Troy Smith

[kdrh5]

Try again, Cottard

Vick has the fewest completions, fewest attempts, is 16th in sacks taken, 20th in completion percentage and would be last in first downs but for one guy - Jimmy Clausen.

If you want to judge purely on passer rating though, then here are some things you'd also have to believe:

- The second best passer in the league is David Garrard (at 104.9, only 0.4 behind Vick)

- Kyle Orton, Tony Romo and Matt Cassel are all better than Peyton Manning and Drew Brees

- Ryan Fitzpatrick - ranked 19th at 85.5 - is a better passer than Donovan McNabb - ranked 28th at 76.0

- McNabb is one of the worst QBs in the league, better only than Hasselbeck, Alex Smith, Favre, Derek Anderson, Moore and Clausen

You willing to stand by all of those things?

Freeman's stats are twice (or nearly twice) Vick's in attempts, completions, yards, first downs and touchdowns. Add in that Freeman doesn't play in a stat-friendly WCO and doesn't have a receiving corps anywhere close to what Vick has. Flip-flop those receiving corps and you'd see an even bigger stat gap than you see now. And throw in, as Ron Jaworski pointed out, that Vick has a schedule loaded with some of the worst pass defenses in the league.

Vick isn't half the passer Freeman is. Give any ten GMs the choice between the two and I'd be willing to bet the vast majority - and maybe even all of them - would take Freeman.

But I guess Freeman just isn't thug enough for you to be a fan of his

Theres a ton of stats mixed with an awful lot of assumptions in this post. Obviously Freeman is a gifted player and would be a monster with the weapons Vick has. But this year Vick is in a system that plays to his strengths, which isnt exactly his fault nor should he apologize for it, gets the ball to his playmakers, keeps drives alive with his legs, takes care of the football, and so far, is winning the games on his schedule...what more can you ask for? Or do you and King T have some sort of black-QB-internet-feud going on that'll never be resolved

[Falcons1stPanthers2nd]

Where's your thread on Colt McCoy KT?

[Jhyler12]

We shoulda signed him in the off-season.

Agreed... But we should have signed anyone in the off-season!

[davos]

Try again, Cottard

Vick has the fewest completions, fewest attempts, is 16th in sacks taken, 20th in completion percentage and would be last in first downs but for one guy - Jimmy Clausen.

If you want to judge purely on passer rating though, then here are some things you'd also have to believe:

- The second best passer in the league is David Garrard (at 104.9, only 0.4 behind Vick)

- Kyle Orton, Tony Romo and Matt Cassel are all better than Peyton Manning and Drew Brees

- Ryan Fitzpatrick - ranked 19th at 85.5 - is a better passer than Donovan McNabb - ranked 28th at 76.0

- McNabb is one of the worst QBs in the league, better only than Hasselbeck, Alex Smith, Favre, Derek Anderson, Moore and Clausen

You willing to stand by all of those things?

Freeman's stats are twice (or nearly twice) Vick's in attempts, completions, yards, first downs and touchdowns. Add in that Freeman doesn't play in a stat-friendly WCO and doesn't have a receiving corps anywhere close to what Vick has. Flip-flop those receiving corps and you'd see an even bigger stat gap than you see now. And throw in, as Ron Jaworski pointed out, that Vick has a schedule loaded with some of the worst pass defenses in the league.

Vick isn't half the passer Freeman is. Give any ten GMs the choice between the two and I'd be willing to bet the vast majority - and maybe even all of them - would take Freeman.

But I guess Freeman just isn't thug enough for you to be a fan of his

I never thought I would be in this much disagreement with a Scot post....

Sorry Mr Scot., but I gotta say Vick is currently the most dangerous QB in the league right now. Freeman is a great asset to the Bucs but he has a lot of room to grow. Vick has finally, after all of these years, bloomed into a very accurate & smart passer. Being an older Hokie it is incredible to watch how much he has progressed since college (how he sets up in the pocket and protects the football when he decides to run).

I try not to look at the out-of-NFL years for the off-topic rhetoric case and honestly I gotta agree with that crazy sumbich KT on this one. Freeman is young and can potentially be a top QB in the league, but you cannot in the slightest compare him to Vick right now. I'm not even talking statistically, look at their in game decision making and tell me Freeman is better. I just don't see where you're coming from.

[jramsey4]

We should have picked up Smith when the ravens released him. To go into the season with the QB's we did was idiotic.

[Davidson Deac II]

Try again, Cottard

Vick has the fewest completions, fewest attempts, is 16th in sacks taken, 20th in completion percentage and would be last in first downs but for one guy - Jimmy Clausen.

If you want to judge purely on passer rating though, then here are some things you'd also have to believe:

- The second best passer in the league is David Garrard (at 104.9, only 0.4 behind Vick)

- Kyle Orton, Tony Romo and Matt Cassel are all better than Peyton Manning and Drew Brees

- Ryan Fitzpatrick - ranked 19th at 85.5 - is a better passer than Donovan McNabb - ranked 28th at 76.0

- McNabb is one of the worst QBs in the league, better only than Hasselbeck, Alex Smith, Favre, Derek Anderson, Moore and Clausen

You willing to stand by all of those things?

Freeman's stats are twice (or nearly twice) Vick's in attempts, completions, yards, first downs and touchdowns. Add in that Freeman doesn't play in a stat-friendly WCO and doesn't have a receiving corps anywhere close to what Vick has. Flip-flop those receiving corps and you'd see an even bigger stat gap than you see now. And throw in, as Ron Jaworski pointed out, that Vick has a schedule loaded with some of the worst pass defenses in the league.

Vick isn't half the passer Freeman is. Give any ten GMs the choice between the two and I'd be willing to bet the vast majority - and maybe even all of them - would take Freeman.

But I guess Freeman just isn't thug enough for you to be a fan of his

I generally like what you say, but I gotta think you are wrong on this one. Freeman has shown some solid potential, but if any owners take him over Vick, its only because of the prison thing, not due to performance on the field. Vick has performed magnificiently this year, so much so that he doesn't even look like the same QB that played for Atlanta. If he can stay healthy, then I think Philly is a legit Superbowl threat. Freeman has played well, but still has a ways to go.

[TheRealDeal]

I noticed people are disagreeing with Mr. Scot, which I do NOT, but they don't have any solid evidence to back it up, just saying that Vick is explosive, Vick is better than Atlanta, etc.

Vick did not beat Manning, they don't play head to head, he beat the Colts.

We give Vick a pass because he was hurt but that comes with the territory when you play his style of football. The bigger Freeman is at less of a risk for injury which you have to consider.

I think when you get past the "Ooooh...Ahhhhhh" of Vick you will see that Freeman is having a better year against better competition with far less weapons than Vick and is only getting better.

Vick will have a better test this week. Let's see how he does.

[King Taharqa]

Vick did not beat Manning, they don't play head to head, he beat the Colts.

He outplayed Manning and looked like the best QB on the field that day. I have no doubt had the Colts and Manning won, folks like Mr.Scot would use that as an argument against Vick. Prior to that game, the knock was, Vick aint played nobody. A loss there, and Scot wouldve given us paragraphs how the celebrating of Vick was premature and that he's no Manning. Well, Vick outplays him on national TV and its "crickets". LOL. That game thread sunk so fast off this page it wasnt even funny.

We give Vick a pass because he was hurt but that comes with the territory when you play his style of football. The bigger Freeman is at less of a risk for injury which you have to consider.

I think when you get past the "Ooooh...Ahhhhhh" of Vick you will see that Freeman is having a better year against better competition with far less weapons than Vick and is only getting better.

Vick will have a better test this week. Let's see how he does.

Men lie, women lie, numbers dont. No QB is playing better than Vick right now or put up a performance as good as he did on MNF. I will agree with Mr. Scot on one thing, Freeman is playing better than Brees, Manning, and Brady this season, and deserves props as as an "elite" QB.

[Kevin Greene]

Fact is Vick beat Manning. Can't dispute that.

And after Monday Night's performance, everyone better wait and see.

Giants/Eagles Sunday night should be a great game and will go a long way toward sorting things out in the NFC East.

Can't wait.

[King Taharqa]

Fact is Vick beat Manning. Can't dispute that.

And after Monday Night's performance, everyone better wait and see.

Giants/Eagles Sunday night should be a great game and will go a long way toward sorting things out in the NFC East.

Can't wait.

I told my Eagles buddies today at work, those 2 games against the Giants are bigger than any game they've played this year. Those 2 games will decide who wins the division and who's a wild card.

[Kevin Greene]

I told my Eagles buddies today at work, those 2 games against the Giants are bigger than any game they've played this year. Those 2 games will decide who wins the division and who's a wild card.

My golf buddie is a Giant fan, haven't decided if I'm chearing with him or against him Sunday night.

Giant pass rush versus Vick will be a great chess match.

NBC has to be doing cart wheels.

[kdrh5]

Originally posted by TheRealDeal

I noticed people are disagreeing with Mr. Scot, which I do NOT, but they don't have any solid evidence to back it up, just saying that Vick is explosive, Vick is better than Atlanta, etc.

I think when you get past the "Ooooh...Ahhhhhh" of Vick you will see that Freeman is having a better year against better competition with far less weapons than Vick and is only getting better.

LOL. The Bucs have yet to beat a team with a winning record this season.

Edit: And Mike Williams and LeGarrett Blount are pretty good

[King Taharqa]

As a past winner of arguably the most prestigious individual honor in sports, Troy Smith has a Heisman Trophy vote due in a few weeks. So who's going to be on top of his ballot?

"Season's not over yet," he said Wednesday.

They're saying the same thing about the San Francisco 49ers.

All because of Smith.

Five games into the season, the 49ers were winless. Then they were 1-6 and in utter turmoil when coach Mike Singletary tabbed Smith, the No. 3 quarterback claimed off waivers from Baltimore in September, to take over for struggling former No. 1 overall pick Alex Smith (bypassing David Carr, another former No. 1 pick) in a desperate attempt to make something from a season that looked all but lost.

Now, two starts and two wins later, San Francisco (3-6) is just two games out of first place in the mediocre-at-best NFC West, heading into Sunday's home date against the Tampa Bay Buccaneers (6-3).

"It's important that you have a guy step in and provide credibility at that position, and I think that's the thing he's done," Singletary said of Smith. "It's not, 'Oh boy, we have to go through another quarterback here.' It's not like this guy can't make plays or make things happen. He can. He's stepped in and been able to rally the guys around him. They believe in him."

And now the 49ers, virtually unanimous preseason picks to run away with the water-downed West, believe anything is still possible this year.

"Troy brings a whole other factor to the offense," tight end Delanie Walker said.

Actually, he brings a whole other factor to the locker room.

Smith wasn't big enough and didn't have the arm to satisfy pro scouts following his All-America senior season at Ohio State. He was the ninth of 11 quarterbacks taken in the 2007 draft, going to the Ravens in the fifth round (the No. 174 overall pick). Smith became wildly popular in the Ravens' locker room, but was doomed to depth-chart purgatory when the club made Joe Flacco its first-round choice and franchise quarterback in '08 -- Flacco instantly led the team to the playoffs as a rookie starter.

Meanwhile, Smith started two games and threw just 48 passes in three Baltimore seasons, but swears he never grew impatient or lost faith.

"Obviously, I've been through a lot in these short years, but who's to say that what I've been through is any different than anybody else?" Smith said. "We all have adversity. We all have situations that we go through. You have to be able to maintain and have a positive outlook on life."

Which brings us to the 49ers of 2010.

The 0-5 start was the franchise's worst in 31 years. The Niners broke the drought with a feel-good defeat of cross-bay rival Oakland, but returned to rock bottom the following week by losing to the winless Panthers.

That's when Singletary benched his $50 million Smith (Alex) in favor of the minimum-salary version (Troy) for the team's trip to London to face the Denver Broncos.

The Niners won at Wembley, 24-16, and after a bye, went on the road -- behind Troy Smith, they fended off a charge by the Rams for a 23-20 victory last weekend, their third win in five games. Smith finished that one with a career-high 356 yards, a total that marked the most by a San Francisco quarterback in six years. He also became the first Niner since Jeff Garcia in '02 to post back-to-back passer ratings of 115 or better.

"I just think he's continued to work at getting his arms around the offense and fully understanding what we're striving to do," Singletary said. "He's just trying to find his place in it."

Evidently, he's closing in on that. The Niners averaged 312.6 yards before Smith took over and 380 with him in control. Against the Rams, five receivers accounted for at least 60 yards through the air. Garcia never did that. Neither did Joe Montana or Steve Young.

"He can juke people, break tackles, and then throw ball off his back foot 30-40 yards," Walker said. "That's going to keep defenses on their heels trying to blitz and leaving somebody wide open."

Buccaneers coach Raheem Morris, who has a pretty good young quarterback of his own in Josh Freeman, sees a little bigger picture with Smith than the physical attributes.

"He's got the 'it' factor," Morris said.

You hear about "it" a lot. There are bunches of quarterbacks with prototypical builds and arms, but only a few have the natural gift of being able to lead. Part of that, of course, is performing. The 6-foot, 217-pound Smith did it at every other level, including taking the Buckeyes to the BCS title game, and now he's doing it at the highest.

"Everybody is enamored with immeasureables. Everybody is enamored by size, strength and arm power, but he's got some of the things you can't account for," Morris said. "He may be shorter than most quarterbacks in this league, but he's not afraid to stand in there and deliver the ball with timely precision and is certainly able to run a football team and commands respect from other people. He does that for the 49ers, which is why they've taken to him."

It's why all their preseason goals are back in play.

"Whether it's a head coach, position coach or family member, the confidence [someone] shows you -- when they constantly are letting you know they trust in you and believe in you -- I think that works and does leaps and bounds for your psyche when stepping into a situation," Smith said. "Knowing that your peers and good friends, whoever, have your back through and through, as a man, that's really all you want. It's very, very uplifting."

Troy Smith has returned the favor by carrying his team back to relevance.

http://nfl.fanhouse.com/2010/11/17/troy-smith-rapidly-reviving-his-career-49ers-once-lost-season/

[King Taharqa]

With the 9ers stomping the Cards on MNF, Troy Smith is now 3-1 as the starting QB for San Fran. Wins came at a premium earlier in the season, but with Troy behind center the 9ers are still in the playoff hunt.