A good example of what's wrong with our offensive playcalling

[panthers55]

Neither were you, but when I see them throw a screen to Peppers side of the field and hear the HC admit that it was a "bad idea" it's clear to me that the coaching staff was not prepared to deal with it.

You're so ready to blame Clausen for everything, I don't care who makes that throw - it could have been a perfect throw and it wouldn't have mattered.

Let's forget about everything else and assume you are correct and Jimmy was given the green light to audible out of that play - consider the following scenario: You're Fox and you're standing there on the sideline. You have a headset, so you hear that a screen pass is called and you realize it's going to be thrown to Peppers side of the field. You start thinking to yourself: "Come on Jimmy, get out of that play, come on, come on Jimmy" as you listen to him going through his cadence. When you realize he's not going to check out of it or audible to something else, would you not call a timeout?

Better yet, when you gave Clausen the play - would you not remind Clausen over the headset to audible out of the play if Peppers lines up on the side of the field where the pass is going to be thrown?

First of all despite who was over there or not- Clausen threw the ball into Pepper's face mask and in self defense he put his hands out and the ball popped up in the air. Whose fault is that but Clausen's?? He could have lofted it over Pepper's head- novel concept or threw it into the ground. lets be real, it was on him whether it was a bad idea or not.

And now it is Fox's fault for not calling a timeout to keep Jimmy from screwing up?? If that were our strategy we would be out of timeouts by the end of the second series. Besides Fox is wasting all the timeouts on stupid challenges anyway.

Stop while you sound only halfway ridiculous.

[panthers55]

LOL, so it's "obvious" to you that it's Clausen's fault... but yet you tell me I couldn't possibly know who's fault it was because I wasn't at practice all week?

I guess the same "he shoudn't even be out there" argument would apply to Sanchez last year since they kept him on a very short leash (as they do more rookie QB's). I'd still take a rookie who is not allowed to audible over a veteran who throws an interception 1 out of every 10 passing attempts.

Who threw the ball right at Peppers?? Fox?? Davidson??? or Clausen??? Then whose fault was it that the execution was so poor??

As for Sanchez I have no idea whether he was allowed to audible or not. Just like I don't with Clausen. But if Clausen can, then he isn't. If he isn't allowed to, then he needs to learn the offense first. As for who you would have out there, Wow I would have never guessed. LOL

[CatMan72]

First of all despite who was over there or not- Clausen threw the ball into Pepper's face mask and in self defense he put his hands out and the ball popped up in the air. Whose fault is that but Clausen's?? He could have lofted it over Pepper's head- novel concept or threw it into the ground. lets be real, it was on him whether it was a bad idea or not.

And now it is Fox's fault for not calling a timeout to keep Jimmy from screwing up?? If that were our strategy we would be out of timeouts by the end of the second series. Besides Fox is wasting all the timeouts on stupid challenges anyway.

Stop while you sound only halfway ridiculous.

So it would have been better for Clausen to "loft" a screen pass? LOL!

If you're going to loft a screen pass you might as well just hand the ball to a defender and watch him run it into the end zone. It's easy for you to sit there and talk about what Clausen should have done, go back and watch how fast that play happens. Schwartz totally missed his block, which cleared the way for Peppers to blow that play up, where's the blame for Schwartz? (oh wait, I forgot everthing is Clausen's fault).

It doesn't matter where Clausen threw the ball, the play was doomed from the moment it was called... Peppers has made a living out of blowing up screen passes.

Fox has been an NFL coach for more years than Clausen has been on this earth and Fox knows what Peppers does to screen passes thrown his way, so yes - I expect Fox to protect his rookie QB from that kind of play by calling a timeout. Rookie QB's screw up, coaches are supposed to prevent them from screwing up when they can.

If Fox could prevent Moore from throwing into triple coverage then I would expect him to do that as well...

[Davidson Deac II]

Re-read my post, our coaching staff knows that throwing a screen to Peppers side of the field is suicide and yet we do it anyways and get the result we expected...

Considering that Peppers changes the side of the field that he lines up on, I don't see how the coaching staff could decide to run a play on the side of the field he is on. They don't know which side he will be on. The only way to avoid a screen on his side of the field is either to allow the qb to decide which side he will run it to when he approaches the line of scrimage, or not run screens at all.

[CatMan72]

Considering that Peppers changes the side of the field that he lines up on, I don't see how the coaching staff could decide to run a play on the side of the field he is on. They don't which side he will be on.

Re-read my post... they like to use screen passes and they knew they would be facing Peppers who is extremely good at making plays on screen passes thrown his way, so they should have spent some time preparing to audible the screen to the other side of the field if Peppers decided to line up on the side of the field where they originally planned to throw it, or they should have been prepared to check out of the screen all together.

I don't know if Clausen was given the authority to audible out of the play or not, maybe he should have anyways... but if I was coach Fox standing there on the sideline watching my rookie QB preparing to throw a screen to Peppers side of the field, I would have called a timeout.

[Davidson Deac II]

Re-read my post... they like to use screen passes and they knew they would be facing Peppers who is extremely good at making plays on screen passes thrown his way, so they should have spent some time preparing to audible the screen to the other side of the field if Peppers decided to line up on the side of the field where they originally planned to throw it, or they should have been prepared to check out of the screen all together.

I don't know if Clausen was given the authority to audible out of the play or not, maybe he should have anyways... but if I was coach Fox standing there on the sideline watching my rookie QB preparing to throw a screen to Peppers side of the field, I would have called a timeout.

I reread it, still don't agree. I think you are expecting Fox to work miracles with a rookie QB. If there is flexibility built into the screen pass (and you and I don't know if there is) then the fault lies on Clausen for not recognizing the defensive lineup. Maybe he should have called a timeout, but there was no way to predict an interception on that play, and calling a timeout to stop an incomplete pass or a loss would have been a waste of a timeout.

But the way the play worked out, the side of the field was irrelevant. Clausen threw the ball so low that you or I could have blocked it. It went just above Peppers shoulder. Blocking the pass was no great play on Peppers part, but the interception was.

[panthers55]

I reread it, still don't agree. I think you are expecting Fox to work miracles with a rookie QB. If there is flexibility built into the screen pass (and you and I don't know if there is) then the fault lies on Clausen for not recognizing the defensive lineup. Maybe he should have called a timeout, but there was no way to predict an interception on that play, and calling a timeout to stop an incomplete pass or a loss would have been a waste of a timeout.

But the way the play worked out, the side of the field was irrelevant. Clausen threw the ball so low that you or I could have blocked it. It went just above Peppers shoulder. Blocking the pass was no great play on Peppers part, but the interception was.

Exactly. It was on Clausen to either make a play or at best throw the ball away if he didn't have anyone open or a good passing lane. Problem for Catman is that he can't ever recognize that Clausen is at fault and has to blame everyone else. I doubt he will change but good luck.

[panthers55]

So it would have been better for Clausen to "loft" a screen pass? LOL!

If you're going to loft a screen pass you might as well just hand the ball to a defender and watch him run it into the end zone. It's easy for you to sit there and talk about what Clausen should have done, go back and watch how fast that play happens. Schwartz totally missed his block, which cleared the way for Peppers to blow that play up, where's the blame for Schwartz? (oh wait, I forgot everthing is Clausen's fault).

It doesn't matter where Clausen threw the ball, the play was doomed from the moment it was called... Peppers has made a living out of blowing up screen passes.

Fox has been an NFL coach for more years than Clausen has been on this earth and Fox knows what Peppers does to screen passes thrown his way, so yes - I expect Fox to protect his rookie QB from that kind of play by calling a timeout. Rookie QB's screw up, coaches are supposed to prevent them from screwing up when they can.

If Fox could prevent Moore from throwing into triple coverage then I would expect him to do that as well...

You obviously know nothing about football or you would clearly know that of course you loft a screen pass. You draw all the linemen in trying to sack the quarterback and you throw the ball over their head to the running back who is wide open with blockers in front. Sure it is great to find a lane and toss it straight but with 2 or 3 6'6" 330 guys bearing down on you, you toss it over their heads.

And on a screen pass you purposely let the linemen come in unblocked so he thinks he has a clear lane to the quarterback. So of course Schwartz let him in unblocked while he went outside to set up the blocking on the screen.

And now Fox should call a timeout to keep Clausen from throwing into triple coverage?????????

I told you to stop before you looked ridiculous but you never listen. Now everyone knows you don't have a clue.

[chbright]

assuming we had as many timeouts as we wanted, calling a timeout before every panthers offensive play bound for a screw up isnt possible, if it was, we would never run a play.

[monstercat]

Whats wrong with our play calling?

We can't pass the football. Doesn't matter what pass play we call, we can't do it. Until we can do it, doesn't really matter what play we call.

That's pretty much it right there. If everybody would step back and look at the big picture, they would see that all 32 have pretty much the same plays in their offense. The only real difference is what they emphasize and what they call in certain situations. For instance, the dreaded draw on third and long is pretty much a staple across the league, yet most Panthers fans seem to think that Fox is the only coach who does it, especially when it doesn't work.

Execution is always the number 1 thing, regardless of what style of offense you play.

[CatMan72]

You obviously know nothing about football or you would clearly know that of course you loft a screen pass. You draw all the linemen in trying to sack the quarterback and you throw the ball over their head to the running back who is wide open with blockers in front. Sure it is great to find a lane and toss it straight but with 2 or 3 6'6" 330 guys bearing down on you, you toss it over their heads.

And on a screen pass you purposely let the linemen come in unblocked so he thinks he has a clear lane to the quarterback. So of course Schwartz let him in unblocked while he went outside to set up the blocking on the screen.

And now Fox should call a timeout to keep Clausen from throwing into triple coverage?????????

I told you to stop before you looked ridiculous but you never listen. Now everyone knows you don't have a clue.

I know plenty about football P55, and lofting a bubble screen pass high enough to clear a un-blocked 6'7" athletic freak like Peppers would most certainly result in something bad.

There are all kinds of screen passes, but you've clearly demonstrated that you don't understand that because you're talking about a "slow screen" while the play we're discussing is known as a "bubble screen"... and you NEVER loft a bubble screen pass unless you A) want to get your receiver killed want to give the defense 6 points or C) all of the above.

In either screen play, Schwartz's job was to chop Peppers so Peppers couldn't get his hands up in the air and do what he did... Schwartz failed miserably at that block and Peppers made the play we all expected him to make under those conditions.

You also suffer from poor reading comprehension... I said I WISH Fox could call a timeout to prevent MOORE from throwing into triple coverage like he could have called a timeout to prevent Clausen from throwing a bubble screen to the side of the field Peppers was on.

But by all means, keep acting like you know what you're talking about and I'll keep correcting you.

[CatMan72]

I reread it, still don't agree. I think you are expecting Fox to work miracles with a rookie QB. If there is flexibility built into the screen pass (and you and I don't know if there is) then the fault lies on Clausen for not recognizing the defensive lineup. Maybe he should have called a timeout, but there was no way to predict an interception on that play, and calling a timeout to stop an incomplete pass or a loss would have been a waste of a timeout.

But the way the play worked out, the side of the field was irrelevant. Clausen threw the ball so low that you or I could have blocked it. It went just above Peppers shoulder. Blocking the pass was no great play on Peppers part, but the interception was.

I'm not expecting a miracle, I'm expecting coach Fox to protect his rookie QB from making mistakes when he can.

Fox knows that throwing a screen pass towards Peppers is a bad idea, he's got a timeout in his pocket and he can see that Jimmy is not getting out of that play (because he's a rookie and rookies do stupid stuff) so why not use a timeout to prevent Jimmy from making an obvious mistake?

I'm not arguing whether or not Jimmy should have recognized it was a bad idea, he should have - but he didn't and he paid for it. I'm just not sure why our coaching staff stood around with their thumb in their ass while he did it?

[panthers55]

I know plenty about football P55, and lofting a bubble screen pass high enough to clear a un-blocked 6'7" athletic freak like Peppers would most certainly result in something bad.

There are all kinds of screen passes, but you've clearly demonstrated that you don't understand that because you're talking about a "slow screen" while the play we're discussing is known as a "bubble screen"... and you NEVER loft a bubble screen pass unless you A) want to get your receiver killed want to give the defense 6 points or C) all of the above.

In either screen play, Schwartz's job was to chop Peppers so Peppers couldn't get his hands up in the air and do what he did... Schwartz failed miserably at that block and Peppers made the play we all expected him to make under those conditions.

You also suffer from poor reading comprehension... I said I WISH Fox could call a timeout to prevent MOORE from throwing into triple coverage like he could have called a timeout to prevent Clausen from throwing a bubble screen to the side of the field Peppers was on.

But by all means, keep acting like you know what you're talking about and I'll keep correcting you.

Look at the video I included, all Clausen had to do was throw it over pepper's head and the receiver was all by himself. Now the truth is that most bubble screens use more than one receiver blocker the best is with 3 wideouts and a TE that scrapes over to help blocking. It would not have gotten him killed to toss it out there. As I said a straight pass is preferred but if there is a 300 pound 6' 6" DE bearing down you either throw it over his head or toss it out of bounds or on the ground. As for blocking Pepper's Schwartz was fine. He went to cut him and Peppers made a wide move and instead of stepping up and finding an easy passing lane Clausen threw it anyway while backpedaling. If Clausen hadn't gotten a bunch of passes blocked before you might have a case but he throws everything low.

Truth is that the blocking wasn't that good (what's new) and he wouldn't have made many yards but it is sually designed for 3-5 yard gains anyway.

[CatMan72]

Look at the video I included, all Clausen had to do was throw it over pepper's head and the receiver was all by himself. Now the truth is that most bubble screens use more than one receiver blocker the best is with 3 wideouts and a TE that scrapes over to help blocking. It would not have gotten him killed to toss it out there. As I said a straight pass is preferred but if there is a 300 pound 6' 6" DE bearing down you either throw it over his head or toss it out of bounds or on the ground. As for blocking Pepper's Schwartz was fine. He went to cut him and Peppers made a wide move and instead of stepping up and finding an easy passing lane Clausen threw it anyway while backpedaling. If Clausen hadn't gotten a bunch of passes blocked before you might have a case but he throws everything low.

Truth is that the blocking wasn't that good (what's new) and he wouldn't have made many yards but it is sually designed for 3-5 yard gains anyway.

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