality that transcends time in relevance.

Something I've been harping on for a while are the concerns about Newton's maturity given all that he has gone through at Florida and Auburn.

Before you declare someone's entire post as "nothing" why don't you actually think about what the guy is saying and not dissect the sh*t out of his argument to make it seem ridiculous.

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panthers55 Grand Master

panthers55

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Oh sorry, I guess I dont consider trading your 1st, 3rd, and 5th pick rebuilding when you do nothing in free agency and let the best player in the history of your club go in free agency. Its all dependent on if Luck comes out, what free agents we get, coaches, and so on, We'll see whos grasping for straws when Luck stays in school and we go 5-11 next year

As I said Atlanta rebuilt in a year and so can we. The old rebuilding takes years is crap. Stop while you are behind.

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panthers55 Grand Master

panthers55

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With that said, I understand some of the things you're saying P55, but Luck is the hands down consensus #1 pick amongst most ALL the NFL scouts and analysts for some reason.

First of all lets see how they feel after the combine and all the dog and pony shows. If they all still believe the Luck is hands down the best player, I would tend to feel like they are right. I don't think that you would go wrong with Luck. He seems to be a great draft choice.

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panthers55 Grand Master

panthers55

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One could just as easily dissect your argument and declare it useless.

You would be wrong but you can declare whatever you want

Does Stanford have equal the talent of Auburn? Meaning you could use the same argument that Luck has done what he's done at Stanford with less talent than Newton has with Auburn.

Actually Stanford has much better talent than Auburn. From running backs, to receivers to coaching, Stanford has much better personnel than Auburn. So you actually have it backwards.

Newton was AT FLORIDA for two years, you think he learned nothing of the spread while he was there? Though you could consider it less, could he not derive any experience at QB from the year he spent at Blinn and the national title he took them to?

And how many games did Newton start at Florida? Yeah that would be none. And you really think that the experience you get at a Juco college compares to being coached by an NFL quarterback/coach for 3 years??

You are going to hurt something stretching so far.

Yet you compare Newton's JUNIOR season to Luck's FRESHMAN season. That's a perfectly equal comparison too. :rolleyes:

I guess you don't know that Luck is a redshirt sophomore so he actually is a junior this year. So using your logic I am comparing his 2nd year in the system at Stanford to Newton who sat on the bench for 2 years for a different team in a different system and played at a junior college for a year in a different system against a much lower level of competition. So actually the comparison isn't fair. Luck's first year starting was actually the second year in the Stanford system while this was Newton's first year in Auburn's system. Newton looks even better with your criteria.

Show me the data that proves QBs coming out of the oh-so-powerful-god-like SEC do better than QBs coming out of other BCS conferences?

How is that relevant at all. I don't think we were discussing which conference produces the best quarterbacks. Seems you are just introducing a bunny trail here.

Again you assume that the time he spent in Florida learning under The Golden Calf of Bristol/Meyer is null.

Don't see how sitting on the bench watching a quarterback play in one system helps you very much when you come into a different system and have to start. You think all spread offenses are the same? You think that because Pike sat all year in Carolina he would have an advantage if he were traded to Cleveland for example and started for them?? Stupid comparison.

Something I've been harping on for a while are the concerns about Newton's maturity given all that he has gone through at Florida and Auburn.

And what evidence or information have you found to suggest that he is more or less mature due to his experiences in the past. Do you think that because he made mistakes 2 or 3 years ago that he is the same person he was then, or do you think that he has matured and grown over the past three years?? Most people find that trials and tribulations are more likely to build character than someone who never has adversity or problems.

Before you declare someone's entire post as "nothing" why don't you actually think about what the guy is saying and not dissect the sh*t out of his argument to make it seem ridiculous.

So by dissecting the poo out of my post are you:

A. supposedly showing me how it feels.

B. doing the same thing so you are the pot calling the kettle black

C: or showing that you know little more than the person you are supposedly defending??

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Cavscout Proficient

Cavscout

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With that said, I understand some of the things you're saying P55, but Luck is the hands down consensus #1 pick amongst most ALL the NFL scouts and analysts for some reason.

That would be because he is only the best pro-prospect to (hopefully) come out of school in 10 years. Cam is Akili Smith v.II

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