Anyone Still Want to Defend Clausen?

[Urrymonster]

I'm not trying to rip the guy apart limb from limb, I'm just asking, "who can defend" him now? As in, reasoning for him to be the starting QB of the future. No one can (or at least should, as many are still making excuses).

Ok well here goes (flame suit on)

The first half was actually pretty good. A couple of bobbled snaps, but he bounced right back the following series and led another good drive which resulted in a touchdown.

That first he looked like a genuine starting quality QB. Combine that with the progression he showed in the TB & CLE games and he was looking like he had turned a corner.

I honestly feel the whole momentum of the game changed and it wasn't just Clausen that struggled.

* Seattle effortlessly marched down the field to cut the score

* On third and 1, our OC calls a ridiculous play and our QB makes a poor throw leading to a pick 6

* We go conservative play calling, forcing a punt which is returned by Seattle for (effectively) a TD

* Jimmy is then sacked twice in 4 pass plays ending two drives

Between the start of the 3rd and our final drive our running game managed 3.5 yards per carry, mainly because of how superhuman Stew was being as he was almost always hit in the backfield.

Despite this he then pulls himself together and actually leads a good final drive which deserved a TD.

I was as depressed as the rest of us at the time and there were some real rookie moments from him, but what rookie QB could withstand that 3rd quarter?! Opponents put up 21 points in 9 minutes whilst he and the running backs are getting hit in the backfield every single snap.

Looking back, the worst thing he did (obviously) was the Pick 6, but after that the team crumbled round him on every level.

I do not think things were 'as bad' for Clausen, more it was the whole team that failed. So considering the progress shown up until that half, there is reason to pause before putting him out with the trash. Am I confident with him? No, but there have been signs he is getting it. Was the Seattle game bad? Yes and no, as no rookie could have carried that team with everything that was going wrong. Do I think we draft Luck if he comes out? Yes, I would endorse it as people state Clausen does not have the investment. Am I secretly hoping Clausen can build on what he has done well and allow us to address other areas? Yes.

[Jhyler12]

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ycn-7343604

[Proudiddy]

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ycn-7343604

We won't see Pike until next year, besides in street clothes. He's on IR.

[panthers55]

Ok well here goes (flame suit on)

The first half was actually pretty good. A couple of bobbled snaps, but he bounced right back the following series and led another good drive which resulted in a touchdown.

That first he looked like a genuine starting quality QB. Combine that with the progression he showed in the TB & CLE games and he was looking like he had turned a corner.

I honestly feel the whole momentum of the game changed and it wasn't just Clausen that struggled.

* Seattle effortlessly marched down the field to cut the score

* On third and 1, our OC calls a ridiculous play and our QB makes a poor throw leading to a pick 6

* We go conservative play calling, forcing a punt which is returned by Seattle for (effectively) a TD

* Jimmy is then sacked twice in 4 pass plays ending two drives

Between the start of the 3rd and our final drive our running game managed 3.5 yards per carry, mainly because of how superhuman Stew was being as he was almost always hit in the backfield.

Despite this he then pulls himself together and actually leads a good final drive which deserved a TD.

I was as depressed as the rest of us at the time and there were some real rookie moments from him, but what rookie QB could withstand that 3rd quarter?! Opponents put up 21 points in 9 minutes whilst he and the running backs are getting hit in the backfield every single snap.

Looking back, the worst thing he did (obviously) was the Pick 6, but after that the team crumbled round him on every level.

I do not think things were 'as bad' for Clausen, more it was the whole team that failed. So considering the progress shown up until that half, there is reason to pause before putting him out with the trash. Am I confident with him? No, but there have been signs he is getting it. Was the Seattle game bad? Yes and no, as no rookie could have carried that team with everything that was going wrong. Do I think we draft Luck if he comes out? Yes, I would endorse it as people state Clausen does not have the investment. Am I secretly hoping Clausen can build on what he has done well and allow us to address other areas? Yes.

I don't think there is any need for flaming you, the reality is that Clausen started off the game well. He had the majority of his yards by halftime and a 14 point lead. And the drive in the second period was an 80 yards drive including a long pass to Smith. Things people have wanted to see.

He made some bonehead plays in the first half like the fumbled snap at the Seattle 36 which took us out of field goal range, and that throwback pass over the middle was a pick waiting to happen. But they were rookie mistakes.

But the second half he was rattled and it wasn't just the playcalling. The Seattle defense ratcheted the pressure and Jimmy fell apart like he does whenever he is under pressure. The pick 6 was just a poor decision when he was feeling pressured. In fact he almost did that another time or two on screen passes.

One of the things folks have said about in the preseason and while at Notre Dame is that he is good under pressure and has good intangibles. Those are the things right now he is seriously lacking. And that is concerning to me. It is one thing to be under pressure and make a rookie mistake. It is quite another to make constant mistakes and toss the ball away repeatedly when ever pressure it applied. Like others have said, I haven't seen him step up in the pocket and hang in there to make a throw. That has been disappointing for me. If he were making mistakes but was able to still move the ball in the second half I would be fine. Right now though it doesn't look good. I don't think the game has slowed down for him not do I think he can step up when the team demands it of him.

He looks alot like David Carr to me.

[rayzor]

To me, taking a risk on a #1 "Sure Thing" draft pick (per every analyst in the world) like Luck who could potentially turn out to be a bust is a no brainer.

5 years down the road it would be a hell of a lot better looking at a #1 overall pick who didn't pan out than sitting here watching the guy you could have taken, but instead passed on because of Clausen, make Pro Bowls in San Fran or Buffalo or where ever.

The downside of not drafting him (or Newton) far outweighs any perceived downside of drafting him.

people are afraid of failure, so they don't even want to try to do something that might put this team on top.

[Urrymonster]

The Seattle defense ratcheted the pressure and Jimmy fell apart like he does whenever he is under pressure. The pick 6 was just a poor decision when he was feeling pressured. In fact he almost did that another time or two on screen passes.

One of the things folks have said about in the preseason and while at Notre Dame is that he is good under pressure and has good intangibles. Those are the things right now he is seriously lacking. And that is concerning to me. It is one thing to be under pressure and make a rookie mistake. It is quite another to make constant mistakes and toss the ball away repeatedly when ever pressure it applied. Like others have said, I haven't seen him step up in the pocket and hang in there to make a throw. That has been disappointing for me. If he were making mistakes but was able to still move the ball in the second half I would be fine. Right now though it doesn't look good. I don't think the game has slowed down for him not do I think he can step up when the team demands it of him.

Yeah you are pretty much spot on with what I think as well. I just wanted to play devil's advocate for a moment and point out it was one pick six and two stalled drives (where he got sacked once in each) where we struggled and SEA scored 4 TDs around those three drives.

At the end of the day Clausen was responsible for one of those TDs and yet people are wanting to blame him for everything.

I am concerned about his lack of stepping into the pocket, however when we give him 3 & 5 step drops he generally fairs fine (Smitty throw). When we give him the deeper drop backs and he sees the DEs tearing round the outside he does panic and makes awful decisions. The thing is that is something that is very coach-able and experience with how to deal with pressure is something QBs (generally) get better with. It's if they start getting jittery on the shorter drop backs that there is a problem (after the first big sack he was jittery the following drive and walked into another sack), so far this is something he does but not on a high frequency.

He does throw the ball away a lot and is making rookie mistakes. He and Alex Smith are miles ahead of the rest, but mostly I have seen him throw away when under pressure. Right now, in his rookie year I would rather he did that than cause turnover after turnover, because his confidence might not recover that. However in the second half we had two three and outs, one ultra conservative drive after the pick 6 and a drive that took us all the way down the field. During that struggling period we passed and ran at a 1:1 ratio and could manage only 3.5 yards a carry, he wasn;t the root cause of the problem our entire team poo the bed.

I am unsure on the intangibles you mention as there are times where he looks like he is fired up and trying to get the team going (when on the field and pre-snap) and judging by Sutton's comments the players also support him.

I am still rooting for him to be THE guy, I do not really want to burn two of our top picks in consecutive drafts. If Luck doesn't come out then I definitely want us to focus on other areas, as the other QBs seem to possess the same amount of potential he had in college.

[MadHatter]

Yeah you are pretty much spot on with what I think as well. I just wanted to play devil's advocate for a moment and point out it was one pick six and two stalled drives (where he got sacked once in each) where we struggled and SEA scored 4 TDs around those three drives.

At the end of the day Clausen was responsible for one of those TDs and yet people are wanting to blame him for everything.

I am concerned about his lack of stepping into the pocket, however when we give him 3 & 5 step drops he generally fairs fine (Smitty throw). When we give him the deeper drop backs and he sees the DEs tearing round the outside he does panic and makes awful decisions. The thing is that is something that is very coach-able and experience with how to deal with pressure is something QBs (generally) get better with. It's if they start getting jittery on the shorter drop backs that there is a problem (after the first big sack he was jittery the following drive and walked into another sack), so far this is something he does but not on a high frequency.

He does throw the ball away a lot and is making rookie mistakes. He and Alex Smith are miles ahead of the rest, but mostly I have seen him throw away when under pressure. Right now, in his rookie year I would rather he did that than cause turnover after turnover, because his confidence might not recover that. However in the second half we had two three and outs, one ultra conservative drive after the pick 6 and a drive that took us all the way down the field. During that struggling period we passed and ran at a 1:1 ratio and could manage only 3.5 yards a carry, he wasn;t the root cause of the problem our entire team poo the bed.

I am unsure on the intangibles you mention as there are times where he looks like he is fired up and trying to get the team going (when on the field and pre-snap) and judging by Sutton's comments the players also support him.

I am still rooting for him to be THE guy, I do not really want to burn two of our top picks in consecutive drafts. If Luck doesn't come out then I definitely want us to focus on other areas, as the other QBs seem to possess the same amount of potential he had in college.

I agree with you that if Luck does not come out, I would prefer not to go QB with our #1 pick.

Mallett, Newton (reminds me of Russel), etc. do not look much better than the option of Clausen. I would rather pick up a veteran and let Jimmy develop a little more.

Without Luck, I would love to go OL, DT, or even CB in the first round. I just don't see a player at any of those positions (save maybe Petterson) that is worth a top pick.

Without Luck, the top of this draft is pretty spotty.

[CRA]

I agree with you that if Luck does not come out, I would prefer not to go QB with our #1 pick.

Mallett, Newton (reminds me of Russel), etc. do not look much better than the option of Clausen. I would rather pick up a veteran and let Jimmy develop a little more.

Without Luck, I would love to go OL, DT, or even CB in the first round. I just don't see a player at any of those positions (save maybe Petterson) that is worth a top pick.

Without Luck, the top of this draft is pretty spotty.

yep, if Luck doesn't come out we trade down. Only kid at the top I like that isn't a QB is Bowers (DE)....and we need a DT more.

[MadHatter]

yep, if Luck doesn't come out we trade down. Only kid at the top I like that isn't a QB is Bowers (DE)....and we need a DT more.

I am not sure that trading down (and getting much) will be a real option. You have to find someone willing to trade up. With the players available, that may prove to be impossible.

[panthers55]

I think right now there are 4 quarterbacks who could be good this year. Luck, Locker, Mallett, and Newton. Obviously Luck is number 1 but I think that Newton is a close second. I know people will think Vince Young and Jamarcus Russell, but honestly I don't think they are similar. Vince Young is extremely fragile which Newton isn't or he would never rebounded from the Florida issues. Plus unlike Russell his work ethic and effort haven't been in question that I have heard.

In fact I think that Newton could be the best quarterback in the draft for a team wanting to run a run heavy offense perhaps with a number of spread features.

If we go with Grimm for example instead of Harbaugh, Newton could be much better in that offense just like Roethlisburger seems to be a much better option for Pitsburgh compared to a Brees for example.

I am sure that scouts and folks will dissect these guys ad nauseum over the next 4-5 months, but honestly Newton seems to be the real deal. If he can pick up the nuances of a pro-offense I think he could be a great franchise quarterback for folks.

Compared to Clausen there is no comparison. Newton puts pressure on a defense unlike Clausen or a guy with limited mobility. Plus Newton seems to thrive and get better under pressure not fall apart.

[mav1234]

meh, I have a ton of questions about Newton but I'd much prefer him to Mallett. Locker was someone everyone loved last year and now nobody likes... I wouldn't be surprised if he was a major sleeper and really paid off big for someone down the draft a bit.

A lot depends on how things play out between now and draft day, but I would be pretty happy overall if we got Newton... because you can't really draft any other player and expect the offense to change as much as it probably would with him.

My concerns with Newton relate to how well he can throw it in the NFL when the speed and strength of defenses will limit his scrambling, but man can he light it up in college... easily one of the most fun players to watch...

[rayzor]

meh, I have a ton of questions about Newton but I'd much prefer him to Mallett. Locker was someone everyone loved last year and now nobody likes... I wouldn't be surprised if he was a major sleeper and really paid off big for someone down the draft a bit.

A lot depends on how things play out between now and draft day, but I would be pretty happy overall if we got Newton... because you can't really draft any other player and expect the offense to change as much as it probably would with him.

My concerns with Newton relate to how well he can throw it in the NFL when the speed and strength of defenses will limit his scrambling, but man can he light it up in college... easily one of the most fun players to watch...

newton has no problem throwing it. he's got a good and very accurate arm and he's got some really good decision making skills. his passing game is really underrated.

[panthers55]

meh, I have a ton of questions about Newton but I'd much prefer him to Mallett. Locker was someone everyone loved last year and now nobody likes... I wouldn't be surprised if he was a major sleeper and really paid off big for someone down the draft a bit.

A lot depends on how things play out between now and draft day, but I would be pretty happy overall if we got Newton... because you can't really draft any other player and expect the offense to change as much as it probably would with him.

My concerns with Newton relate to how well he can throw it in the NFL when the speed and strength of defenses will limit his scrambling, but man can he light it up in college... easily one of the most fun players to watch...

I have watched him several times this year and have become more impressed with every outing. I wasn't a big fan at the beginning of the year but he can do things no one else in football can do. I saw him elude a full out blitz and flick the ball 40-50 yards down field and hit a receiver in stride for a TD. What was amazing is that he made it look routine with little to no effort. If it is shown that his football IQ and work ethic is close to his athleticism, he may be the best guy in the draft bar none.

[Kurb]

newton has no problem throwing it. he's got a good and very accurate arm and he's got some really good decision making skills. his passing game is really underrated.

It also helps he has 8-9 in the box when he passes

That said the kid is the second best long term prospect in my mind.