The better question: How can anyone justify Clausen over Moore?

[PantherFanForLife]

We were still in that Bears game all the way to the 4th quarter. They got 2 TD's mainly on bad special teams and one bad defensive play. After that they didn't move and our defense got us the ball back 4 TIMES off pics. Plenty of opportunities there. We were in the Saints game all the way to the end. And no reason why we should have not won that Bengals game, other than a 0.0 QB rating in the first half. Jimmy cost us that game just as much as Moore cost us the first game of the season. Only difference is it wasn't because of what he did, like Moore throwing pics in the endzone, but rather what he didn't do.

[mav1234]

I don't think it changed. I KNOW it changed. I saw it change every week. Didn't you? One week we are passing on 1st and goal. The next we're running. One week we are going for it on 4th down the next we let time run out when we are down before half. One week we hand it off to our running backs, the next we are using AE in wildcat position. Again, 0 consitency. Every game this year has been one experiment after another.

Uhh. I don't consider those changes in game plans, but changes in play calling based on circumstance... maybe just me.

I would say last week we did have a wrinkle in the game plan since AE got activated, that's true. We may see more of it even. But that has nothing to do with Moore not having time to practice with his receivers.

[mav1234]

We were still in that Bears game all the way to the 4th quarter. We were in the Saints game all the way to the end. And no reason why we should have not won that Bengals game, other than a 0.0 QB rating in the first half. Jimmy cost us that game just as much as Moore cost us the first game of the season.

We were in every game of the season into the 4th quarter... We've been within two scores of every game this year going into the 4th quarter.

If we're laying blame on QBs costing us games, Moore cost us games 1 & 2; Jimmy cost us games 3 & 5; yipee.

[PantherFanForLife]

We were in every game of the season into the 4th quarter... We've been within two scores of every game this year going into the 4th quarter.

If we're laying blame on QBs costing us games, Moore cost us games 1 & 2; Jimmy cost us games 3 & 5; yipee.

And that's my point. Except that I don't believe Matt would have continued to cost us games in the same fashion 5 games in a row had he continued to be our starter. We had some close games, and game 3 and 5 could have been the difference between having a first half of 0.0 and 6.2 passer rating respectively, and even a half ass rating like 35.0 which is the least you could give Matt credit for even if you think he sucks. He's never sucked THAT bad.

[koolkatluke]

We were in every game of the season into the 4th quarter... We've been within two scores of every game this year going into the 4th quarter.

If we're laying blame on QBs costing us games, Moore cost us games 1 & 2; Jimmy cost us games 3 & 5; yipee.

And again the Rookie is even with the 4 YEAR PRO!!!!!

[mav1234]

And that's my point. Except that I don't believe Matt would have continued to cost us games in the same fashion 5 games in a row had he continued to be our starter. We had some close games, and game 3 and 5 could have been the difference between having a first half of 0.0 and 6.2 passer rating respectively, and even a half ass rating like 35.0 which is the least you could give Matt credit for even if you think he sucks. He's never sucked THAT bad.

That's all speculation. Both you and I are doing it. I saw a QB who cost us two games; you see a QB who cost us two games. We just see two different QBs.

I don't honestly believe a passer rating of 35 would have mattered at all, but you're free to disagree... if he couldn't score on the Bucs, he's not scoring on the Bengals or Bears. So meh. I think it's a wash.

We'll see how it plays out. I'm going to bed.

[koolkatluke]

And that's my point. Except that I don't believe Matt would have continued to cost us games in the same fashion 5 games in a row had he continued to be our starter. We had some close games, and game 3 and 5 could have been the difference between having a first half of 0.0 and 6.2 passer rating respectively, and even a half ass rating like 35.0 which is the least you could give Matt credit for even if you think he sucks. He's never sucked THAT bad.

How do you know he played against worst teams then Jimmy in better situation.

[PantherFanForLife]

And again the Rookie is even with the 4 YEAR PRO!!!!!

LOL. Keep thinking that. Jimmy's nowhere near even with Matt.

You know I'm about to go to bed, but seriously some of you guys are so stubborn, I have a feeling you are not going to like what's going to happen in 3 weeks if Clausen doesn't improve.

Actually, to my personal dismay Fox may not even wait that long. He may just consider Jimmy's performance enough already to know he needs to go back to the guy that might give us a shot to win at least one game this year after the by week. May happen as early as tomorrow.

I feel bad for the kid. But it's for his best. Leaving him in there will just ruin him though I think it's just as bad to do this to our QB's. It's going to be ugly this year.

[PantherFanForLife]

How do you know he played against worst teams then Jimmy in better situation.

Worse teams on that particular game day. Tampa and the Giants played better than the Bears and the Bengals even if it their records or pedigree showed otherwise prior to those games. And he was NOT in a better situation than Jimmy. Sorry but that's bolony.

Matt got the opening day game with this team. I mean come on....heeeelllloooooo!

[koolkatluke]

LOL. Keep thinking that. Jimmy's nowhere near even with Matt.

You know I'm about to go to bed, but seriously some of you guys are so stubborn, I have a feeling you are not going to like what's going to happen in 3 weeks if Clausen doesn't improve.

Actually, to my personal dismay Fox may not even wait that long. He may just consider Jimmy's performance enough already to know he needs to go back to the guy that might give us a shot to win at least one game this year after the by week. May happen as early as tomorrow.

I feel bad for the kid. But it's for his best. Leaving him in there will just ruin him though I think it's just as bad to do this to our QB's. It's going to be ugly this year.

I don't think it matters anymore. Matt probely won't be here after his contract is up so why play him. To showcase him for a new job. Realisticly if your not going too the playoffs with Matt as your starter their is no reason he should be the starter. We now need too stop being player's fan and be the teams fans. What's better for the team is putting jimmy in the frying pan and finding out what you have in him.

[CRA]

I don't think it matters anymore. Matt probely won't be here after his contract is up so why play him. To showcase him for a new job. Realisticly if your not going too the playoffs with Matt as your starter their is no reason he should be the starter. We now need too stop being player's fan and be the teams fans. What's better for the team is putting jimmy in the frying pan and finding out what you have in him.

well again, putting Jimmy out there before he is ready hurts him and his development. Jimmy doesn't have basics down.....basics down in this offense and basics w/ his game.

[Carl Spackler]

He's not going to learn on the bench, clearly Moore didn't learn anything in training camp either, again for the thousandth time, I'm being told not to judge MM on his 2 bad games but am expected to be subjected to judging JC in his 3 game career. Some of the people in this thread, if they lived in Dallas in '89 probably said "I want Danny White! Troy Aikman will NEVER lead this team to victory..."

Give Clausen 8 games, that's what I want. If he's not improved by then, OK. But if he has improved and the team around him sucks, I don't want to hear the "I never saw improvement" and people just ignoring the good and only taking the bad, as I have been accused of the opposite. Whatever. We'll see against SF and try to go from there.

[PantherFanForLife]

He's not going to learn on the bench, clearly Moore didn't learn anything in training camp either, again for the thousandth time, I'm being told not to judge MM on his 2 bad games but am expected to be subjected to judging JC in his 3 game career. Some of the people in this thread, if they lived in Dallas in '89 probably said "I want Danny White! Troy Aikman will NEVER lead this team to victory..."

Give Clausen 8 games, that's what I want. If he's not improved by then, OK. But if he has improved and the team around him sucks, I don't want to hear the "I never saw improvement" and people just ignoring the good and only taking the bad, as I have been accused of the opposite. Whatever. We'll see against SF and try to go from there.

No one is subjecting you to judge Jimmy based on 3 games but at the same time, if you don't like that, realize that you do the same thing when you use Matt's 2 games from this year to pass judgement on him as a player. I'm simply stating the ones doing that are talking like that to prove how bad Matt is are talking out of their ass and they should take the time to get educated by actually looking at hard facts. Jimmy is far away from accomplising even a small part of what Matt has already done with this team, unless you consider a 3 game losing streak an accomplishment.

The other main difference between the two is that the only reason Matt got to play 10 games as a starter with this team, and the only reason he started this year is because he performed well enough in his first 8 to earn himself that opportunity. He's won 6 of those 8(that's 75%) and had a 96.7% rating in those 8 starts. That's hardly the case for Clausen and everyone and their mother can see he got it thanks to Matt having 2 bad games and his popularity. He didn't even earn that in practice or pre-season.

Now I'm not expecting Jimmy to come out and do the same, however, he sure as hell has not proven so far in his first 3 games that he should get 5 more either. I'm all for continuing to give him a look over a couple of more games, but if he continues to play at this level, there is no reason we shouldn't bench him and give someone else a shot to be reviewed.

As far as not learning on the bench, that's nonsense. Matt has learned at least the basics over the years such as how not to drop snaps, how to find Smith, how to manage the clock. Sitting on the bench for some time before he gets to start would only benefit Jimmy, because the only way he could have been judged fairly as a rookie starter is if he perfomed exceptionally well. That not being the case, it's a waste of opportunity for this team to use the games they still have on people that are at least starter-ready or give some others an opportunity to show that they are.

Him playing right now, and us losing in this fashion week after week is hardly a learning experience. You don't learn anything in this way, other than bad habits. He's only learning what NOT to do. Which is not the point. He would have learned something if he was surrounded by a group of vets. He would have at least known what he needed to do to fall in with the rest of the group. As bad and green as this team is, you need either vet receivers that can get open for a rookie QB or a QB that at least knows the basiscs enough to train rookie receivers. Rookie QB + rookie receivers = waste of time and counter-productive to their learning experience when they are playing against veteran defenses that don't give them any chances to execute anything close to how it was designed in the playbook or in practice.

PS: And the worst part of that? We get to watch it on Sunday. If I wanted to see this type of performance I'd attend public practice sessions.

[koolkatluke]

well again, putting Jimmy out there before he is ready hurts him and his development. Jimmy doesn't have basics down.....basics down in this offense and basics w/ his game.

Again you learn the basics by playing in real game speed. You can't get use to reading def. and audibles on the bench. You don't develop a better passing motion or how to locate passing lanes on the bench.

Peyton had too take his lumps. Aikman had too take his lumps. Mark Sanchez had too take his lumps. You develop by playing on the field during real games against real game speed.

If you get damage by doing somthing you weren't meant too do it.

If a QB crumbles under the pressure during these situation while developing his craft he wasn't meant too be a starting QB. We have a chance too really improve ourselves with a top 3 pick we have too find out if we need a QB of the future (in one of the best QB drafts in year) or if he is already on the roster.