My Last Clausen thread this season

[Highlandfire]

OK, I hate ND with a passion, and even I think he should get enough chance before one declare him a bust. Now am I saying if the Panthers win the #1 overall pick, they shouldn't pick Luck? Absolutely not....he should be picked without any hesitation. You don't ignore someone with that kind of potential unless you already have a great qb with the caliber of Peyton Manning, Drew Brees, Philip Rivers.

there is no way in hell you pass on Luck if you have the #1 pick just to give Clausen a 'chance'. That one screw up will set your franchise back a decade.

Clausen has shown NO decision making abillity at all. He doesn't have that strong of an arm and his attempts at leadership sucks ass. Bradford walked in and took over that team and look at how they are progressing. There is a reason Bradford went #1 and clausen fell way down into the 2nd round.

[Highlandfire]

Too bad the protection tends to fall apart once they pass 3.5 yards.

I'm starting to wonder how many fans watch football, and how many keep their eyes glued to the football :/

For the life of me I cannot comprehend how threads like this are still emerging. Clausen is our QB until the end of the season. No amount of bitching on the internet is going to change that. If he ends up being hot trash, then Luck will get scooped with the #1 pick, it's that simple. If he starts to shimmer and shine, then guess what? The team might not be in a position to draft him.

That is what boggles my mind. People are actually upset at the possibility of Clausen developing and leading this team to a W or two before the end of the year and essentially saving his job. Just a month ago, the consensus was that a DT needed to be taken in the 1st. I'll wait until next month to see what the new hot commodity is.

I'm fully aware of all the excitement around him (a lot of it deservedly so too), but people need to process that hype =/= reality, college =/= pro, and what you see =/= what you get. This in no way, shape, or form is saying that Luck will not live up to expectations. Personally, I have stated that if we get Luck I will be more than excited. However, if Jimmy ends up developing, then I'm fine with whatever direction the team decides to go instead.

tldr; The team doesn't have Luck yet. They're working with what they have, get over it. Hopefully they'll be able to draft him if they continue to lose, but if they win, then it shows we can address other needs.

I really, really hope Luck ends up being lights out. Otherwise, a vast majority of the posters here are going to feel like I did when I said that I thought Jacoby Ford was never going to amount to anything in the NFL (thought he was too fast while too small and had durability issues).

Then again, most people are ignorant and refused to be held accountable, so meh.

Actually some of us who really understand football have have watched it for 35+ years and have coached it can tell Clausen will NEVER be a probowl/ Superbowl winning QB. he just doesn't have it. Never has, never will. Had he not been part of the hyped up media machine that is ND he wouldn't have even been on anyone's radar till about the 5th round this last year.

The kid just doesn't have it, and many of us fans don't want to sit here and waste another year or two just to make sure of what we already know. What gets me is fans who want to cling to average players hoping they become stars when most of us know it isn't going to happen.

And what happens 3 years from now when this team still sucks because we never addressed the QB position with a top talent when we had a top pick to do so? People like you will say 'oh well we had to find out if clausen had it or not' All the while you will be bitching that Richardson never does anything to improve this team.

Bottom line this is a purely QB driven league, no getting around it. the NFL has pussified the game so much that if you don't have a Great QB and throw like an arena team you won't win a superbowl, and isnt that the goal? Winning the superbowl? So cut the BS already, take the #1 pick and address it with a top 1st round quality talent at QB and then fill in around him.

[CRA]

Well this year that is a complete myth.

Moore completed just 2 more passes above 20 yards

Clausen has 18.5% of his throws aimed between 10-19 yards, Moore 18.3%

Clausen has thrown 19.2% of his throws behind the LoS, Moore 19.1%

Face it, Moore and Clausen have played in an almost IDENTICAL way. Sure Clausen has thrown more longer passes in the 4th, but that just means Moore was throwing short when we needed to be more urgent.

Yes Moore had thrown for 5 TDs, he also threw for 10 interceptions.

How anyone can think that the problem is NOT the playcalling is just nuts.

Moore may just have 2 more completions above 20 yards.....

Moore also has less pass attempts (about a games worth) and a better completion percentage.

Also, it should be worth noting how many of Moore's long throws were in competitive games vs. late in the 4th quarter when teams are playing prevent football.

64% of Moore's throws were between 0-10 yards downfield.

77% of Clausen's throws are betwen 0-10 yards downfield.

the bolded is a pretty big difference for a QB.

[Urrymonster]

Moore may just have 2 more completions above 20 yards.....

Moore also has less pass attempts (about a games worth) and a better completion percentage.

Also, it should be worth noting how many of Moore's long throws were in competitive games vs. late in the 4th quarter when teams are playing prevent football.

64% of Moore's throws were between 0-10 yards downfield.

77% of Clausen's throws are betwen 0-10 yards downfield.

the bolded is a pretty big difference for a QB.

Yeah very true.

Part of me wants to analyse how we are in line with teams of similar philosophy, but I am not sure if that is a realistic possibility.

I am still of the opinion that our playcalling is hurting us to some level and our refusal to use the TE in the passing game as a genuine threat. As noted Moore's numbers this season and last have changed dramatically, so there has to be a particular reason. Possibly with young receivers they are bringing them on slowly?

Think I am going to look into a lot of this and see what I can dig up.

[panther4life]

Davidson is just calling games the way Fox wants.

Moore will be a scapegoat. Just like Jake was to a large degree degree last year. They opt away from the run and go pass heavy on a team built to run.. The outcome is only a surprise to the Carolina coaches. That is why Richardson told Fox he could leave and is letting him go.

Carolina is no different than last year. Good team. Probably a playoff team based on the roster. HORRIBLE coaching. One that doesn't use the right playcalling based on his roster or even manage the depth chart correctly.

after giants game

1. Charles Godfrey. He sucks. He has sucked consitantly for 2 years and now entering his 3rd. His forced fumbles that everyone hyped last year doesn't mean he knows how to play the position. He has proven going into this 3rd year he is NOT an NFL S.

Solution. Martin and Pugh.

2. Playing calling. Fox and Davidson are horrible. Fans can blame Moore or they can blame Delhomme for last year. Bottom line is you know what you have. We opted not to use Double Trouble often last year and opted for Delhomme......and we paid the price. How many rush attempts did we have the 2nd half??????????? We were down by a score or were sitting in scoring position where the run was logical and was still the obvious choice.

Solution. Run the ball. That is what you do.

3. No receiving option outside of Smitty. It has been a constant problem. Note on some of the Moore picks who the reciving options were........Smitty wasn't even on the field for some of those play calls. . Passing with only Lafell and Gary as your receving options? Yeah, that is simply putting Moore in horrfic scenarios. Not a surprise that bad results occur.

Solution. Bash Jarrett all you want but that ignores the real problem. You want to know why Jarrett sucks? Fox doesn't play him. Why didn't he start? LaFell can't catch. Jarrett is a good WR with decent protection.....always has been and is the same guy we saw at USC. Fox plays the guys he likes.....he is blind to the obvious. That has been proven time and after time after time....

Bottom line is....as bad as we may feel......The D still shows promise. This team isn't bad. The management is bad and offensively the choices made on the sidelines are bad (both play calling and management of the roster). This is a good roster......if you want to know what Jerry tried to let Fox go find a new job this offseaosn and is going to fire him....you should know the answer if you watched the game.

Blackout next week. Jerry, I don't bash you for prepping for the lockout. I bash you for keeping Fox this season. I know Jerry doesn't care what I think b/c of so many fans are still willing to pump money into is pocket...........but THIS guy won't be buying tickets and sending money your way. Fox is a bad coach in today's NFL. Doesn't matter what his "stats" say.....you have proven by your actions you are aware of that and you opted to keep him.

after giants game

While I'm thinking of it, another issue arising from week one.

The offense definitely had protection issues last week, especially in the second half. And with the starting right tackle down, that's likely to continue. So one of the big questions that needs to be answered this week will be how to prevent that particular disaster from happening again.

One solution is to go "max protect", which means keeping backs and tight ends in for extra blocking. The positive? More blockers to keep the QB upright and give him time to make a good decision. The downside? It means fewer receiving options.

Now, if the defense blitzes, you have extra people to pick it up and not as many defenders back in protection, so that's good. But if they only rush four, you wind up with two - maybe three - receivers trying to find an opening between seven defenders. Combine that with a receiving corps that isn't exactly keeping DCs awake at night, and it's a recipe for a coverage sack or a bad QB decision.

For this to work properly, you need the "extra blockers" to be smart and know when to release and run a short route rather than stay in when they aren't needed. You might only wind up with a modest gain in that scenario (unless someone breaks something) but still, that's better than a sack, an incomplete or a pick.

The flipside? Send a good number of receiving options out there so that even if the prime guys are covered, the QB has an option. And of course, designate a "hot read' for when there's a jailbreak.

Also good in theory, but you still need at least half-decent protection from the line for this to work, and at the moment it's a big question as to whether we have that. You also need for the QB to be able to make quick decisions, something Moore did well in prior starts, but not so well last week. Throw in that your execution needs to be crisp for this to be effective, and "crisp' wasn't exactly a word I would have used for the offensive execution last week. And again, the quality of the receivers is a factor.Bottom Line: Winning the war in the trenches is vital, as is having a QB who can get the ball out without too much hesitation (something Scherer emphasizes).

But knowing that we didn't see either of those things happen in week one, looking at the pros and cons of "more blockers" vs "more receivers" and bearing in mind that the opponent this week is different, which approach is the wise one for week two?

couple of samplings of excuses by CRA passing the blame game on anyone but Matt Moore.Now that Jimmy is in he's the only one to blame.

and then theres the explanation from Mr. Scott which explains why he has to check down.

[CRA]

couple of samplings of excuses by CRA passing the blame game on anyone but Matt Moore.Now that Jimmy is in he's the only one to blame.

.

not sure what the point is of that post.

there are other problems in Carolina besides QB play. QB play is just a big problem. The other problems don't excuse Moore (and once he put in more consistant poor play I was more critical of him) or Clausen from everything wrong they do (or did in Moore's case).

week 1 - Moore had a resume that contradicted what we saw that week. Fox/Davidson were always issues in Carolina. There were lots of things wrong w/ week 1 besides the QB's performance. Fox admitted to going pass heavy to catch a team "off guard". Didn't run w/ multiple chances in the redzone. Attacked downfield when the only WR on the field was a rookie (a rookie playing in his first NFL game that was a road game in NY). Moore went backwards and we later saw that. Blame anyone but Moore? There are several posts from this week by me where I was critical of what Moore did this season. Week 1? After that game there was no way to predict he was a different QB....and he was this year.

What does any of that have to do w/ how bad Jimmy is playing CURRENTLY? I mean, if you are going back to find week 1 comments about Moore......what is the point in regards to what is being discussed in this thread? I mean, that is your Jimmy defense? Week 1 comments about Moore?

[frash.exe]

Moore may just have 2 more completions above 20 yards.....

Moore also has less pass attempts (about a games worth) and a better completion percentage.

Also, it should be worth noting how many of Moore's long throws were in competitive games vs. late in the 4th quarter when teams are playing prevent football.

64% of Moore's throws were between 0-10 yards downfield.

77% of Clausen's throws are betwen 0-10 yards downfield.

the bolded is a pretty big difference for a QB.

yea but the other 36% of Moore's throws were between the 3rd and 18th rows

[pantherclaw]

one thing i want to get an answer on is this. what does andrew luck have right now that jimmy clausen didn't have coming out of college?

jimmy was an underclassmen that had two years of lights out college football in terms of statistics and a ton of hype entering the draft. just like andrew luck. both are lauded for their accuracy and neither have elite arm strength. both have been criticized for not progressing through their reads and scanning the entire field.

all the people that want to talk about jimmy being just a "hype machine" is making me laugh because andrew luck has yet to play a single snap in the NFL and suddenly he's the savior of the franchise.

i'm going to lay it out like this. i was dismayed probably more than anyone here when he drafted clausen. i watch ND football pretty regularly and was never sold on jimmy being a pro QB. just like i'm not sold on luck (i don't think he even declares this year). but i'm not going to just sell him down the river and not give him a chance to develop. he's a rookie and not every rookie looks awesome right out of college.

right now we have a lot more pressing needs. in the trenches we're god awful. on the offensive line right now we don't have a RG and we may not have a RT since otah can't ever seem to stay healthy. travelle wharton is 29 years old and isn't consistent. jordan gross is 30 and we all see how well he's played this year. we still have yet to get a proven second WR to compliment (hell at this point this WR is going to replace) steve smith. on defense we have no push up the middle and we are going to start severely lacking depth at corner.

with all these problems on the team, is one player ever going to make that much of a difference? do you think another rookie underclassmen with a lot of hype is going to do any better? with no 2nd round pick, can we really afford gambling with our picks?

100% agree. With the greater needs, and that Luck is another hype machine. Yes, he may end up living up to it, but he also may not.

We can use some serious help along the trenches. Won't matter who is at QB if the line doesn't block better.

[pantherclaw]

Clausen has poise. He's even takes care of the ball. (throwing it away instead of taking a sack, etc, etc). He does have decent arm strength.

He DOESN'T trust his receivers. If he did, he'd throw the ball up, and let our receivers go get it. You can't sit back and play small ball, and expect to make it as a NFL starter QB. Just ain't going to happen.

Man up, trust your receivers, or admit it ya can't, and let someone else do it.